[Kami]

So this will be my second vehicle I will have owned and have never driven a manual unless you can consider my '09 Kawasaki Zx6R. Why do some people say that manual is faster or automatic is faster? Also what is rev matching, I hear that word thrown around a lot. Is there performance lost with either compared to the other. I saw the other thread that had all the votes and it was pretty much 50/50.

[cwl011]

For the sake of the gen6 camaro it is looking like the automatic tranny might be a tad faster. The whole manual vs auto is based on the time between shifts. The newer performance trannies are pretty quick plus you are less likely to screw up. However, active rev matching helps the manual side out by matching the engine rpms when you shift up or down. A lot of pros use the heel toes technique but now it will be automated. This whole process prevent engine braking and smooth shifts. On the new camaro it is going to come down to personal preference. I will be getting a manual for the sake of the experience.

[thefirstcause]

You are buying your car in a time when this issue is really starting to become personal preference over any particular benefit. Some people that dislike autos are still stuck in the past when automatics sucked and haven't evolved with the times. While other people simply love the feel shifting the gears via stick and feel more connected to the car.

Personally, I'm going auto, I've driven a lot of manuals and I'm completely done. For the camaro6 the auto it will be faster, and I've felt for a while that manual is an obsolete technology, and personally doesn't make me feel any more connected with the car. For others it does, so it is nice they have the option still, but it is an option that may disappear in the future completely.

[Bhobbs]

The automatic will be faster in a straight line. When it comes to the track, we don't know yet.

[Jeffro19]

Looks like the auto will be quick shifting and a tad quicker than the manual. But I will still be getting a manual. Much more fun if you ask me

[SuperSound]

Faster shifting isn't the only reason the auto is faster, gearing is also a big part. The launch on the A8 is much stronger. Check out these ratios

[EE7]

In terms of the ats-v the auto is significantly faster.

[whiteboyblues2001]

Originally Posted by EE7

In terms of the ats-v the auto is significantly faster.

Same for the C7 Corvette.

[whiteboyblues2001]

Auto vs. Manual can be a very emotional issue. Many folks are old school and love to manually shift gears. They claim to be more connected to the car (even though pushing in the cluch technically disconnects the engine from the rest of the drive train). Others prefer the automatic because it is faster (usually) nowadays, or because they like the flexability of an automaic (they can be operated manually or automatically), or can't drive a stick.

Here is some info for those who are undecided:
1. The drivetrain of a car is not friction free, so it reduces the amount of HP and TQ at the wheel compared to the HP/TQ at the crank. Maunal transmissions rob you of less HP/TQ than automatics, but the difference has been shrinking for many years, and now is not much nearly as much of a difference.

2. Automatics can now shift gears significantly faster than any human using a manual.

3. It used to be that manuals were significantly faster (in 0-60 and 1/4 mile) than autos. Because of 1 and 2 autos are now faster.

4. Some automatics (like the Camaro) provide a manual mode so the driver shifts the car by pushing a button (the Camaro has paddle shifters on the steering wheel). So you can use manual mode when you want to shift manually, or automatic mode, when you want it to act like an automatic.

5. Automatics can have multiple shift points programs (the Camaro has this), so when you are in automatic mode, the car will upshift and downshift at different RPM's depending if you are in Touring Mode, Sport Mode, or Track Mode (or Snow/Ice Mode). So if you are driving in Track mode, the car will not upshift until you approach redline, but if you are in Touring mode, it will shift sooner. The manual is all up to you.

6. Some automatics (like the Camaro) also will not upshift as quickly when you are in Sport or Track mode. So let's say you are racing at the track. When you come to a turn, let off the gas, and hit the brakes, an older automatic would upshift. Then when you exit the turn, you are in the wrong gear. Then you have to wait for the car to downshift again while trying to extit the turn. The new autos, when in track mode (and to some extent Sport Mode), will sense the hard braking and turning, and assume you don't want an upshift. That way, when you exit the turn, you are in the right gear. The manual is all up to you.

