[KirkH]

It is inevitable that fossil fuel will go away. However, there’s a giant ball of free energy in the sky just waiting to be used. As soon as we figure out a way to store it.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by KirkH

It is inevitable that fossil fuel will go away. However, there’s a giant ball of free energy in the sky just waiting to be used. As soon as we figure out a way to store it.

There are already companies that store energy collected by solar farms into "expired" batteries from electric vehicles. Today's electric vehicle do not use all of their capacity or capability. They have built in "safety" capacity. When they are no longer suitable for automotive use, many are redeployed to solar farms and wind farms where they are perfectly suited for collection and storage of energy collected by solar panels and windmills.

[Raven87]

Horse enthusiast circa late 1890's - "These stupid new-fangled automobiles with that loud motor will never replace the horse! A horse is cheaper, more fun to ride, and easier to get around on! Those noisy cars are way too expensive, can't go as far as I can go on my horse or even in my buggy behind my horses, and they are actually very bland! And only one color? No way!"

Automotive enthusiast in late '90's - "These stupid electric cars will never be popular or offer a tenth of performance my V8 does!"

Automotive enthusiast today - "They will never get rid of the fossil fueled vehicles - there are too many of them and they are cheaper and offer more fun to drive! And electric vehicles are too expensive, have less range, and are bland driving experiences!"

See where this is heading?

[Mr. Meh]

Glad to see someone else brought up the old horse owners talking about those stupid new automocar widgets and how they can't replace all the feels of horse ownership.

[90503]

[QUOTE=Raven87;9928524]Horse enthusiast circa late 1890's - "These stupid new-fangled automobiles with that loud motor will never replace the horse! A horse is cheaper, more fun to ride, and easier to get around on! Those noisy cars are way too expensive, can't go as far as I can go on my horse or even in my buggy behind my horses, and they are actually very bland! And only one color? No way!"

Automotive enthusiast in late '90's - "These stupid electric cars will never be popular or offer a tenth of performance my V8 does!"

Automotive enthusiast today - "They will never get rid of the fossil fueled vehicles - there are too many of them and they are cheaper and offer more fun to drive! And electric vehicles are too expensive, have less range, and are bland driving experiences!"

See where this is heading?[/QUOTE]

Yeah, It's heading back to the horse. Electric vehicles are more like the horse. Only good for around town, not long trips and you have to bring them to a stop everyday so they can rest and get fed. And their years of usefulness are low as well. Good point.

The horse would actually be a better replacement for fossil fuel engines. They are closer to the ideal goal of the EV.

[F1FTY]

Random forecasting reading the tea leaves and having worked at this at a competing OEM to Martin's: I think we'll be seeing different technologies designed for the use of the vehicle.

Toyota published their plans a couple years back which showed a mixture of HEV, PHEV, BEV vehicles depending on customer application.

I think we'll see a HEV or PHEV Camaro V8 someday soon, because it provides the flexibility that ICE provides over electric (range, track use) with better emissions. PHEV currently doesn't provide much of an advantage for the cost increase over a HEV, but maybe that changes with tech improvements. (ehh doubt it)

BEV will be the majority of cars as we move forward and battery technology improves. I would be surprised if we didn't see gas stations become charging stations, charge-ups accomplished in under 10 minutes and average range at 400 miles within a couple decades or sooner.

That would help solve the infrastructure issues with lack of charging options available at homes while not relying on the consumer to change their habits and routines.

[Raven87]

Originally Posted by 90503

Yeah, It's heading back to the horse. Electric vehicles are more like the horse. Only good for around town, not long trips and you have to bring them to a stop everyday so they can rest and get fed. And their years of usefulness are low as well. Good point.

The horse would actually be a better replacement for fossil fuel engines. They are closer to the ideal goal of the EV.

Well, that is true to an extent - today.

But like the old cowboy watching a new autocar putt-putt past him back 1900, he had no way of knowing what that vehicle would become.

And I am 100% sure the same is true of the electric vehicles we are looking at today. In another generation's time, I have no doubt that people driving vehicles with a roaring V8 will probably only be seen at 'classic car shows' and about as rare as us seeing a cowboy riding down main street USA today on his beloved Palomino.

