[Ryephile]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

A manual transmission, MR & NPP equipped 1 or 2SS will get you 98% of the way there in terms of feel and performance on the street...without the accelerated treadwear, cold-weather/hydroplaning concerns, extra cost for brake components, or accelerated rock-chippage from the wide tires.

I'm not knocking your purchase, folks are free to buy whatever they want for whatever they want. But I wouldn't recommend a 1LE to someone who never takes it to the track.

Not even close. The roll-couple improvement going from FE3 to FE4 is night-and-day. The FE3 kept the Camaro off my radar, the FE4 put it within my wheelhouse.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

Not even close. The roll-couple improvement going from FE3 to FE4 is night-and-day. The FE3 kept the Camaro off my radar, the FE4 put it within my wheelhouse.

Of course! The 1LE improves on an already competently-tuned chassis. There is no doubt in my mind that the 1LE packages of all flavors (Turbo, V6, SS, and ZL1) dramatically enhance the capabilities of their respective "base" cars. That's why I bought one and why I, personally would not consider a non-1LE model.

But we were discussing use on the street. At least that's what I thought we were talking about. And that's where I referenced the percentage. Most who, like I said, don't track the car would likely never notice these enhancements. A few others, who bought it for the hood wrap and red brakes (), might even consider the cars too stiff and uncomfortable .

[Ryephile]

You're implying the difference between a driver that's ignorant and one that's attuned to the calibration.

Just because someone doesn't take this car to the track doesn't make them incompetent. You're over-generalizing to make a fast-and-loose point.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

You're implying the difference between a driver that's ignorant and one that's attuned to the calibration.

Just because someone doesn't take this car to the track doesn't make them incompetent. You're over-generalizing to make a fast-and-loose point.

No, I don't think it's a matter of ignorant or not. I've just read a lot of reactions to a lot of performance variants over the years. I don't think I'm very far off-base at all. This is the same reason why the Camaro Team went out of their way to make the ZL1 1LE's ride quality sound scary during the release. Too many people bought the Gen 5 1LE and Z/28 expecting...well, I don't know what they expected! But it wasn't that stiff of a ride, and they weren't happy with their purchase.

The fact is (and you might say it's a sad fact), those that are attuned to the calibration are very few and far between. Most people on this website are at least aware of it. You are clearly one of those that appreciates the upgrades, and that's something to be proud of, as far as I'm concerned. Having said that, perhaps I was too quick to respond the way I did.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

You're implying the difference between a driver that's ignorant and one that's attuned to the calibration.

Just because someone doesn't take this car to the track doesn't make them incompetent. You're over-generalizing to make a fast-and-loose point.

Agreed. This won't be my primary track car but I wasn't moved at all to buy the 2016 SS I drove. Bought the Focus RS instead.

I am really enjoying the 1LE.

But I didn't complain about the Gen 5 Z/28 being too stiff or anything either.. loved that car just couldn't get one for the right price. The 1LE is a much better rounded car than the old Z/28 of course.

[SociallyAwk]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

A manual transmission, MR & NPP equipped 1 or 2SS will get you 98% of the way there in terms of feel and performance on the street...without the accelerated treadwear, cold-weather/hydroplaning concerns, extra cost for brake components, or accelerated rock-chippage from the wide tires.

I'm not knocking your purchase, folks are free to buy whatever they want for whatever they want. But I wouldn't recommend a 1LE to someone who never takes it to the track.

Eventually I plan to track this, but on initial purchase- I never had it in mind.
When conditions are safe for myself and other people, I drive this thing hard through the rare supply of twisty roads (as twisty as you can get in FL) and hairpins.
I tested my 1LE and my buddy's 2SS on the same road, and man.. I would never have settled for a non-1LE equipped car.
I'm a very spirited driver and I can tell I would be at home on a track, but I love street driving so much!
I've also been in hairy situations where the eLSD and brakes have saved my ass from thinking I was more capable than I actually was at the time (much better now thanks to plenty of seat time).
However, what I'm getting at is that the increased maintenance you've described is well worth it for this individual driver on the street without a need for the track.
Realistically.. I'd say I can drive this car 8/10ths to it's capabilities on my specified roads.
With a non-1LE car, it seemed like 6/10ths for lack of confidence and increased body roll.

