[BowtieBelle]

Originally Posted by GTAHVIT

Again, Joe shold be fired along with everyone else who didn't act responsibly.

sure Paterno is going to take the majority of the heat as he is the public figure. But if we are really concerned about the kids. Joe is no more responsible than any one else who knew and didn't continue to press the issue. They all dropped the ball ... and they are all being held accountable.

as it should be IMO.

This.

[ssump29]

Originally Posted by TurboTA

I agree, but Paterno has been described as one of the most powerful men in Pa as just stated on ESPN and I agree. Men in positions like that get things done that others might have trouble with. So IMO Paterno has more responsibility.

I'm sorry I don't agree. I go back to the witness, you know better you do better. My momma raised my right and I don't care how powerful someone is or suppose to be, if I see something I'm 100% sure of I'm not waiting for the said powerful person's approval, I'm going directly to the most powerful gang in the land the POLICE because no one including Joe PA is above the law and I don't need him to be the guy that makes all the decisions. So using that is a WEAK excuse of letting the people before HIM ever having knowledge off the hook.

LIKE I said where is ALLLLLLL you people's outrage at the mother, DA, police, and public welfare that did nothing in 98 when similar situation happened and SANDUSKY addmitted to doing it? Please explain yourselves?!?

ALL COULD HAVE ENDED in 1998, 1998, 19988888888888888. lol

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by TurboTA

I agree, but Paterno has been described as one of the most powerful men in Pa as just stated on ESPN and I agree. Men in positions like that get things done that others might have trouble with. So IMO Paterno has more responsibility.

Look I'm not trying to give Joe or anyone a pass. And ESPN is a news station... that doesn't make them a tangible witness in all of this.

We will have to agree to disagree on the level of responsibility.

The goal here is not to find the person who is most responsible for allowing to continue. But to hold accountable ALL those who are responsible for what happened.

Lets not crucify those who didn't fight the issue on the same cross as those that committed the crime.

It's not the same. It seems to me some want to put ALL this on Paterno's shoulders... He is not the pedophile.... Yet he is among those responsible for not stopping it ASAP.

[BackinBlackSS/RS]

Ok, let's look at 1998. Does anyone believe that Joe PA and PSU did not know about all that? Hell, he was still on the coaching staff. They knew then about this guy whether he was charged or not. He should have been fired then.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by ssump29

I would agree with you there, but when you read page 7 of the report and see what Joe Pa said what was reported the story is different then what McQueary reports. McQueary said he saw anal sex, yet Joe Pa reports he said fondling or doing something in sexual nature. Then the story is changed by the time McQueary sits down with Schultz and Curly which has been found out they lied. So I can see how Joe could be at a conflict as hes told one thing and then told another thing by his superiors that report McQueary changed his story. ALL in ALL its a lose lose situation on Joe Pa part as he was dragged into something that he should not been dragged into in the first place. McQueary by law is required to report a crime directly at that moment when it occurs, he did not and now we passing blame onto someone else that shouldn't ever had to deal with this problem.

It's no different then witnessing a murder and not calling the police but instead telling someone else, the more people you drag in the situation the harder it becomes to prove and just more loopholes you give a defense attonery in court.

I agree. Aboslutley agree. And if one of your employees told you he saw a murder the previous night, do you call your boss the NEXT day, or do you call the police? And then ask the employee why the hell he dind't.

Originally Posted by toesuf94

I so agree with you. They focused on the figurehead instead of the figure that did the deeds. They went for the big kill on the wrong man. Sandusky should be hanging by his tiny genitals somewhere right now.

Nobody TARGETED Joe Pa. He's the one we've had shoved in our face on Saturdays forever. And told what a perfedct guy he is. What odder, a guy we know NOTHING about doing something wrong or a guy who the entire country has been told was a Saint doing something wrong? And YES, it was wrong of him no tot clal the police.

NO, he isn't the bad guy here. YES he's the guy who's been on a pedestal. H'es held to a higher standard and rightfuly so. He's in a pssition as such. With responsibilities as such.

Originally Posted by GTAHVIT

Again, Joe shold be fired along with everyone else who didn't act responsibly.

sure Paterno is going to take the majority of the heat as he is the public figure. But if we are really concerned about the kids. Joe is no more responsible than any one else who knew and didn't continue to press the issue. They all dropped the ball ... and they are all being held accountable.

as it should be IMO.

