[shaffe]

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

It's all a balancing act..

Yep, finding the right balance is key. Remains to be seen but on paper should make the A10 PP GT pretty formidable in the straights

Originally Posted by IOMike

Last gen the LS3 was only available in the manual, auto's got less power. The manual Camaro's were not much slower than the manual Mustangs, there was a much bigger difference in the auto's.

Also the last gen Camaro weighed what, 200 or 250lbs more. This gen the Mustang is down on torque and up on weight.

I certainly don't see any evidence of the GT one upping the SS, more like coming up to the same level, handling improvements remain to be seen.

I don't think anyone is saying that the A10 Mustang will now walk away from Camaro's, I think most are saying now they should be pretty damn close in a straight line.

Handling I think the Mustang will close the gap, but I still expect the Camaro to remain ahead in that department.

[SuperSound]

Originally Posted by lt4camaro

Look what the 10 speed did for the ZL1, great trans and much better than the 8 speed. That 10 speed was co-developed with Ford and ford puts it in the GT mustang along with much better tires , trick shocks for weight transfer. Add in the 25 hp increase, watch out Camaro. Camaro needs the ZL1 10 speed and the Michelin pilot 4S tire's like the mustang GT will now have to stay out front.

What exactly did the 10 speed do for the ZL1? As I recall its only major improvement is on the track not the strip. For example the ZO6 with A8 ran 11.2@127mph in MT hands. The ZL1 with A10 ran 11.5@125mph. That's exactly the difference you would expect for an almost 400lbs difference. So it didn't make the ZL1 perform more than the raw numbers suggest. Now if they had thrown a 3.XX axle ratio at it, that would be another story.

A6 to A10 is a huge jump in gearing. A8 to A10 is not though. So don't think the Camaro jumping to an A10 next year is going to make a real difference(likely only in MPG). A little power bump and the A10 with some more aggressive axle ratio, now that would put some hurt on.


*Edit: WTH happened to Mustang Fanboy? He's been suspended for what?

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by devnull

100% agree... love the GT PP. I'm hoping the 18 closes the gap, but don't think it will come close to a 1LE in performance.

You owe me a test drive on a 2SS 1LE dammit

I don't think the GT PP will close the gap on the 1LE, the GTPP2 might but that remains to be seen what actually that will include

[Spartan268]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Mustang owners have like 10 different definitions for the word "stock"...so they are all "stock" something, as long as they keep the second part of it out. I've seen more stock cars with forced induction or cams or full bolt-ons in Mustang world than on any other car. Come to think of it, in years and years of racing I have only ever seen one stock GT at a track other then mine.

This reminds me of my friend. He goes off saying he has a 'stock' mistake. But then just a day earlier when he put his Borla Atak in, he started claiming he's already making an extra 15HP to the wheels. But after I beat him all of a sudden it's stock lol. And then he claims I 'bought' more power with the options on it cause it's a 2SS. He still doesn't understand the 1SS is no different than the 2SS, if anything the 2SS would be slower with the extra options/weight. But anyways. Nice to see how this will pan out.

[ron scubadiver]

If you want the same level of equipment on a GT as an SS, the two are now at the same price level. If you want a big motor in a bare car, the Mustang is less costly.

Camaro is likely to have a 10 speed auto in the SS by 2010. For "political" reasons the HP rating on the SS can't go up until it does on the Vette.

I am waiting to see what kind of dyno numbers the dual injection 5.0 puts out. My money says it will not be as high as the SS

[crysalis_01]

Originally Posted by shaffe

I don't think the GT PP will close the gap on the 1LE, the GTPP2 might but that remains to be seen what actually that will include

It'll be interesting to see what PP2 brings to the table. Unfortunately, we'll have to wait a minute to find out.

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/2017/...mance-package/

[Emoto]

Originally Posted by ron scubadiver

If you want the same level of equipment on a GT as an SS, the two are now at the same price level. If you want a big motor in a bare car, the Mustang is less costly.

Camaro is likely to have a 10 speed auto in the SS by 2010. For "political" reasons the HP rating on the SS can't go up until it does on the Vette.

