[Cameron27]

.

[jingaling]

I scooped up a v6 1LT for 22k...I could have taken a 1ss for 32k. For me it wasn't worth spending the extra money....especially when the car I really want is the corvette. I'm happy with the v6 for now though. It has plenty of power, looks good, sounds better than the turbo 4. I know some ppl complain about the power on the freeway, but I have no problems getting from 70 to 100... I throw it In 4th gear let out the clutch and have my fun for those few seconds.

The v6 is fast... The v8 is faster...if the corvette wasn't around I would have went for the ss and been done with it. For now I'll just put around in the v6 until I can fill up my piggy bank.

[14Black1LESS]

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

Bro I really can't understand why you keep on coming here looking for a fight. Here's a link to what comes up when you type in Camaro sports car. It has a whole bunch of links from GM Canada and GM USA describing the 6th generation as a sports car. Since General Motors makes the Camaro 6 gen and they label it a sports car I think I'm going to go with them over you bro. Any chance you can stop kicking a dead horse and looking for fights on 6 gen you're more than welcome on the site of course we could just do with out the arguments

https://www.google.ca/search?q=camar....0.hR6QIaoMlII

Holy shit, its on google so it must be true. GM could call the Camaro an exotic for all I care, that still wouldn't make it an exotic. By the way "Bro" I never came on here looking for a "fight". I came on here because I'm a car enthusiast like most of us here and when someone like yourself starts stating bs about V8's then I will call you out on it. I'm not the one that is beating a dead horse, you need to take a look in the mirror for that one. Apparently you are the owner of the Camaro forum since its coming from your mouth that I'm only welcome on here as long as I don't "argue". You really need to check yourself "bro". Everybody has different opinions about things, and I'm not saying my opinion is always right, but you are the one that turned this whole thing into an argument from the beginning.

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

Ok, I am not taking sides in the 14Black1LESS / IMadeYouReadThis "debate", but I will hope to add some clarity on vehicle segment classifications.

Over the many years that I worked in GM Product Planning we used several different sources for vehicle classification. Our own, Wards Automotive, R.L. Polk, EPA, and one that I am suddenly drawing a blank on, but when I remember I'll add it. All of them except EPA classify Camaro and Mustang as Sports Cars. EPA classifies them as Sporty Cars.

Most classify
* Miata, BRZ, WRX, etc as Small Sports Cars.
* Camaro, Mustang, Genesis Coupe, Nissan 370Z are classified as Mid-Sized Sports Cars.
* Corvettes, Porsches, Ferraris, etc are classified as Premium Sports Cars.
* Challengers and Chargers are classified as Large Cars (not Large Sports Cars, just Large Cars)

We now return you to our regularly scheduled pissing match.



*** EDIT *** Just remembered....Automotive News

It always ends up being a pissing match when someone starts a V6 vs. V8 thread. Just some people don't know how to have a civil debate about something without one jumping down the others throat because they think the other person is "down playing" their car. But what do I know.

[14Black1LESS]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

You don't suppose GM has an agenda where stretching the truth to boost sales is seen as being a good thing for that all-important bottom-line? Taking the mfr's word for it here is no better than taking magazine road test results as unquestionably the last word in performance measurements . . . hell, probably not even that good.

Those claims are no more than advertising fluff designed to coax a slightly different segment of the car enthusiast world into stopping by the dealership and maybe trying one out. As capable as at least a couple of Camaro trims are, that alone does not make them "sports cars" - either 'big-bore sport coupes" or "Grand Touring cars" would be much closer to the truth.

I get that GM is never going to call their Camaro a ponycar, even though that's the U.S. domestic car category it best fits into.


Methinks today's advertising people are either too young to know what a sports car really was, or they actually are old enough to know and they're flat-out taking advantage of those who don't - by any means that might work. They probably hate people like me who don't gobble up every advertising pitch like it was candy.


Norm

I think you hit the nail on the head with that one. But what do I know, I have a slow 5th Gen SS and can't post in the 6th Gen section because I don't own one.

[SuperSound]

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

There is no need to insult me man I don't know what you don't get maybe you need to look into your own intelligence instead of trying to insult me. The V6 and 4 cylinder cars have their own brakes they do not need the SS breaks the SS cannot use the V6 brakes you can totally compare them it's not like the car is coming with out brakes it has brakes you can still upgrade the brakes on an SS that would be the comparison upgraded SS brakes versus upgraded LT brakes or base brakes versus base brakes.

