[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

The interior quality of the two are absolutely on par with one another. Everything you are calling cheap about the mustang is the same quality as the Camaro. Every comparison out there has said the same thing.

As for the MFT, I love it. It does exactly what I need it to...quickly. It sounds like you may be commenting on a previous gen system, as the sync3 has been praised for its quickness and user friendliness.

No way are they on par, and the Mustangs wears much faster. I mean have you looked closely at the non MFT center stack?

Camaro also won a best interior for 2016 award from Wards Auto:
http://m.wardsauto.com/interiors/che...aro-fits-glove

The Mustang did not win the same in 2015...

[aestil]

I hate to wade into this debate, but I guess I will.

The way I see it is that things just don't line up perfectly like people may wish. This happens all the time in other industries, GPUs being a good example. Often you'll have competing products from two different manufacturers, but they are not priced the same, nor do they perform the same, so you have one option that is say $199, and it is a bit slower than a competing product from the other manufacturer, but that product is priced at $219. The consumer is left to decide which is the better value for them.

With these cars we have a similar situation.

I see it like this.

Mustang GT [base model] -> Has no real straight up comparison
Mustang GT [premium model] -> Has no real straight up comparison
Mustang GT PP -> 1 SS [Camaro has better performance, similar content]
Mustang GT Premium PP -> 2SS [Camaro has better performance, similar content]
No real performance comparison <- 1SS 1LE.


The mustang and camaro products just don't really line up.

I do think it's interesting that one can argue that a Camaro 1LT 1LE would be about as fast and have similar content to a Mustang GT PP [non-premium].

It's also interesting that the only competition for an SS 1LE is not a normal Mustang, but is in fact a 'special' car, and the 1LE is about the same performance as that car, for about $10-12k less [assuming you don't get the dealer marking up the GT350].

The MSRPs of these cars are staggered almost perfectly so that you can basically pick your price point and level of performance [depending on what you can afford].

$33,820 - Mustang GT
$36,815 - Mustang GT PP 
$37,820 - Mustang GT Premium
$37,900 - Camaro 1SS 
$40,815 - Mustang GT Premium PP
$42,900 - Camaro 2SS
$44,400 - Camaro 1SS 1LE

The cars that seem like they 'compare' to me are the Mustang GT PP and Camaro 1SS, [about $1k difference there], and GT Premium PP and 2SS [about $2k difference]. In both cases the Camaro has more performance and costs a bit more.

There is no 'base model' Mustang that comes even remotely close to the 1SS 1LE. In searching for some sort of similar performance Motor Trend is looking at the Cayman GT4 and M4 GTS [from a performance standpoint, not from a brand caché or interior quality etc]. I think we can all agree that the 'base' GT350 is right around 'as fast' as the SS 1LE is under most circumstances, and that the GT350R will need either a ZL1 or a Z/28 to have a proper comparison.

You guys are arguing semantics. Why? There are only facts. Base Mustang not a very good performance car, but maybe desirable for people based on personal preferences and pricing reasons. Base Camaro tremendous performance. 1LE Camaro incredible performance/$$ ratio. GT350R very fast car with neat tech which no current gen Camaro approaches in performance.

[SpeedIsLife]

Which "base" GT350? The old $50,000 one or the "new" base at 54,000? (Which has the TP as standard)

[aestil]

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

Which "base" GT350? The old $50,000 one or the "new" base at 54,000? (Which has the TP as standard)

The TP in the GT350 is the 'tech pack' is it not? I don't think it adds performance, only creature comforts. I could be completely wrong about that though.

[SpeedIsLife]

Originally Posted by aestil

The TP in the GT350 is the 'tech pack' is it not? I don't think it adds performance, only creature comforts. I could be completely wrong about that though.

There is no more "track pack" on the 2017+ GT350, it got rolled into the "base" GT350. The Tech Pack adds the heated and cooled leather seats, MFT, etc.

Currently the only options on the GT350 are the Tech Pack and the "R"

[90503]

FWIW on the lap times....The V-6 1LE is for all intents and purposes an SS with a V-6 in it....So if you're wondering where your base SS would fit in, probably in between the two 1LEs...

[libertyforall]

Hmm, I think the 1LE should also have an A10 option after all the declarations of how it is the manual stick killer, right?!

[Sidedraft]

Originally Posted by aestil

The TP in the GT350 is the 'tech pack' is it not? I don't think it adds performance, only creature comforts. I could be completely wrong about that though.

TP = Track Pack, now standard on all 2017+ GT350s

[90503]

Originally Posted by libertyforall

Hmm, I think the 1LE should also have an A10 option after all the declarations of how it is the manual stick killer, right?!

I don't think so...all 1LEs are still manuals....The 1LE package for the V-6 up-grades the suspension, brakes, etc., to what is standard on the SS models...just 'sayin. It's a cool option package, and a painless way to mix and match....all good.

The new 1LE packages are available in late 2016, on 2017 Camaro SS and LT V-6 coupes equipped with manual transmissions. Pricing and performance data will be announced at a later date.