I am waiting to see what kind of dyno numbers the dual injection 5.0 puts out. My money says it will not be as high as the SS

I just went on the configurator(?) page for the 2018 Mustang and tried to equip one as close my my 2016 2SS (although now that I think of it I did NOT notice a sunroof option) and it came out at a sticker of $52,265, whereas my Camaro had a sticker of $48xxx. Now, of course the equipment was not 100% the same, but still.

Am I the only one who came out with the Mustang MORE expensive when comparably equipped?

[drew peacock]

brand new models are always more expensive..same with phones and tv's ect
give it a year and they will be giving the things away once people realise the truth

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by crysalis_01

It'll be interesting to see what PP2 brings to the table. Unfortunately, we'll have to wait a minute to find out.

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/2017/...mance-package/

Yep, and I should have worded that different. I expect the GT PP to be more competitive, but still fully expect 1LE to be better around the twisties

Originally Posted by Emoto

I just went on the configurator(?) page for the 2018 Mustang and tried to equip one as close my my 2016 2SS (although now that I think of it I did NOT notice a sunroof option) and it came out at a sticker of $52,265, whereas my Camaro had a sticker of $48xxx. Now, of course the equipment was not 100% the same, but still.

Am I the only one who came out with the Mustang MORE expensive when comparably equipped?

When I made them similarly equipped the mustang was about 700 bucks more, in top trim.

Base trim, with options I would personally want, the Mustang was about 3K More than the Camaro. If I drop the 301A package then the Mustang is about 700 cheaper. But yeah the price advantage Mustang had is gone.

[ChefBorOzzy]

The Mustang is definitely more expensive when similarly equipped.

[MrNoMercy5000]

From what I've seen the refresh looks like Ford's attempt to make the Mustang more like the Camaro. I had a 2015 S550 and really liked the looks. Now they've went and changed it and while I think it's "okay" I'm not impressed. They will have to make some serious quality upgrades to do better than the 2SS I have now. The seats I had in the 15 GT premium were nowhere near the quality of the 2SS seats. I actually liked the seats in the S197 I had better. I will admit the Safe & Smart package is very nice to have. One thing I can't believe they haven't added is the full glass roof like the S197 had. It was a really cool thing to have and they took it away from the S550. As for a moonroof.. Have Mustangs ever had a moonroof?

As for the bench racing, It looks like Ford is putting a lot of hope in this A10 transmission. 5 more hp means almost nothing and the lack of torque will matter more. Like some have pointed out though, it will all come down to how that torque is managed. I tend to agree with those that have said this will be a mid to high 12 second Mustang unless the track is prepped with unicorn tears. I also think that if Ford had been putting down 1/4 mile times that beat the SS they would have published that info as well. For the last few years Ford has been focused more on handling than straight line performance and they will have no issues selling a mid to high 12 second car.

Any bets on how long American Muscle will take to build a 10 second 2018 GT?

[Mikey LikesIt]

Funny seeing the Mustang boys get excited about a sub 4 second 0-60 claim. The same guys were saying performance doesn't matter a few weeks ago. Funny to see the price increase. You want to have all the bells and whistles like a Camaro then you're paying a similar price.

I hope the Mustang is quick as Ford says but I'm sure the Camaro will still have the edge.

And what is Mustang troll boy trying to accomplish here?

[formoutofchaos]

I personally think Ford and GM both do this on purpose, they let camaro lead for half of the gen cycle then ford makes changes and equals or leads, so they both get peak sales for the number crunchers. Than the GT500 will come up take the crown than chevy will counter and lead. I think they both want each other to do well why else would they co develop the 10 speed

[Marty McFlew]

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

Good numbers.

2018 Mustang GT:
460 horsepower / 420 lb-ft torque
0-60 mph in under 4-seconds (with 10-speed auto and drag strip mode)

http://www.autoblog.com/2017/07/24/2...han-camaro-ss/

Pricing:

$25,585 EcoBoost Fastback
$30,600 EcoBoost Premium Fastback
$31,085 EcoBoost Convertible
$36,100 EcoBoost Premium Convertible
$35,095 GT Fastback
$39,995 GT Premium Fastback
$44,595 GT Premium Convertible
$57,145 GT350
$64,645 GT350R

Mustang on Parr with Camaro pricing now. Now its war on 2 fronts. Pricing and performance.