I don't know what you're trying to prove but you're basically trying to make it look like it's not a lot of money extra to get into an SS but the bottom line it is a lot of money no matter what way you try to cut it it's a lot of money.

Next time try to not be so ignorant

A 1lt in Canada is $29 000 in change you can add the six cylinder for $1,600 the 1 SS is $43,000 that's not chump change buddy

Wasn't trying to insult you at all, but the number of run ons, fragments and lack of punctuation make it hard to read some of your posts. You are Canadian after all and your first language could have been French for all I know.

Not sure what point you are trying to make about brakes, I'm not saying anyone needs them or the cooling. I would suspect that most people buying the V6 indeed don't care about having them, or they would probably want the 1LE. Same with the SS suspension. Almost every LT I see has the RS package, so obviously that one is popular. There are threads regularly about adding the 8" displays and currently there is no way to add the 8" DIC via the aftermarket. Those two options definitely add some value in the V6 vs V8 debate.

Again my whole point is 1LS to 1SS is not apples to apples. Would comparing a 2LT with no options to 2LT with all packages be apples to apples? No it wouldn't. The whole basis of your argument is using a "base" car to a higher trim with more standard features and a different engine is $10K more. Sure it is, but there is also almost $3K in extras that 1SS has excluding brakes, cooling, bigger performance tires, sport suspension, +120HP/171ft lbs of TQ (and a LSD for autos which you can't get anyway else).

So if the RS and dual 8" displays means anything to a potential buyer, then I can see why they would say $10K for a V8...no way. But if they do care about those extras, it's more like $6K and change.

Also the OP of this thread was a US buyer, so while CDN prices explain your rationale, they aren't relevant to him. It sucks how pricing is that different for Canadian buyers considering how many Camaros have been built over the years up there.

[IMadeYouReadThis]

Originally Posted by 14Black1LESS

Holy shit, its on google so it must be true. GM could call the Camaro an exotic for all I care, that still wouldn't make it an exotic. By the way "Bro" I never came on here looking for a "fight". I came on here because I'm a car enthusiast like most of us here and when someone like yourself starts stating bs about V8's then I will call you out on it. I'm not the one that is beating a dead horse, you need to take a look in the mirror for that one. Apparently you are the owner of the Camaro forum since its coming from your mouth that I'm only welcome on here as long as I don't "argue". You really need to check yourself "bro". Everybody has different opinions about things, and I'm not saying my opinion is always right, but you are the one that turned this whole thing into an argument from the beginning.



It always ends up being a pissing match when someone starts a V6 vs. V8 thread. Just some people don't know how to have a civil debate about something without one jumping down the others throat because they think the other person is "down playing" their car. But what do I know.

You're making stuff up man I never said anything derogatory of the V8 in the 6th gen Camaro it's a beast. The only thing I said is your 5th gen Camaro stock is close to a 5th gen 1 L V6 stock 4.5 seconds vs 4.9 seconds 0 to 60.

Please stop making stuff up you're making yourself look like a fool

[IMadeYouReadThis]

Originally Posted by SuperSound

Wasn't trying to insult you at all, but the number of run ons, fragments and lack of punctuation make it hard to read some of your posts. You are Canadian after all and your first language could have been French for all I know.

Not sure what point you are trying to make about brakes, I'm not saying anyone needs them or the cooling. I would suspect that most people buying the V6 indeed don't care about having them, or they would probably want the 1LE. Same with the SS suspension. Almost every LT I see has the RS package, so obviously that one is popular. There are threads regularly about adding the 8" displays and currently there is no way to add the 8" DIC via the aftermarket. Those two options definitely add some value in the V6 vs V8 debate.

Again my whole point is 1LS to 1SS is not apples to apples. Would comparing a 2LT with no options to 2LT with all packages be apples to apples? No it wouldn't. The whole basis of your argument is using a "base" car to a higher trim with more standard features and a different engine is $10K more. Sure it is, but there is also almost $3K in extras that 1SS has excluding brakes, cooling, bigger performance tires, sport suspension, +120HP/171ft lbs of TQ (and a LSD for autos which you can't get anyway else).