Agreed. And if we hadn't been told what a freakin' saint Joe is for so many years, it might not be that big a deal.

[ssump29]

Originally Posted by Russell James

I agree.

Hindsight is so 20/20. Easy to see now, exactly what everybody should have done.

But even that is no sure bet. What if Joe did report it to the police. Who is to say that would have solved anything. The first incident was reported to and investigated by the police. Anything really happen after that?

Joe reported what he heard to school officials who's responsibility it was to handle. Joe was the head football coach, not chief of police. His mistake was trusting those in charge of criminal complaints would fully handle the situation. They didn't and he regrets not doing more. None of us have made perfect decisions throughout our lives.

The only reason this story is all about Joe Pa, is because he is famous. A famous name in a controversial incident sells news.

My controversial opinion is - Joe should sue the school for millions on breach of contract and wrongful termination grounds. Take those millions, add some of his millions and give it all to trust funds for the victims and donations to other child abuse organizations. Make something good out of the situation.

Cause based on what everyone is saying Joe would now being responible for all criminal acts that occured that are reported to him first and not the police. Sorry he's a football coach, his main focus and job is his football team and his players and coaches. And since Sandusky was neither and the crime involved wasn't his players or coaches he's not required to handle all things criminal, thats why schools along with corporate jobs have departments that handle and coordinate with the authorties when criminal matters are involved. This he is PSU is bulllll, hes just the public figure nothing more nothing less.

[TurboTA]

Originally Posted by ssump29

I'm sorry I don't agree. I go back to the witness, you know better you do better. My momma raised my right and I don't care how powerful someone is or suppose to be, if I see something I'm 100% sure of I'm not waiting for the said powerful person's approval, I'm going directly to the most powerful gang in the land the POLICE because no one including Joe PA is above the law and I don't need him to be the guy that makes all the decisions. So using that is a WEAK excuse of letting the people before HIM ever having knowledge off the hook.

LIKE I said where is ALLLLLLL you people's outrage at the mother, DA, police, and public welfare that did nothing in 98 when similar situation happened and SANDUSKY addmitted to doing it? Please explain yourselves?!?

ALL COULD HAVE ENDED in 1998, 1998, 19988888888888888. lol

I didn't mean more responsibility than the GA. He had the ultimate responsibility and failed. Paterno knew that Sandusky was questioned in '98 and that investigation was a joke for a variety of reasons. Fast forward a couple years and now you have a trusted GA tell you what he saw and you don't think there's a problem that needs addressed immediately once its brought to your attention? One call to the PSP, not campus security police, could have ended this. They all looked the other way for whatever reason.

[ssump29]

Originally Posted by PQ

I agree. Aboslutley agree. And if one of your employees told you he saw a murder the previous night, do you call your boss the NEXT day, or do you call the police? And then ask the employee why the hell he dind't.
Nobody TARGETED Joe Pa. He's the one we've had shoved in our face on Saturdays forever. And told what a perfedct guy he is. What odder, a guy we know NOTHING about doing something wrong or a guy who the entire country has been told was a Saint doing something wrong? And YES, it was wrong of him no tot clal the police.

NO, he isn't the bad guy here. YES he's the guy who's been on a pedestal. H'es held to a higher standard and rightfuly so. He's in a pssition as such. With responsibilities as such.

Agreed. And if we hadn't been told what a freakin' saint Joe is for so many years, it might not be that big a deal.

I'm not calling I'm telling him he needs to call and that if he needs my support while making his statement I will be there for him, but in no way am I getting involved in something that didn't involve me. And its for exact reasons now that you see why I would take that stand, not way am I having the duties of what this person saw fall onto me not happening.

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by PQ

I agree. Aboslutley agree. And if one of your employees told you he saw a murder the previous night, do you call your boss the NEXT day, or do you call the police? And then ask the employee why the hell he dind't.

Nobody TARGETED Joe Pa. He's the one we've had shoved in our face on Saturdays forever. And told what a perfedct guy he is. What odder, a guy we know NOTHING about doing something wrong or a guy who the entire country has been told was a Saint doing something wrong? And YES, it was wrong of him no tot clal the police.

NO, he isn't the bad guy here. YES he's the guy who's been on a pedestal. H'es held to a higher standard and rightfuly so. He's in a pssition as such. With responsibilities as such.