Technology has a way of doing that it seems. There were people who pooh-poohed the thought of flight too... or, going into space, etc.

No matter how much we as humans with feelings and emotions may want to resist change, it still happens.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by dpevans

Thank the federal government for their interference. By 2025 car emission have to make cuts that equal 55mpg and the only way to get that is to sell a majority of electric cars. I believe Volvo is already becoming all electric. UK standards are all electric by 2040.

Interesting that you think the US Federal Government is the culprit here. The US is actually moving SLOWER than most other 1st world nations on this, due in large part to foot dragging on the part of the US federal agencies. China (the world's largest auto market) has been on the electric path for a decade. Europe, led by Scandinavia (thus, Volvo), Germany, and the UK is a huge driving force, no pun intended, and Japan is on their own path towards hydrogen fuel cell. Only the US, Middle East (where oil lives) and South America (irrelevant due to cost issues) are lagging in the move towards electrification.

Now, having said that, slower is probably better, despite the reasons for being slower. Avoid the radical change of the 1970's when the answer was to depower engines and slam a foot and a half off of the average car without facilitating proper development and improvement first.

[fastball]

Originally Posted by 90503

The horse would actually be a better replacement for fossil fuel engines. They are closer to the ideal goal of the EV.

But then the tree huggers would be complaining about the CO2 emissions from your horse, especially if you feed him a diet high in fiber.

[TunaMelt]

Originally Posted by 90503

The "range" of electric cars is a joke....It's the opposite of gas cars....That is, gas cars go farther on the highways with their best mileage, and bad mpg around town...

Electric cars are the opposite...At highway speeds they lose their juice quicker and the highly touted several hundred mile "range" is only at slow speeds around town.

"Range anxiety" applies to long trips at highway speeds, not a total of low-speed urban miles...

I wish the electric cars would be more truthful about this....Instead all they show is a total range, but they should break it down into highway/city like gas cars do.

This is simply not true. The advertised range is a combination of driving that you'd expect. Stay at 65 or under and you'll get it. I do 80 both ways to work and average about 28-29 range in my volt with an advertised 35. You know what other car gets worse economy than advertised when going above 65? Every other vehicle I've owned. Around town I've surpassed 50 miles of range during a vacation week. You're correct in saying the slow speed is superior in an EV but to say they're a joke on the highway is false.

[90503]

Originally Posted by TunaMelt

This is simply not true. The advertised range is a combination of driving that you'd expect. Stay at 65 or under and you'll get it. I do 80 both ways to work and average about 28-29 range in my volt with an advertised 35. You know what other car gets worse economy than advertised when going above 65? Every other vehicle I've owned. Around town I've surpassed 50 miles of range during a vacation week. You're correct in saying the slow speed is superior in an EV but to say they're a joke on the highway is false.

Isn't the Volt a hybrid?...It recharges as you drive?....Uses a gas engine when the battery is low?...I'm referring to vehicles that are all electric, that need to be recharged/plugged in, and drain very quickly at higher speed making them less practical for long trips.

[Factorypilot]

Originally Posted by 90503

Yeah, It's heading back to the horse. Electric vehicles are more like the horse. Only good for around town, not long trips and you have to bring them to a stop everyday so they can rest and get fed. And their years of usefulness are low as well. Good point.

The horse would actually be a better replacement for fossil fuel engines. They are closer to the ideal goal of the EV.

LOL. Yeah but you're forgetting that a horse farts and emits dangerous CO2 gasses as they breathe (wait - omg so do we!).

Well in that case if we would all just get off the planet, the planet would be much better off. Case closed.

[trboxman]

Originally Posted by Marty McFlew

If this country was really truly serious about pollution then they would stop with cutting down all the trees and replacing them with concrete slabs, houses, malls, office buildings etc. Lack of trees is worst on combating pollution than what cars put out. Not to mention the constant displacement of wildlife habitats. Politicians are FOS.

There are more trees in the US today than there were in 1900.

[Chadicus]

Originally Posted by trboxman

There are more trees in the US today than there were in 1900.

Also there are more trees on this planet than there are stars in the known universe. The Earth literally has trillions of trees.