So if the RS and dual 8" displays means anything to a potential buyer, then I can see why they would say $10K for a V8...no way. But if they do care about those extras, it's more like $6K and change.

Also the OP of this thread was a US buyer, so while CDN prices explain your rationale, they aren't relevant to him. It sucks how pricing is that different for Canadian buyers considering how many Camaros have been built over the years up there.

All right brother fair enough no hard feelings from me. I do wish they had a cheaper V8 option as well. It's crazy because I put up at $6,500 worth of options on to my car to get it how I want it. If I would have bought an SS I would have still had to pay about $4,500 on top of the 10,000 MSRP difference to get it looking like my current one LS. I could have saved $2,000 on the RS package what I would have still had to pay $500 for the hyper blue I would have still had to pay $1,000 for the Dual mode I would have had to pay something correct me if I'm wrong for the Bose stereo because I have the full eight speaker and I believe the 1ss has 5 is that true or am I off on that?

I guess I would have saved the $1,600 on the V6 as well but I would have had to pay that in the extra tax on the extra ten Grand I would have to pay to get into a V8.

I guess all I'm trying to say is to me the V8 was just out of my price range and it was shockingly expensive considering the Camaro was supposed to be the every man's sports car.

Luckily they made the V6 good enough for the average Joe.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

If that's the case, then the entire US Auto Industry is complicit. The industry uses two primary sources for vehicle classification: Wards Automotive and R.L. Polk. Both classify Camaro and Mustang as Mid-Sized Sports Cars.

Mid-sized and sports car are contradictions in terms. If that makes Wards and Polk guilty of revisionist thinking for any reason (including outside influences), I wouldn't be surprised.


Norm

[Zack46]

Please put an end to this thread....

[gringo]

Originally Posted by SuperSound

Fact...there is no "base" V8. The 1SS comes with the RS package, HD brake/cooling, better suspension and the 8" display. Go back and see my post earlier which I broke down the pricing difference. It is around $6K if you are comparing V6 to V8. Add another $1K if you compare the 2.0T. That's a far cry from $10K and it's even farther when you consider the actual performance/features in comparing a 1SS to a base 1LS.

http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=248

Fact...you are wrong again. To step into a 1SS "V8" from a 1LS "V6" is around $10K more, not $6K. Go to Chevy's build and price site. A 1LS V6 base price starts at $27,395. A 1SS with the 6.2L V8 starts at $36,900. That's nearly $10K more, not $6K.

The performance difference is not a far cry either. The S/C from Will Overkill will set you back around $6-7K and give you performance almost equal to that of the 1SS V8. So, either way, you're going to spend mid $30's to get the power level of a V8 unless you go with a used SS with a ton of miles on it or one with a salvage title.

[14Black1LESS]

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

You're making stuff up man I never said anything derogatory of the V8 in the 6th gen Camaro it's a beast. The only thing I said is your 5th gen Camaro stock is close to a 5th gen 1 L V6 stock 4.5 seconds vs 4.9 seconds 0 to 60.

Please stop making stuff up you're making yourself look like a fool

Ok, so first the 6th Gen V6 was close to my car stock for stock, then you changed it to the 6th Gen V6 1LE, and now its the 5th Gen V6 that is close to my car stock for stock. Please put down the crack pipe, you are really embarrassing yourself now. Since I'm apparently "making" stuff up, Id be happy to quote you again on what you said.

[14Black1LESS]

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

You're making stuff up man I never said anything derogatory of the V8 in the 6th gen Camaro it's a beast. The only thing I said is your 5th gen Camaro stock is close to a 5th gen 1 L V6 stock 4.5 seconds vs 4.9 seconds 0 to 60.

Please stop making stuff up you're making yourself look like a fool

Please see following quotes from you.

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

I think the problem with Risky Justice is he regrets not buying the V6 because he's just not using his V8 at the track where it belongs.

I would say at least 80 to 90% of guys do not mod their cars I'm a guy that does just do basic intakes and exhausts throttle bodies stuff like that but I'm not a guy that's going to be doing cams.