Camaro LT 1LE
The Camaro LT 1LE was developed to be the most track-capable sports coupe in its price class. Highlights include:
• 3.6L V-6 rated at 335 horsepower and matched with the six-speed manual transmission
• FE3 suspension components (from the Camaro SS), including dampers, rear cradle mounts, ball-jointed rear toe links and stabilizer bars
• Lightweight 20-inch forged aluminum wheels with Goodyear Eagle F1 245/40R20 front tires and 275/35R20 rear tires
• Brembo 4-piston front brake calipers
• Mechanical Limited-slip differential with 3.27 ratio
• Standard track-cooling package, with engine oil, differential and transmission coolers
• Suede steering wheel and shorter-throw shifter
• Standard dual mode exhaust system
• Camaro SS fuel system for higher-load cornering capability
• Satin black hood, front splitter and unique three-piece rear spoiler
• Unique high flow upper and lower grille with satin black accents
• Available Recaro seats and PDR video/data recording system.

“With a curb weight under 3,500 pounds, excellent front-to-rear weight balance and the precision of the FE3 suspension, the Camaro LT 1LE offers unmatched capability in its class,” said Oppenheiser. “As a result, it offers incredible performance for Camaro V-6 customers.

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

People are lined up for the GT350. If someone can afford one, they'll buy it just because.

This doesn't change what segment these two cars will be placed on a track. These are track optioned cars.

I would not say that. There are over 750+ gt350 sitting on lots right now. So if there was such a demand, there would be a lot less considering only about 7500 have been built. Now look at the Vette. They have 1200+ 2016-2017 sitting at dealer including z06 and GS. They make way move vettes then gt350 yet there isn't much more sitting at dealers.

[aestil]

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

There is no more "track pack" on the 2017+ GT350, it got rolled into the "base" GT350. The Tech Pack adds the heated and cooled leather seats, MFT, etc.

Currently the only options on the GT350 are the Tech Pack and the "R"

Oh thank! TIL!

It is a good question though. I wouldn't be surprised though if the 1LE was roughly at parity with the 'new' GT350. I hope someone tests that for us

[IOMike]

Originally Posted by 13vertss/r's

I would not say that. There are over 750+ gt350 sitting on lots right now. So if there was such a demand, there would be a lot less considering only about 7500 have been built. Now look at the Vette. They have 1200+ 2016-2017 sitting at dealer including z06 and GS. They make way move vettes then gt350 yet there isn't much more sitting at dealers.

His username is accurate, he is a fanboy. Logic need not apply, his blinders are on.

For enthusiasts, team Chevy is curb stomping the team Ford right now. Bad.

[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

Which "base" GT350? The old $50,000 one or the "new" base at 54,000? (Which has the TP as standard)

A base 2017 GT350 is $58,000. Fords base price doesn't include destination or gas guzzler...

[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by aestil

I hate to wade into this debate, but I guess I will.

The way I see it is that things just don't line up perfectly like people may wish. This happens all the time in other industries, GPUs being a good example. Often you'll have competing products from two different manufacturers, but they are not priced the same, nor do they perform the same, so you have one option that is say $199, and it is a bit slower than a competing product from the other manufacturer, but that product is priced at $219. The consumer is left to decide which is the better value for them.

With these cars we have a similar situation.

I see it like this.

Mustang GT [base model] -> Has no real straight up comparison
Mustang GT [premium model] -> Has no real straight up comparison
Mustang GT PP -> 1 SS [Camaro has better performance, similar content]
Mustang GT Premium PP -> 2SS [Camaro has better performance, similar content]
No real performance comparison <- 1SS 1LE.


The mustang and camaro products just don't really line up.

I do think it's interesting that one can argue that a Camaro 1LT 1LE would be about as fast and have similar content to a Mustang GT PP [non-premium].

It's also interesting that the only competition for an SS 1LE is not a normal Mustang, but is in fact a 'special' car, and the 1LE is about the same performance as that car, for about $10-12k less [assuming you don't get the dealer marking up the GT350].

The MSRPs of these cars are staggered almost perfectly so that you can basically pick your price point and level of performance [depending on what you can afford].

$33,820 - Mustang GT
$36,815 - Mustang GT PP 
$37,820 - Mustang GT Premium
$37,900 - Camaro 1SS 
$40,815 - Mustang GT Premium PP
$42,900 - Camaro 2SS
$44,900 - Camaro 1SS 1LE

The cars that seem like they 'compare' to me are the Mustang GT PP and Camaro 1SS, [about $1k difference there], and GT Premium PP and 2SS [about $2k difference]. In both cases the Camaro has more performance and costs a bit more.

There is no 'base model' Mustang that comes even remotely close to the 1SS 1LE. In searching for some sort of similar performance Motor Trend is looking at the Cayman GT4 and M4 GTS [from a performance standpoint, not from a brand caché or interior quality etc]. I think we can all agree that the 'base' GT350 is right around 'as fast' as the SS 1LE is under most circumstances, and that the GT350R will need either a ZL1 or a Z/28 to have a proper comparison.

You guys are arguing semantics. Why? There are only facts. Base Mustang not a very good performance car, but maybe desirable for people based on personal preferences and pricing reasons. Base Camaro tremendous performance. 1LE Camaro incredible performance/$$ ratio. GT350R very fast car with neat tech which no current gen Camaro approaches in performance.

MSRP of the SS 1LE is $44,400...