[m6-lt1]

Over the past year I've heavily debated moving on from the Camaro platform as I really want to try different things. I also keep getting impatient waiting for track days to come in order to be able to truly have fun with the 1LE platform. Decided to pay to ship a car 1 state over through carmax. Their offer on my 1LE wasn't too bad so if I liked the car enough I would make the trade. I was able to test drive the below GT350 on my favorite roads. I had driven one before but it was only for 10 mins so I didn't get a great impression. This was a 2019 so it was the updated GT350

I'll start by talking about the seats. This one had the comfort seats which I did not like. There's a strong chance I would have made the move had it had the recaro's. i've sat in 350 recaros before and like them.

Handling and braking. I felt this car handled just as good as my 1LE. Same amount of body roll (which means virtually none), really good turn in. More than enough capable on public roads. The brakes were better. I hate how little bite the 6 piston chevy brakes have versus the 6 piston mustang and even challengers have better brake bite. The brakes are larger on the Shelby and the cars weigh the same as ours.

Transmission: both cars have great transmissions that feel different from each other. I don’t mean this in a bad way, they are just different.

Interior: some things I liked better on the Camaro and some things I like better on the GT350. While it doesn't have HUD the shift lights that reflect on the windshield are actually easier to read so in a way it's more effective than the HUD is for me. Fit and finish are the same imo. I am no longer going to defend the Camaro when people say the visibility sucks. How come sitting in the Mustang is like sitting in a fish bowl but the Camaro is like a tank? Chevy screwed up here and I completely understand why folks bought more Mustangs now.

Engine: i'm going to start by saying the comments about no low end torque are a bit overblown. If you love driving manual than you'll enjoy downshifting one gear each time you have to make a pass. Also the engine sounds so raw and visceral that you're going to probably be driving one gear lower anyway. The only time the lack of torque makes its self known is when you're in 6th and want to accelerate on the highway. The engine really is the star of the show. There is nothing else like it on the market.

Acceleration: Here is why I wound up keeping my car. 1st through 3rd the cars accelerated the same, at least it FELT the same. Once you shift into 4th from the top of 3rd that's when the GT350 starts to feel faster than our cars. It pulls MUCH HARDER in 4th than our cars do (when shifting into from the top of 3rd). If the car felt faster in 1st through 3rd I would have bought it. I didn't want an upgrade where I had to be doing a big number mph wise for it to feel faster.

All in all if I didn't have my 1LE and was test driving both cars and I had to pick one, I would probably have picked the G350 simply because that engine makes driving the car a more fun experience. For me to take the loss on trade in, the car just wasn't enough of an upgrade for what it would cost me to do it.

When buying these cars brand new in 2020, the GT350 was about 9k - 10k more than a 2SS 1LE. Personally I think it was worth it back then. While lap times are similar, the experience is not and the GT350 provides a very unique experience.

[m6-lt1]

bigger pictures

[arpad_m]

The GT350 is the only non-Camaro muscle car that has genuinely interested me, particularly because of that peculiar Voodoo engine with its super unique sound profile. Also, the GT350 doesn't look too bad, considering

Alas, it hasn't enough torque as you noticed, and I've already taken care of the lackluster higher gear/speed acceleration of the Camaro with my upgrades, so apart from wanting to drive a GT350 once or twice for fun, I don't feel the urge. Everything else about it is typical Ford anyway.

[DaveC113]

The problem is it's a Ford and the reliability of both the motor and trans is sub-par, combine that with an inferior chassis vs Alpha and despite the fact it's appealing and probably fun to drive, it's got too many potential issues.

[m6-lt1]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

The problem is it's a Ford and the reliability of both the motor and trans is sub-par, combine that with an inferior chassis vs Alpha and despite the fact it's appealing and probably fun to drive, it's got too many potential issues.

The trans on the Gt350’s are tremecs. They are fine. Because of the stories I’ve heard of the voodoo engine I was going to get carmax’s extended warranty for piece of mind. That being said I don’t trust post covid LT1’s either. Wouldn’t own one without warranty anymore. Seen a lot of them blow up the past year in the 1LE FB group both on and off track. I think it has a lot to do with the L87 recall. I upgraded my daily to a truck and one of the reasons was so I can tow my 1LE if the LT1 decides to go boom.