Agreed. And if we hadn't been told what a freakin' saint Joe is for so many years, it might not be that big a deal.

Again, Joe Is being held accountable for not doing all he could.

But one mistake, however grave it may be does not remove a life largely of good and positive actions.

Don't put Paterno in the same cell as the pedophile. if the criminal had not done this than none of the normally upstanding good people would have been in this situation.

Not that that excuses their own actions but they are not the same acts... Criminal is criminal, negligence is negligence... They are not the same.

[TurboTA]

Everyone involved in the situation and everyone commenting needs to ask themselves one simple question. What would a reasonable person have done in this situation. Whether you are the GA, Joe Pa, the adm etc......................Not a hard question to answer.

[ssump29]

Originally Posted by TurboTA

I didn't mean more responsibility than the GA. He had the ultimate responsibility and failed. Paterno knew that Sandusky was questioned in '98 and that investigation was a joke for a variety of reasons. Fast forward a couple years and now you have a trusted GA tell you what he saw and you don't think there's a problem that needs addressed immediately once its brought to your attention? One call to the PSP, not campus security police, could have ended this. They all looked the other way for whatever reason.

Ok and now I will say in this case its now the mother's responsibility to take down sandusky and make sure no other kid is harmed or put through the same thing. But once again like I've said people only worry about themselves so why is Joe given more responsibility then a mother a mother that had this happen to her kid, she should be the one not wanting this to happen anymore she has more invested being a parent of a victim then Joe Pa whos not invested in anyway to any of these kids.

[TurboTA]

Originally Posted by GTAHVIT

Again, Joe Is being held accountable for not doing all he could.

But one mistake, however grave it may be does not remove a life largely of good and positive actions.

Don't put Paterno in the same cell as the pedophile. if the criminal had not done this than none of the normally upstanding good people would have been in this situation.

Not that that excuses their own actions but they are not the same acts... Criminal is criminal, negligence is negligence... They are not the same.

I don't think anyone has said that Paterno is a criminal along the same lines as Sandusky.

[TurboTA]

Originally Posted by ssump29

Ok and now I will say in this case its now the mother's responsibility to take down sandusky and make sure no other kid is harmed or put through the same thing. But once again like I've said people only worry about themselves so why is Joe given more responsibility then a mother a mother that had this happen to her kid, she should be the one not wanting this to happen anymore she has more invested being a parent of a victim then Joe Pa whos not invested in anyway to any of these kids.

Several people failed along the way. But Joe is in a position to get things done, like it or not. He's saying all the right things now, but if he had thought that way at the time, a lot of children may have been spared the abuse.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by Russell James

Hindsight is so 20/20. Easy to see now, exactly what everybody should have done.

But even that is no sure bet. What if Joe did report it to the police. Who is to say that would have solved anything. The first incident was reported to and investigated by the police. Anything really happen after that?

Just seems like such a negetive way to look at it. THAT's why so many victims of abuse don't come forward. What if? What if this and what if that. Doens't matter, you report a rape of a child.

Me? I would have called the police. If McQueary is lying, they can arrest him.

Originally Posted by ssump29

I'm sorry I don't agree. I go back to the witness, you know better you do better. My momma raised my right and I don't care how powerful someone is or suppose to be, if I see something I'm 100% sure of I'm not waiting for the said powerful person's approval, I'm going directly to the most powerful gang in the land the POLICE because no one including Joe PA is above the law and I don't need him to be the guy that makes all the decisions. So using that is a WEAK excuse of letting the people before HIM ever having knowledge off the hook.

LIKE I said where is ALLLLLLL you people's outrage at the mother, DA, police, and public welfare that did nothing in 98 when similar situation happened and SANDUSKY addmitted to doing it? Please explain yourselves?!?

ALL COULD HAVE ENDED in 1998, 1998, 19988888888888888. lol

Nobody is absolving any of those others. This thread is about opinoins on Joe Paterno. Please tell me who has said it's all Joes fault?

Originally Posted by ssump29

I'm not calling I'm telling him he needs to call and that if he needs my support while making his statement I will be there for him, but in no way am I getting involved in something that didn't involve me. And its for exact reasons now that you see why I would take that stand, not way am I having the duties of what this person saw fall onto me not happening.

You'll never be good in a possition of that type of responsibility then. Joe Paterno had a responsibility that went beyond just coaching.