[Thor142]

Originally Posted by Sidedraft

The 1LE also won't pull any sales from the GT350 -- which is limited production and Ford will sell every one they make.

Exactly, thank you. Aside from the odd track rat who may snatch up a 1LE instead of a GT350 to save a few bucks ford is NOT losing any GT350 sales to a 1LE.

[SpeedIsLife]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

They are stealing sales from the 1SS in regards to their marketing. The money still goes to GM, but most of these people I'd venture to say are people that would have bought the 1SS had the 1le never existed.

Well, as you've been corrected for already, the 1LE is a 1SS. It's an option package that does refine the interior to a level I've called "1.5 SS"

However, the 1SS is there for people who don't care about the 1LE stuff, who want to do their own thing, or simply can't afford it. There are people who just will want the out of box performance of the 1LE and be done with it..then there are people who will want to run different sways, coilovers, etc..the 1LE would be a waste to them.

[Mustang Fanboy]

Originally Posted by Thor142

Exactly, thank you. Aside from the odd track rat who may snatch up a 1LE instead of a GT350 to save a few bucks ford is NOT losing any GT350 sales to a 1LE.

People are lined up for the GT350. If someone can afford one, they'll buy it just because.

This doesn't change what segment these two cars will be placed on a track. These are track optioned cars.

[Sidedraft]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

I can do this all day.

You're doing it badly, though:

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

The prices do not have to be the same to include them in the same class.

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

The 1le has $6500 worth of track parts. The GTPP has $3000 worth of road parts. Different market.

So, which is it?

[Mustang Fanboy]

Originally Posted by Sidedraft

You're doing it badly, though:

So, which is it?

I enjoy it none the less.

[Thor142]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

I enjoy it none the less.

Fair enough...

[Egon]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

Ok…tons of responses…I love it.

The GTPP fits in where the Gen4 camaro SS fit in. It’s a marginal upgrade to the GT as the SS was to the Z28. It comes with better equipment…but not top of the line track ready equipment (that is where the GT350 fits in, and was previously filled by the Boss 302). You can go to any Ford dealer and take a test drive in a GTPP equipped car…there is nothing special about them. The 1le will be far and away a special order vehicle. You will see some on lots, but good luck finding one to test drive. GM no longer has the Z28-SS hierarchy, so all of you get stuck adding on individual options if you want anything above standard equipment.

As for that special equipment…the GTPP has some, but again…this is street oriented equipment that allows it to better perform at the track. It has better suspension, but not ground breaking. It has a better diff (for the track), but not groundbreaking. It has better brakes (for the track)…but again, not groundbreaking. The package is was cheap and a bargain at $2500 (it’s now $3000). The 1le comes with track ready suspension, track ready brakes, track ready tires, track ready seats etc. The package is over double at $6500. It’s a bargain for what it is.

Think of it this way. When someone purchases the 1le, where would they be stealing potential sales from? Hint…it’s not the GTPP, when the 1SS is already quicker. It’s going to be the 1SS/2SS and the GT350. The 1le and GT350 are both the track oriented versions of their base counterparts. The prices do not have to be the same to include them in the same class. Weather they are a stand-alone model or optioned out doesn’t matter what class it will be placed in on a track. Ford just so happens to have an extra layer of vehicle in their lineup that GM doesn’t account for. Both the base GT and the GTPP compete for sales against the 1SS and 2SS, it’s just the way it is.

Believe me I understand what you are saying, but if you are to find a model in the Camaro lineup that matches with the GTPP then you will need one that performs worse than the 1SS to do it. Believe me I am not being an ass when I say this but that model is the V6 1LE then since it just outperformed the GTPP by more than 1 second at VIR in C&D Lightning lap this year. The V6 1LE can be had for just over $30,000 in 1LT trim as well which makes it a fantastic value over the Mustang GTPP.

Here are the two lineups.

Camaro:
V6 1LE: $30,000
1SS: $38,000
1SS 1LE: $44,500
ZL1: $62,000

Mustang:
GT: $33,000
GTPP: $36,000
GT350TP: $54,000
GT350R: $62,000

Considering even the cheapest performance Camaro will beat the GT and GTPP at $3,000 to $6,000 cheaper, and the 1SS 1LE will beat the GT350TP for $10,000 less, the Camaro is looking like the value of the century to me.