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by m6-lt1

The trans on the Gt350’s are tremecs. They are fine. Because of the stories I’ve heard of the voodoo engine I was going to get carmax’s extended warranty for piece of mind. That being said I don’t trust post covid LT1’s either. Wouldn’t own one without warranty anymore. Seen a lot of them blow up the past year in the 1LE FB group both on and off track. I think it has a lot to do with the L87 recall. I upgraded my daily to a truck and one of the reasons was so I can tow my 1LE if the LT1 decides to go boom.

They're Tremecs, but a friend had one go on his GT350R, apparently they are 3060 with Ford in-house modifications.

To be fair I the later ones seem to be better, but it was also a major issue for Ford to replace warranty engines, people were waiting a long time for them. I also heard there was an incident where Ford "found" a bunch of motors and they somehow got auctioned off instead of being used for warranty replacements, but I can't verify that.

I do really like the GT350s, they are the best Mustangs and the overall driving experience is really good. It's hard for me to trust Ford though, as an engineer I don't often agree with their design choices and priorities, but every brand has their issues.

The L87 issue is mostly a result of spec'ing 0w20 oil to boost fuel economy. This is becoming an issue, the mfg'er is actually weighing the regulatory benefits of increased fuel economy vs engine reliability now. I found out that's why our battery charging system kills batteries so fast, you get better fuel economy if you don't properly maintain the battery. This is across most all brands, on a friend's Nissan truck there's a fix, you cut out some inductor near the battery... idk if there's one for our cars but I do want to look into it at some point. Using a charger has kept my 2nd battery alive much longer than my 1st... BTW, I've seen as low as 0w8 oil now...

[m6-lt1]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

They're Tremecs, but a friend had one go on his GT350R, apparently they are 3060 with Ford in-house modifications.

To be fair I the later ones seem to be better, but it was also a major issue for Ford to replace warranty engines, people were waiting a long time for them. I also heard there was an incident where Ford "found" a bunch of motors and they somehow got auctioned off instead of being used for warranty replacements, but I can't verify that.

I do really like the GT350s, they are the best Mustangs and the overall driving experience is really good. It's hard for me to trust Ford though, as an engineer I don't often agree with their design choices and priorities, but every brand has their issues.

The L87 issue is mostly a result of spec'ing 0w20 oil to boost fuel economy. This is becoming an issue, the mfg'er is actually weighing the regulatory benefits of increased fuel economy vs engine reliability now. I found out that's why our battery charging system kills batteries so fast, you get better fuel economy if you don't properly maintain the battery. This is across most all brands, on a friend's Nissan truck there's a fix, you cut out some inductor near the battery... idk if there's one for our cars but I do want to look into it at some point. Using a charger has kept my 2nd battery alive much longer than my 1st... BTW, I've seen as low as 0w8 oil now...

I agree that 0w20 was used to satisfy cafe standards but I don’t believe this is the problem with the l87’s. I believe it’s a quality control issue and using 0w40 is just a bandaid to get them past the warranty period so GM loses less money on this whole ordeal. Again LT1’s post covid haven’t faired as well as the older LT1’s and they are filled with 0w40. They share a ton of parts with the L87. The long block is exactly the same. Maybe the camshaft is different but that’s it. Internally they are basically identical and you’ll see matching part numbers on summit/rock auto for parts like crank, pistons, etc.

[TransamGTA350]

Originally Posted by m6-lt1

I agree that 0w20 was used to satisfy cafe standards but I don’t believe this is the problem with the l87’s. I believe it’s a quality control issue and using 0w40 is just a bandaid to get them past the warranty period so GM loses less money on this whole ordeal. Again LT1’s post covid haven’t faired as well as the older LT1’s and they are filled with 0w40. They share a ton of parts with the L87. The long block is exactly the same. Maybe the camshaft is different but that’s it. Internally they are basically identical and you’ll see matching part numbers on summit/rock auto for parts like crank, pistons, etc.