7. Let's say you are at the track racing with a manual, and you enter a turn. You let off the gas, and hit the brake, and you need to downshift. When you depress the clutch, the RPM's drop, but when you chose a lower gear, you want the RPM's to be higher (that was the purpose for your downshift after all). When you let off the clutch, the engine slows the car down until the engine RPM's match the speed of the car for that gear, and continue to slow the car down until you hit the gas. For this reason, race car drivers (and advanced amateurs) will use their heel to depress the brake pedal, and use their toe to hit the gas pedal to increase RPMs so they match the speed of the car for that downshifted gear. This is called "heel toe" shifting. Modern manuals (like the Camaro) now have Active Rev Matching, so when activated, the engine will open the trottle to make the engine operate at the right RPM's for the gear you are shifting to, eliminating the need for Heel Toe shifting.

8. In the Camaro, the automatic costs more money (although we don't know how much yet.)

9. Manuals are a bit lighter generally, and are less complicated than automatics, but in practice, I have seen manuals needing more costly work than an auto. If you maintain your car well, but drive hard, you will need a new clutch in a manual sooner or later. To replace a clutch, you have to remove the engine, so it's not cheap. Autos don't have that issue.

10. Most automatics operate using a torque converter, which means there is no clutch, but uses fluid instead. Some automatics are now just a manual with an automatic shifting feature - these are called Dual Clutch Transmission (DCT) (sometimes called semi-automatic transmission) and shift faster than an automatic and have less reduction in HP/TQ to the wheels. The Camaro does NOT have this type of automatic.

11. The automatic usually gets slightly better gas mileage.

12. In the Camaro, the automaic will come with Active Fuel Management, that under certain conditions operates the engine on four cylinders instead of 8, giving you a little better MPG's on top of #11 above. Many folks don't like this feature, and want to disable it. In the new Camaro, it is disabled in some of the driving modes like Track (and possible Sport), but I am not sure yet which mode do and which modes don't.

These are some of the details that folks consider when deciding. Neither is right or wrong, just personal preference. Please let me know if I left anything out (I probably forgot a factor or two, but I am sure someone will point them out as well).

[amerhash28]

Originally Posted by whiteboyblues2001

Auto vs. Manual can be a very emotional issue. Many folks are old school and love to manually shift gears. They claim to be more connected to the car (even though pushing in the cluch technically disconnects the engine from the rest of the drive train). Others prefer the automatic because it is faster (usually) nowadays, or because they like the flexability of an automaic (they can be operated manually or automatically), or can't drive a stick.

Here is some info for those who are undecided:
1. The drivetrain of a car is not friction free, so it reduces the amount of HP and TQ at the wheel compared to the HP/TQ at the crank. Maunal transmissions rob you of less HP/TQ than automatics, but the difference has been shrinking for many years, and now is not much nearly as much of a difference.

2. Automatics can now shift gears significantly faster than any human using a manual.

3. It used to be that manuals were significantly faster (in 0-60 and 1/4 mile) than autos. Because of 1 and 2 autos are now faster.

4. Some automatics (like the Camaro) provide a manual mode so the driver shifts the car by pushing a button (the Camaro has paddle shifters on the steering wheel). So you can use manual mode when you want to shift manually, or automatic mode, when you want it to act like an automatic.

5. Automatics can have multiple shift points programs (the Camaro has this), so when you are in automatic mode, the car will upshift and downshift at different RPM's depending if you are in Touring Mode, Sport Mode, or Track Mode (or Snow/Ice Mode). So if you are driving in Track mode, the car will not upshift until you approach redline, but if you are in Touring mode, it will shift sooner. The manual is all up to you.

6. Some automatics (like the Camaro) also will not upshift as quickly when you are in Sport or Track mode. So let's say you are racing at the track. When you come to a turn, let off the gas, and hit the brakes, an older automatic would upshift. Then when you exit the turn, you are in the wrong gear. Then you have to wait for the car to downshift again while trying to extit the turn. The new autos, when in track mode (and to some extent Sport Mode), will sense the hard braking and turning, and assume you don't want an upshift. That way, when you exit the turn, you are in the right gear. The manual is all up to you.

