[khcoaching]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

Yup, also massively different suspension, larger brakes and other small things like solid rear cradle bushings. There's significant differences between the SLE and ZLE besides power and wheel/tire package. However, I got my SLE for $39.5k and the ZLE was about $70k, both good values for what they are but not really comparable.

I've been looking into cam/heads and I think you can DIY something for around $5k including new lifters for reliability, get within 50 hp of an LT4 (+100 whp), and rev to 7k. You save around $5k in labor if you do it yourself and it doesn't seem all that bad...

Yep, mine had solid bushings, DSSV, sway bars and the larger brakes.

Ken

[TransamGTA350]

I track my SS1LE. It's all stock except for brake fluid and track alignment. I'm very impressed with it's track capability, but I have not driven a ZL1 or ZLE, so I can't give you that comparison. I will say that the power level of the SS1LE and the handling/braking characteristics feel very well matched. With the ZL1 being basically the same chassis and brakes as the SS1LE, I could see that car feeling a bit overpowered for the chassis. The ZLE is probably a good match with it's DSSV dampers and aero.

As a track car, I can see what you're going through with the ZL1. I hadn't heard of the heat issues on track with either the ZL1 or ZLE (yes for the C7 Z06), but I'm not doubting you. I would say that in your case, moving to an SS1LE may not be a bad idea.

The SS1LE is great on track just the way it is (of course with high temp brake fluid and track alignment). You will keep up with and often be faster than most everything out there on a typical track day, as long as you have the skills. It's reasonably fast on the straights, but it shines on the turns if you drive it more like a momentum car (think Miata). Adding power is fine, but to be honest, I would stay away from heads/cam. You're going to lose a lot of reliability and durability doing that. Leave the motor internals alone. My recommendation for more power would be Kooks headers, LT2 intake, larger throttle body, Rotofab intake and a conservative tune. That will get you over 500hp at the crank and keep the reliability.

[cdrptrks]

Originally Posted by TransamGTA350

With the ZL1 being basically the same chassis and brakes as the SS1LE...

My recommendation for more power would be Kooks headers, LT2 intake, larger throttle body, Rotofab intake and a conservative tune. That will get you over 500hp at the crank and keep the reliability.

ZL1 brakes are larger diameter front and rear plus the ZL1 rotors are thicker than SS 1LE rotors.

If he lives in an emissions county in Texas and wants to keep the car street legal, catalytic converters are supposed to be checked for and they'd probably reduce the HP gain from headers.

[cdrptrks]

Originally Posted by Rapid_blue_zl1_22

I have a bit too much power on track and could see there being a benefit to losing a bit. The SS 1LE will be more consistent power wise as well since it won't be pulling timing when the blower gets heat soaked.

I was also planning to get ZL1 front fenders so I can still run my 1LE wheels with 305/325 SC3R's.

You can just use less throttle if you have too much power.
You should still be able to roll into full throttle on the straightaways without spinning the tires if they're not cold. You can probably get a tune for the ZL1 to limit torque/horsepower which might also help with your overheating rather than doing a bunch of labor to transfer parts between cars.

As someone else mentioned, ZLE wheels fit the SS 1LE with stock front fenders (you have to grind the strut aka strut mod for inner clearance) but you should put ppf on the sides of your car if you care about the paint because they stick out and throw rocks and stuff at the sides worse than stock tires.

[cdrptrks]

Originally Posted by Rapid_blue_zl1_22

The main reason I am wanting to do this is because the car can't be tracked in the hotter months (I live in Texas, it is always hot) due to the supercharger coolant getting too hot. I have been chasing cooler temperatures for months now with moderate success. I have done a chiller, expansion tank, fender tank, aftermarket oil cooler, FlexFuel sensor, and GMS front impact bar, all in the name of cooler MAT's on track.

I have a few options right now and not sure what I want to do:

1. Swap the OEM blower for a 2650 to keep it cooler. ($8k+)
2. Pull a ton of power out of the car and run higher E%. I don't know if this is even possible. I have very basic bolt ons.
3. Only track it in the cooler months
4. Sell the car and buy an SS 1LE. Transfer most of my parts from the ZL1 over.