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

As it stands, a large percentage of mustang buyers opt for the performance pack...so much so that Ford upped the price for 2017. For the extra money, it was a no brainer for what you got. GT PP are all over dealerships. This brings me back to the day of the base Z28 vs the upgraded SS. This is what the GTPP is, a street oriented performance pack that can aide track performance. The 1le is a track oriented car, hence the lack of certain creature comfort options.

We can argue about this all day with neither one being totally correct.

You sound like a politician...spin, spin, spin all you want ain't NOBODY buying. If it makes you feel better.

Originally Posted by HumanWiki

How was the C7 GS optioned out? Was it a full on stage 3 pkg? (Serious question here as I didn't look in to it)

The magazines have all been using a loaded Grand Sport. It would weigh less with a 1LT package, but they all have a 3LT.

[Mustang Fanboy]

Originally Posted by Egon

Believe me I understand what you are saying, but if you are to find a model in the Camaro lineup that matches with the GTPP then you will need one that performs worse than the 1SS to do it. Believe me I am not being an ass when I say this but that model is the V6 1LE then since it just outperformed the GTPP by more than 1 second at VIR in C&D Lightning lap this year. The V6 1LE can be had for just over $30,000 in 1LT trim as well which makes it a fantastic value over the Mustang GTPP.

Here are the two lineups.

Camaro:
V6 1LE: $30,000
1SS: $38,000
1SS 1LE: $44,500
ZL1: $62,000

Mustang:
GT: $33,000
GTPP: $36,000
GT350TP: $54,000
GT350R: $62,000

Considering even the cheapest performance Camaro will beat the GT and GTPP at $3,000 to $6,000 cheaper, and the 1SS 1LE will beat the GT350TP for $10,000 less, the Camaro is looking like the value of the century to me.

I don't disagree, it's a value if you are looking purely from a performance perspective.

You can't just line up all the models of A and B in a row though and say they are the same market segment. As I previously stated, GM doesn't have an option similar to that of the GTPP. Both the GT and GTPP are in the same market segment. You can see it on the dealer lots...There are as many GTPP's out their as non PP's (easy on the giggling).

[Mustang Fanboy]

16 Pages of derail. My apologies.

I'll stop now.

[Thor142]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

16 Pages of derail. My apologies.

I'll stop now.

You win the internets today

[Mustang Fanboy]

Originally Posted by Thor142

You win the internets today

[Bhobbs]

We all know how much Mustang guys love the PPs.

Jokes aside, the GTPP is a good play on Ford's part. The PP is enough to justify the money but not so extreme is turns people off. It seems like Ford favors DD capability as much as performance in that sense, where the 1LE is much more aggressive.

[bballr4567]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

People are lined up for the GT350. If someone can afford one, they'll buy it just because.

This doesn't change what segment these two cars will be placed on a track. These are track optioned cars.

Here is the deal.

Ford has made the GT350R a garage porn car. With its limited build numbers the amount of guys "racing" them are going to be very small.

Now, they have the GT350 which competes with the 1LE. Yes, they aren't the same yada yada yada but in the end it's Mustang vs Camaro.

In the end, the 1LE is beating that mainstream GT350. Is that going to make Ford fans happy? No. You know how we can tell? It boils down to the "soul" of the car. Guess what though. Camaro has plenty of soul as well.

Even Track Pack or Performance Pack rolls off the tongue way better than 1LE IMO. TP or PP sounds like something good when you say it. You can easily brag to a non car guy "I have the PP". They will know just from the meaning of those two words that it's something a car guy would want.



Nostalgia aside, 1LE is a bad name. I bet GM would sell a lot more 1LE-optioned cars if they had a better name for it... oh and if they didn't require that stupid matte black hood. I despise that thing.

I mean, this is the type of stuff that is being talked down upon of the 1LE. It's so damn fun. "You have the PP?" LMAO!!