I agree. The L87 was designed to be able to use 0w20 oil, however the motors built between 2021 and 2024 have a manufacturing issue that is causing excessive clearance in the main and/or connecting rod bearings. The excessive bearing clearance is too much for 0w20 to protect the bearing/journal from contacting each other, causing damage and failure. 0w40 would offer better protection in that situation (whether it offers enough protection, who knows since we don't know what the "new" bearing clearance is).

As we all know, the same lower end is in the LT1 motors with 0w40 factory fill and some of those motors have also had lower end issues (spun bearings, thrown rods). Probably not to the same % failure as the L87 with 0w20, but there still seems to be something there. GM is putting a 10 year/150,000 mile extended warranty on the L87 motors that pass inspection and get changed to 0w40 oil. The replacement motors will stay with 0w20. I would not be surprised if the extended warranty on the motors gets extended to the LT1's and maybe LT2's (I'm assuming the LT2 also has the same bottom end parts) built during that same time period. It's not GM's priority right now as the truck motors are failing at a much higher rate and they build so many more of them than LT1's and LT2's.


The L87 came out in 2019 and was factory filled with 0w20 oil. The motors built in 2019-2020 and 2025 do not have this bottom end bearing issue (at least not to this same % failure rate, there will always be some failures)

The previous L86 6.2's were also 0w20 oil, as were the L83 5.3's and the current L84 5.3's. All of these motors seem to be fine with the 0w20. I've had an L86 and currently an L83 with no issues with 0w20 oil. I do also currently have a 2024 L87 that is part of the recall. It is not having any issues at the moment and I haven't yet received the letter to bring it in for the recall. We'll see what happens with that.

[Boost Creep]

To be fair, everything post covid is garbage.

[texSSin]

Originally Posted by Boost Creep

To be fair, everything post covid is garbage.

I’m in this camp. I don’t think I would buy a vehicle newer than 2019-20’ maybe to ‘21.

[Bosse'sBoss]

When I test drove an early new Shelby GT350 I owned a 5th gen Camaro ZL1. From the exterior without the stripes the car looked like a regular Mustang GT for most people, the interior was the same, the Recaros weren't electric. While driving the car, it was addictive to hear that loud exhaust while shifting at 8000 RPMs, but noticed that as a daily street driver wasn't the car for me, below 4000 RPM the car was lifeless, in first shift it already was above the speed limit of 55 mph. And also told the dealer that it was absurd that they were charging 10K above msrp. Instead I went and bought a C7 Corvette Z51 3LT, which I considered it was a better car for the $

[Rich292]

I have mixed feelings about the GT350.


The car is a mix of character from other cars. From the few I test drove, they seemed like a middle ground between a Porsche and my 5th gen Z/28. The Z/28 was a more brutal, rough feeling car. It rides stiffer, the shifter feels more weighty, and the GT350 has a smoother ride from the magnetic shocks and a lighter shifter throw. Overall, an excellent car, though.


However, that engine is both the best and worst feature of the car. It has a lot of character, and it does sound cool with lots of power. But, the reliability of those motors is...less than ideal. As is the cost of replacement (way higher than an LT1, and good luck building your own to save some cash). They have a lot more problems than the LT1. There's also the issue of vibration. It's by far the longest stroke flat plane engine that's ever been sold. The design of that engine and the vibration it has to deal with makes me question if even a well made example (i.e., no defective parts that would otherwise fail) doesn't have a shorter service life than a more traditional v8 design. That traditional v8 design is the standard for a reason...it's the better option in almost all circumstances.


Now, the Mach 1/Dark Horse, that looks like a better option. You get the Tremec transmission like the GT350, you get an equivalently good chassis, and the engine is a little less exciting, but should last much longer. And if you're missing that little extra bit of power, there are ways to make up the difference and then some with the Coyote engine.

[DeuceCam]

I sat in GT350 but didn't get to drive it. I'm tall and didn't like the seating position because I felt perched up on top of the seat which was a deal breaker (it had recaros). I also sat in s650 with performance pack/recaros and the seat went much lower and was acceptable imo.

The camaro's standard seats go nice and low.

This is how a tall person approaches buying cars. Lol. I need to make sure the seating position is comfortable first