At the end of the day, an SS 1LE and a regular ZL1 are very similar cars beside the power difference. If the SS makes close to ZL1 power with less weight and N/A, it would Basically be a 6th Gen Z28. It just seems like a simpler car and less things to worry about.

I own an SS 1LE and live in the Houston area. I try to avoid track days from May-September now even though the car can handle it just because the car feels so much worse on hot days sliding around everywhere even though I've previously successfully tracked the car on sunny days with ambient temperatures up to 99°F.

It is also physically unpleasant and tiring to do a track day (especially a 2 day event) in the heat of the summer even though I'm in shape.

Also I've driven my buddy's SS 1LE with intake/headers/exhaust making about 60whp extra back to back with my stock power SS 1LE and the lap time difference is around 2%, similar to the difference between me using stock 220tw Goodyear Supercar 3 tires and 100tw Goodyear Supercar 3R tires on ZLE wheels on my car.

[Rapid_blue_zl1_22]

Originally Posted by TransamGTA350

I track my SS1LE. It's all stock except for brake fluid and track alignment. I'm very impressed with it's track capability, but I have not driven a ZL1 or ZLE, so I can't give you that comparison. I will say that the power level of the SS1LE and the handling/braking characteristics feel very well matched. With the ZL1 being basically the same chassis and brakes as the SS1LE, I could see that car feeling a bit overpowered for the chassis. The ZLE is probably a good match with it's DSSV dampers and aero.

As a track car, I can see what you're going through with the ZL1. I hadn't heard of the heat issues on track with either the ZL1 or ZLE (yes for the C7 Z06), but I'm not doubting you. I would say that in your case, moving to an SS1LE may not be a bad idea.

The SS1LE is great on track just the way it is (of course with high temp brake fluid and track alignment). You will keep up with and often be faster than most everything out there on a typical track day, as long as you have the skills. It's reasonably fast on the straights, but it shines on the turns if you drive it more like a momentum car (think Miata). Adding power is fine, but to be honest, I would stay away from heads/cam. You're going to lose a lot of reliability and durability doing that. Leave the motor internals alone. My recommendation for more power would be Kooks headers, LT2 intake, larger throttle body, Rotofab intake and a conservative tune. That will get you over 500hp at the crank and keep the reliability.

To be fair this is only in the Summer months in Texas (90+ degrees). People with Stock ZL1's may not notice. The car just pulls timing when the MAT's get high. My car being tuned doesn't pull power until it hits 170 on the MAT's, but it basically goes into limp mode at that point. With being on E-30-40, my car can handle higher MAT temperatures than a ZL1 on 93. Wanting my car to not pull power on track was the entire reason I tuned it in the first place. I didn't want more power, I just wanted a safer fuel. I added headers at the same time to avoid blowing out the cats on track. I guess I can just keep the ZL1 and just not track from May-September, but that is kind of annoying.

[Coded4SS]

Some misinformation in this thread.
Zl1 has same cooling as a ZLE and a SS1le. The zle has slightly redesigned lower grill but thats it.

Also heat has never even once been an issue while i tracked the ss1le or the zl1 (115f track days running 20min my temps were good and never pulled power). At pace on stock car it dosnt heat soak. If you drag it will when sitting. If your modified either change your s/c or improve the coolers or both

My times between my ss1le amd zl1 at first werent significant until i got used to the power and using it to my advantage in the zl1. I then turned my track times into 6 seconds faster. Understand though on track the better driver is faster even with a slower car. Theres days i womp on much more prestige cars and theres days slower cars womp on me.

Your biggest difference besides power is costs. Zl1 drinks more gas, eats more tire, eats brakes slightly quicker. But the experience of 200hp more is a lot of fun and screaming s/c is a blast. There was times i wanted more hp in my ss1le and I havent said that with the zl1 at all. Personally id say add a bmr rear cradle lockout and add more negative camber on your alignment and you got a weapon

For small tight tracks the ss1le was a bit more agile or autoX. I get blue balls on some tracks with the Z. But any higher speed tracks the zl1 is at home. It takes a second to get used to that much power and weight on tighter canyons or tracks. But once you do your good.