7. Let's say you are at the track racing with a manual, and you enter a turn. You let off the gas, and hit the brake, and you need to downshift. When you depress the clutch, the RPM's drop, but when you chose a lower gear, you want the RPM's to be higher (that was the purpose for your downshift after all). When you let off the clutch, the engine slows the car down until the engine RPM's match the speed of the car for that gear, and continue to slow the car down until you hit the gas. For this reason, race car drivers (and advanced amateurs) will use their heel to depress the brake pedal, and use their toe to hit the gas pedal to increase RPMs so they match the speed of the car for that downshifted gear. This is called "heel toe" shifting. Modern manuals (like the Camaro) now have Active Rev Matching, so when activated, the engine will open the trottle to make the engine operate at the right RPM's for the gear you are shifting to, eliminating the need for Heel Toe shifting.

8. In the Camaro, the automatic costs more money (although we don't know how much yet.)

9. Manuals are a bit lighter generally, and are less complicated than automatics, but in practice, I have seen manuals needing more costly work than an auto. If you maintain your car well, but drive hard, you will need a new clutch in a manual sooner or later. To replace a clutch, you have to remove the engine, so it's not cheap. Autos don't have that issue.

10. Most automatics operate using a torque converter, which means there is no clutch, but uses fluid instead. Some automatics are now just a manual with an automatic shifting feature - these are called Dual Clutch Transmission (DCT) (sometimes called semi-automatic transmission) and shift faster than an automatic and have less reduction in HP/TQ to the wheels. The Camaro does NOT have this type of automatic.

11. The automatic usually gets slightly better gas mileage.

12. In the Camaro, the automaic will come with Active Fuel Management, that under certain conditions operates the engine on four cylinders instead of 8, giving you a little better MPG's on top of #11 above. Many folks don't like this feature, and want to disable it. In the new Camaro, it is disabled in some of the driving modes like Track (and possible Sport), but I am not sure yet which mode do and which modes don't.

These are some of the details that folks consider when deciding. Neither is right or wrong, just personal preference. Please let me know if I left anything out (I probably forgot a factor or two, but I am sure someone will point them out as well).

Thanks for this great post with all these good information. I agree on every thing u said but I believe the most important factor for choosing is taste and personal preference.i have an auto but I love the feel in the manual(makes me feel sporty all the time lol).I will ve tracking this car once a week and I don't want heat issues(I know it has 3 radiators) so I will go with manual this time.the reason I don't like the manual mode in autos is that they are slow but in some cases like the Ferrari F12 i enjoyed it billion times more than the manual its duel clutch,super fast changing gears,super smooth.if the camaro gets duel clutch in future I will definitely go with auto

[jaymsu]

Is manual faster than auto?
It used to be. Not any more, with newer automatic technologies, especially in straight line.
Is manual more fun? Definitely.

Originally Posted by amerhash28

I will ve tracking this car once a week and I don't want heat issues(I know it has 3 radiators) so I will go with manual this time.the reason I don't like the manual mode in autos is that they are slow but in some cases like the Ferrari F12 i enjoyed it billion times more than the manual its duel clutch,super fast changing gears,super smooth.if the camaro gets duel clutch in future I will definitely go with auto

When you say 'track', you mean road course, not drag strip, right? If you track every week, you will become one heck of a driver. Make sure you flush the brake fluid with some nice DOT4 ones, and you may need to do that probably 2-3 times a year, if you track your car that often. Have fun!

[DanaM]

Hi drive my current car in manual mode all the time it's fun and it's just habit but I miss kieres a lot and I've lost a few races that way I've won a ton of races when it's been an automatic mode but I get bored driving like that

[PalmerGA]

Originally Posted by DanaM

Hi drive my current car in manual mode all the time it's fun and it's just habit but I miss kieres a lot and I've lost a few races that way I've won a ton of races when it's been an automatic mode but I get bored driving like that

What are "kieres"?

If I go to a Gen6, which I probably will in 2017, I'll be getting the A8 for sure - my shifting days are over. The variable driving modes are going to make the Gen6 SS an awesome ride!