So for the guy that's not going to mod risky Justice the V6 is a damn fine automobile faster than 90% of the cars on the road and it is bulletproof reliable so far. Let's admit now to this car is no longer a muscle car is a sports car it handles crazy and the V6 with the NPP sounds like an exotic sports car I know you can't get that into your head risky exotic think about how cool that is to have a Camaro that sounds like an exotic


So with mods you can up I-4 to 400 horse or more but you have no warranty left. I know I could not just go ahead and void the warranty on my car that I just bought brand new that would be just crazy people like to have brand new cars because of warranties MrJustice.

I don't know if your new to having powerful cars oryou don't understand that the LG X can run with an LS1 Camaro or you're bored or you just like talking smack.

But my God are you talking a lot of smack the V6 is fantastic man go mod your V8 if you're not happy with it man.

And let's not forget that the V6 is lighter in the front end in the V8 and I would go as far to say it is a better handling vehicle.

And I would also be man enough to say that the I-4 would be better handling in the V6. Weight matters in a vehicle

The reality is man the V8 is nice to have if you're some old guy that's going to keep it in the garage and brag but it's complete Overkill on the street as a daily driver.

That's a lot of normal guys that just bought the V8 to that are in here shaking their fingers at anybody who didnt buy one

You got to stop doing that risky Justice it's not needed it's ridiculous. It's not going to kill you the fact that the LG xv6 is just the best V6 ever made you can accept that and move on with your life we've all made choices you've also got the fastest V8 ever in a Camaro that's some pretty good choices man but I've got the fastest V6.

I do invite you to use YouTube and Google and review the V6 Camaro though because everyone who drove it loved it and then spend some time and read about the LG X and how it won Ward's 10 best and how they had to keep on stopping the cars popping the hoods of the Camaros just to tell if it was a V6 or V8 they were driving

Here you claim that you can really only use the V8's performance on a track and can't use it on the street which is total bs. So basically you are degrading the V8 because it's not practical for street use that only a V6 is.

Then you degrade it to as only old men buy them and store them in their garage.

Last on this quote, you say people are popping their hoods to see that it really has a V6 and not a V8. Really?!?! First, the V8 has heat extractors on the hood and the V6 doesn't. Second, there is a big difference in the exhaust sounds. Third, there is a big difference between having 335hp, 284tq, and 455hp and tq. If they were popping the hoods to make sure it has a V6 then they were probably comparing it to the LS1 Camaro, which in that case I could see them doing that. As I have already said numerous times on here, which apparently you are blind to seeing, the 6th Gen V6 is very impressive.

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

I never once said it sounded like a V12 you made that up yourself 100% I said it sounded exotic and it does. It's not just me that thinks that so does pretty much every other reviewer that reviews it. You can spend some timewatching YouTube videos. You drive a 5th gen I had one they're nice but they're heavy and they do not handle well at all the 4th gen could run circles around them as far as handling goes it is what it is man 5th is a muscle car the 6th Gen is aports car.

As far as performance goes to you've got a skewed perspective here's a little blip of it your current car


http://www.motorweek.org/reviews/roa...camaro_ss_ile/
Our car’s LS3 6.2-liter V8 generates 426-horsepower and 420 lb-ft. of torque. Yes, that is unchanged as no updates were needed here. So, we settled for the same times of our last 1LE, 4.5-seconds to 60 and 12.9 for the ¼ at 110 miles-per-hour.


That 4.5 seconds is fast 0 to 60 Man I'm not saying it's not but the new V6 1le is just about as fast as your car. if that's not progress I don't know what is

I just got to throw it out to man unless if you're talking about an intake or an exhaust if you think 50% of guys mod their cars I don't know what you're smoking but I would like to get some unless if things are completely different in the lower States than they are in Canada I can say 100% that is not the case I've been in the V8 scene with my Z28 for over a decade

We won't get back on the exhaust sounds, which is still funny to me but whatever. Here you degrade the 5th Gen V8 in trying to claim a 4th Gen SS can run circles around it. Even though this sentence will get twisted around I'm sure, but since you have said the 6th Gen V6 can hang with the LS1 Camaro, which I do believe it can, that would mean that you think the 6th Gen V6 can hang with the 5th Gen SS also, based solely on that the 4th Gen SS can "run circles" around it. So that is basically degrading the LS3 again to the 6th Gen V6, but like I said I'm sure you will find a way to twist that around. All you can do is state 0-60 times. Last time I checked, races are not done to 60 and that's it. Apparently you have never been in a 5th Gen SS or a 5th Gen 1LE for that matter, then you would change your mind about the handling. As I have already stated, I have owned a 2002 Camaro SS and stock for stock it doesn't hold a candle to the 5th Gen SS, let alone the 5th Gen 1LE.