[cdb95z28]

Originally Posted by Coded4SS

Some misinformation in this thread.
Zl1 has same cooling as a ZLE and a SS1le. The zle has slightly redesigned lower grill but thats it.

Also heat has never even once been an issue while i tracked the ss1le or the zl1 (115f track days running 20min my temps were good and never pulled power). At pace on stock car it dosnt heat soak. If you drag it will when sitting. If your modified either change your s/c or improve the coolers or both

My times between my ss1le amd zl1 at first werent significant until i got used to the power and using it to my advantage in the zl1. I then turned my track times into 6 seconds faster. Understand though on track the better driver is faster even with a slower car. Theres days i womp on much more prestige cars and theres days slower cars womp on me.

Your biggest difference besides power is costs. Zl1 drinks more gas, eats more tire, eats brakes slightly quicker. But the experience of 200hp more is a lot of fun and screaming s/c is a blast. There was times i wanted more hp in my ss1le and I havent said that with the zl1 at all. Personally id say add a bmr rear cradle lockout and add more negative camber on your alignment and you got a weapon

For small tight tracks the ss1le was a bit more agile or autoX. I get blue balls on some tracks with the Z. But any higher speed tracks the zl1 is at home. It takes a second to get used to that much power and weight on tighter canyons or tracks. But once you do your good.

The SS 1LE does have slightly different cooling than the ZL1/ZLE.

The aux coolers at each front corner of the SS 1LE are both for engine coolant.
The aux coolers on the ZL1s are engine coolant for the RF cooler and an aux supercharger intercooler for the LF cooler.



And to add info on the brake differences:
The ZL1/ZLE brakes are larger than the SS 1LE. Front calipers are bigger as are both the front and rear rotors. The rear calipers are not necessarily bigger but they are different. All the brake differences change when any of the variants (SS, SS 1LE, ZL1, ZLE) are spec'd with the the BCD copper free brake package. All the components are the same except for caliper color.

[DaveC113]

FWIW, Zs have 140-150 hp more than a SS. SAE hp is measured without accessories, in the Z's case that includes the supercharger, which eats 50-60 hp. WHP numbers are around 410 for a SS and 550 for a Z.

[Coded4SS]

Originally Posted by cdb95z28

The SS 1LE does have slightly different cooling than the ZL1/ZLE.

The aux coolers at each front corner of the SS 1LE are both for engine coolant.
The aux coolers on the ZL1s are engine coolant for the RF cooler and an aux supercharger intercooler for the LF cooler.



And to add info on the brake differences:
The ZL1/ZLE brakes are larger than the SS 1LE. Front calipers are bigger as are both the front and rear rotors. The rear calipers are not necessarily bigger but they are different. All the brake differences change when any of the variants (SS, SS 1LE, ZL1, ZLE) are spec'd with the the BCD copper free brake package. All the components are the same except for caliper color.

Good to know. Now i thought the zl1 bcd or otherwise had same brakes as the zle? Same size same brake no?

[cdb95z28]

Originally Posted by Coded4SS

Good to know. Now i thought the zl1 bcd or otherwise had same brakes as the zle? Same size same brake no?

Not ZLE alone. As I mentioned in my previous post, ALL ZL1s, whether they are ZL1 or ZLE share the same components EXCEPT calipers due to color change.

Kinda, yeah, the BCD is close to the pre-BCD ZL1 parts.

Now, I have one unconfirmed part of that.....I have not confirmed that the pre-BCD front ZL1 calipers are exactly the same dimensions as the BCD front calipers.......they do have something (minor) different that I won't get into due to a commitment I made to my source.....and that alone dictates a part # change. I do have a buddy who is running the pre-BCD rotor (390mm) rotor on his BCD equipped Camaro.


That being said,
BCD components are essentially the pre-BCD copper ZL1 sized components (rotors and calipers) except the front rotor (398mm) and pads.