[thefirstcause]

Originally Posted by whiteboyblues2001

Auto vs. Manual can be a very emotional issue. Many folks are old school and love to manually shift gears. They claim to be more connected to the car (even though pushing in the cluch technically disconnects the engine from the rest of the drive train). Others prefer the automatic because it is faster (usually) nowadays, or because they like the flexability of an automaic (they can be operated manually or automatically), or can't drive a stick.

Here is some info for those who are undecided:
1. The drivetrain of a car is not friction free, so it reduces the amount of HP and TQ at the wheel compared to the HP/TQ at the crank. Maunal transmissions rob you of less HP/TQ than automatics, but the difference has been shrinking for many years, and now is not much nearly as much of a difference.

2. Automatics can now shift gears significantly faster than any human using a manual.

3. It used to be that manuals were significantly faster (in 0-60 and 1/4 mile) than autos. Because of 1 and 2 autos are now faster.

4. Some automatics (like the Camaro) provide a manual mode so the driver shifts the car by pushing a button (the Camaro has paddle shifters on the steering wheel). So you can use manual mode when you want to shift manually, or automatic mode, when you want it to act like an automatic.

5. Automatics can have multiple shift points programs (the Camaro has this), so when you are in automatic mode, the car will upshift and downshift at different RPM's depending if you are in Touring Mode, Sport Mode, or Track Mode (or Snow/Ice Mode). So if you are driving in Track mode, the car will not upshift until you approach redline, but if you are in Touring mode, it will shift sooner. The manual is all up to you.

6. Some automatics (like the Camaro) also will not upshift as quickly when you are in Sport or Track mode. So let's say you are racing at the track. When you come to a turn, let off the gas, and hit the brakes, an older automatic would upshift. Then when you exit the turn, you are in the wrong gear. Then you have to wait for the car to downshift again while trying to extit the turn. The new autos, when in track mode (and to some extent Sport Mode), will sense the hard braking and turning, and assume you don't want an upshift. That way, when you exit the turn, you are in the right gear. The manual is all up to you.

7. Let's say you are at the track racing with a manual, and you enter a turn. You let off the gas, and hit the brake, and you need to downshift. When you depress the clutch, the RPM's drop, but when you chose a lower gear, you want the RPM's to be higher (that was the purpose for your downshift after all). When you let off the clutch, the engine slows the car down until the engine RPM's match the speed of the car for that gear, and continue to slow the car down until you hit the gas. For this reason, race car drivers (and advanced amateurs) will use their heel to depress the brake pedal, and use their toe to hit the gas pedal to increase RPMs so they match the speed of the car for that downshifted gear. This is called "heel toe" shifting. Modern manuals (like the Camaro) now have Active Rev Matching, so when activated, the engine will open the trottle to make the engine operate at the right RPM's for the gear you are shifting to, eliminating the need for Heel Toe shifting.

8. In the Camaro, the automatic costs more money (although we don't know how much yet.)

9. Manuals are a bit lighter generally, and are less complicated than automatics, but in practice, I have seen manuals needing more costly work than an auto. If you maintain your car well, but drive hard, you will need a new clutch in a manual sooner or later. To replace a clutch, you have to remove the engine, so it's not cheap. Autos don't have that issue.

10. Most automatics operate using a torque converter, which means there is no clutch, but uses fluid instead. Some automatics are now just a manual with an automatic shifting feature - these are called Dual Clutch Transmission (DCT) (sometimes called semi-automatic transmission) and shift faster than an automatic and have less reduction in HP/TQ to the wheels. The Camaro does NOT have this type of automatic.

11. The automatic usually gets slightly better gas mileage.

12. In the Camaro, the automaic will come with Active Fuel Management, that under certain conditions operates the engine on four cylinders instead of 8, giving you a little better MPG's on top of #11 above. Many folks don't like this feature, and want to disable it. In the new Camaro, it is disabled in some of the driving modes like Track (and possible Sport), but I am not sure yet which mode do and which modes don't.

These are some of the details that folks consider when deciding. Neither is right or wrong, just personal preference. Please let me know if I left anything out (I probably forgot a factor or two, but I am sure someone will point them out as well).

Great post, sums up why I want the auto.