Pointing this out again, since you will probably didn't understand it originally, I was talking about the 6th Gen 1LE SS since we are in fact on the 6th Gen forum.

Again, apparently races are only done 0-60.

Apparently I didn't even see this but yes here in the U.S., more than 10%-20% of people mod their cars. That might not be the case in Canada. That's good for you that you have been in the V8 scene for over a decade, I have been in the V8 scene for over 20 years. So what is your point with that.

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

Bro I don't know what your problem is the link I posted with the link is for review for your 2014 ss1le. It's zero to 60 times 4.5 seconds you can mod it all you want that's great. I was talking in general I don't know you personally I don't know what you've done to your car I've never been to your house for a beer bro I'm talking about the way your car rolled out of the factory versus the way a 6 gen 1le rolls out of the factory. And that was just your to 60 times I was talking about your 4.5 versus the six genzebe six 4.9 seconds 0 to 60. I would think that the newer car would destroy you on the lightning lap as well but you can always mod to your heart's content. I definitely would not take your car over a 6 gen V6 that's for damn sure.



Turn up your speakers and listen to this this is my nice exotic exhaust sound

tps://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Qrs0oa-XIV4

Let me add this as well I loved the 4th gen it was light it was quick it handled really well. To me if one car does not feel like driving a Camaro it's the fifth gen it's too big it's too heavy it didn't feel right to me it definitely did not feel like my f body. I love all Camaros man. But the V6 to me feels like the true successor to my 2002 F body

Degrading it once again just automatically assuming the V6 1LE would destroy the 5th Gen 1LE on the lightening lap. I don't recall what g-force the V6 1LE can do in the turns but I would assume it is close to the 5th Gen 1LE, but you have to remember, the 5th Gen has more power. Yes the 6th Gen V6 weighs less but the V8 has more than enough hp and tq to make up for that weight difference.

Couldn't agree with you more that the 5th Gen is too heavy, but it does feel like a F-body.

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

Well bro you love to beat a dead horse. Can I refer you to the post just above ours where GM is explaining to the media how the V6 sounds like a Ferrari.

You may want to consider trading your 5th gen in for a 6th gen you've been spending a lot of time here.

Just had to put this one up again. Love it how I have to own a 6th Gen. to post here.

Hopefully this will clarify some things for you but I'm sure it won't.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

And if you did spend the extra money on the V8 I do truly hope you use that power and not just use it for bragging rights find your local track go to it get your money's worth

I can't understand why you keep coming back to this 'bragging rights' thing for V8 owners. I'm an old guy (one of your later posts), and bragging about any of my V8-powered cars for having a V8 engine has never crossed my mind. Think about it - if I have to tell anybody that my car has a V8, what's their opinion worth? Is it worth my time chasing it?

Apparently for you, a car featuring about 1000 lbs of its own weight per liter of engine displacement is entirely satisfactory, and that's fine for you. Just don't expect everybody else to feel the same way about having family sedan-ish weight to power in their 'toys' or 'fun cars'. Try stepping outside yourself at least far enough to recognize that there are people who'd rather have cars that are even more relaxed in maintaining a normal street driving pace.


Norm

[IMadeYouReadThis]

Originally Posted by 14Black1LESS

Ok, so first the 6th Gen V6 was close to my car stock for stock, then you changed it to the 6th Gen V6 1LE, and now its the 5th Gen V6 that is close to my car stock for stock. Please put down the crack pipe, you are really embarrassing yourself now. Since I'm apparently "making" stuff up, Id be happy to quote you again on what you said.

I meant to 6th gen V6 1 l e. Yeah you know what I meant what I meant you're just being a awesome. The whole time I meant a 1le vs a 1le. 6th gen V6 versus your 5th gen. You know exactly what I meant. But I would say that I would think that even the 6th gen 4 cylinder could probably come close to a handling you if not it handling you your car is heavy man and it's not very fast compared to the new ones.