Now, when you look at BCD vs pre-BCD part #s, there are some subtle changes that warrant the # change. The devil's in the details beyond the obvious front rotor diameter and pads with the pre-BCD vs BCD differences.

[Rapid_blue_zl1_22]

Originally Posted by Coded4SS

Some misinformation in this thread.
Zl1 has same cooling as a ZLE and a SS1le. The zle has slightly redesigned lower grill but thats it.

Also heat has never even once been an issue while i tracked the ss1le or the zl1 (115f track days running 20min my temps were good and never pulled power). At pace on stock car it dosnt heat soak. If you drag it will when sitting. If your modified either change your s/c or improve the coolers or both

My times between my ss1le amd zl1 at first werent significant until i got used to the power and using it to my advantage in the zl1. I then turned my track times into 6 seconds faster. Understand though on track the better driver is faster even with a slower car. Theres days i womp on much more prestige cars and theres days slower cars womp on me.

Your biggest difference besides power is costs. Zl1 drinks more gas, eats more tire, eats brakes slightly quicker. But the experience of 200hp more is a lot of fun and screaming s/c is a blast. There was times i wanted more hp in my ss1le and I havent said that with the zl1 at all. Personally id say add a bmr rear cradle lockout and add more negative camber on your alignment and you got a weapon

For small tight tracks the ss1le was a bit more agile or autoX. I get blue balls on some tracks with the Z. But any higher speed tracks the zl1 is at home. It takes a second to get used to that much power and weight on tighter canyons or tracks. But once you do your good.

I have upgraded my coolers and run a chiller. My supercharger coolant is BELOW ambient when I pull off track, but my MAT's are still 170 degrees. The OEM bricks just can't get rid of the heat fast enough. If you look back at some of my previous posts in this thread, I said that upgrading the supercharger was an option. I just don't know if I really want to dump another $8k into the car just to combat cooling. That is the whole reason I made this post. Trying to decide if it is worth keeping, or sell it and get an SS 1LE.

I have added BMR cradle lockout, Full SPL rear arms, Vorshlag camber plates, and DSC Sport suspension controller. The car does extremely well suspension/handling wise. I just can't do more than 2 laps in the summer months without hitting 170 degree MAT's.

This post wasn't made to try to fix the problem with my current car, I know what to do if needed. I do appreciate the feedback though.

[N Camarolina]

Your modded car having731 WHP, along with the comment from others that they don't seem to have heat problems during summer tracking of their ZL1's would seem to suggest that your summer heat problems might be due to some of your mods.

Since you are willing to significantly reduce power by switching to a SSLE, have you considered simply going back to stock on your ZL1? Maybe it's not an option for you at this point, but it sounds like a goldilocks zone to me (more power than an SS and without the heat soak issues you are seeking to avoid in your current setup). I'm not an expert on engines, just trying to help you consider options.

[Rapid_blue_zl1_22]

Originally Posted by N Camarolina

Your modded car having731 WHP, along with the comment from others that they don't seem to have heat problems during summer tracking of their ZL1's would seem to suggest that your summer heat problems might be due to some of your mods.

Since you are willing to significantly reduce power by switching to a SSLE, have you considered simply going back to stock on your ZL1? Maybe it's not an option for you at this point, but it sounds like a goldilocks zone to me (more power than an SS and without the heat soak issues you are seeking to avoid in your current setup). I'm not an expert on engines, just trying to help you consider options.

I had heat soak issues when the car was stock. That was the whole reason I put the car on E85 and tuned it. I didn't want more power. I got tired of paying $12+ a gallon for Sunoco 260GT at the track (100 octane) The car didn't HAVE to have it, and I could drive it like that. I could just feel the car pulling timing on 93. It probably would've been fine, but I just didn't like it. Maybe Texas is just a different type of heat. It isn't just hot here, we have insanely high humidity as well. I was a professional technician for 15 years, so I may be more sensitive to what the car is doing than some people. There are plenty of threads on this forum of other people that talk about the same issues I had.