[Ethel19]

As the person who started this thread I have to say a couple of things.
First, I really appreciate the varied opinions people have brought to the table. Second, I also appreciate how people here can have different points of view without anyone insulting anyone else. Everyone respects everyone else’s perspective. Thank you.
It does seem to be that direction of the tread has morphed a bit into the use of the car. I should have made that a little bit more clear from the start.
First let me say I have no intent to track the car. I’ve had enough cars in the past that I’ve tracked that I don’t feel the need to at my age. (Not to knock on anyone tracking their cars at my age of 64 or any other age.....track at 84 if you can, good on you) so you might ask, what’s the point in getting a 1LE if I’m not going to track it? Fair enough of a question. I mean just get a regular 2SS for that matter, right?
I’ll tell you why. Because even if I’m going to get on an on ramp onto the freeway, or go thru some back roads, or go get milk in my car, I want feel the “feel” that the 1LE has. It corners flat as a pancake, the steering is perfectly weighted, the short shifter is way better, IMHO, than not just a 2SS, but also any car I’ve ever driven. Why not have that enjoyment ALL the time? Not just a track, ALL THE TIME! I don’t need to drive like a nut case to enjoy what this car has to offer. Even at regular speeds this car just seems to be fantastic.
I want to experience that feeling all the time.
Again, thanks for all the input. Anyone else want to throw their 2 cents worth in?

[Boost Creep]

Try to get one with the PDR.
Pretty cool option even if you just use it for a dash cam.

[Boosted_ST]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

A manual transmission, MR & NPP equipped 1 or 2SS will get you 98% of the way there in terms of feel and performance on the street...without the accelerated treadwear, cold-weather/hydroplaning concerns, extra cost for brake components, or accelerated rock-chippage from the wide tires.

I'm not knocking your purchase, folks are free to buy whatever they want for whatever they want. But I wouldn't recommend a 1LE to someone who never takes it to the track.

I was originally going to purchase a 2SS but ended up with a 2SS 1LE after test-driving both of them back-to-back.

There are major differences b/w a 1LE and a non-1LE Camaro SS over and above the MRC and NPP. They are:
- Short-throw shifter. This is huge
- Amazingly comfortable Recaro Seats
- eLSD
- Forged Rims that lock amazing
- Front Splitter
- Wrapped Hood
- Sueded boot, shifter, and steering wheels
- Upgraded brakes -> Major reason why I got the 1LE over a regular 2SS even though I do not plan on taking it to the track any time soon.

[Eldi Z]

Originally Posted by Ethel19

As the person who started this thread I have to say a couple of things.
First, I really appreciate the varied opinions people have brought to the table. Second, I also appreciate how people here can have different points of view without anyone insulting anyone else. Everyone respects everyone else’s perspective. Thank you.
It does seem to be that direction of the tread has morphed a bit into the use of the car. I should have made that a little bit more clear from the start.
First let me say I have no intent to track the car. I’ve had enough cars in the past that I’ve tracked that I don’t feel the need to at my age. (Not to knock on anyone tracking their cars at my age of 64 or any other age.....track at 84 if you can, good on you) so you might ask, what’s the point in getting a 1LE if I’m not going to track it? Fair enough of a question. I mean just get a regular 2SS for that matter, right?
I’ll tell you why. Because even if I’m going to get on an on ramp onto the freeway, or go thru some back roads, or go get milk in my car, I want feel the “feel” that the 1LE has. It corners flat as a pancake, the steering is perfectly weighted, the short shifter is way better, IMHO, than not just a 2SS, but also any car I’ve ever driven. Why not have that enjoyment ALL the time? Not just a track, ALL THE TIME! I don’t need to drive like a nut case to enjoy what this car has to offer. Even at regular speeds this car just seems to be fantastic.
I want to experience that feeling all the time.
Again, thanks for all the input. Anyone else want to throw their 2 cents worth in?

Perfect summary and exactly in-line with my thoughts on the topic.

[Wyzz Kydd]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

A manual transmission, MR & NPP equipped 1 or 2SS will get you 98% of the way there in terms of feel and performance on the street...without the accelerated treadwear, cold-weather/hydroplaning concerns, extra cost for brake components, or accelerated rock-chippage from the wide tires.

I'm not knocking your purchase, folks are free to buy whatever they want for whatever they want. But I wouldn't recommend a 1LE to someone who never takes it to the track.

No, it won't. I've owned a 2016 1SS and now own a 2018 1SS 1LE and I can tell you from experience that the MR and transmission aren't '98%' of the difference. There is a world of difference between the suspensions and the eDiff as well, not to mention the tires and brakes.

[TRZ06]

Originally Posted by Wyzz Kydd

No, it won't. I've owned a 2016 1SS and now own a 2018 1SS 1LE and I can tell you from experience that the MR and transmission aren't '98%' of the difference. There is a world of difference between the suspensions and the eDiff as well, not to mention the tires and brakes.

People always forget what isn't obvious. One of the BIGGEST differences between the standard SS and the 1LE are the BUSHING SET used.

It sounds simple and underwhelming, but the bushings play a HUGE part of feel and tightness of a car. AND it is NOT an easy task to swap out all the bushings after the fact. Think about it, every suspension connection point, there is a bushing.

Hell, even on the SS 1LE with its upgraded bushings, just by adding the ZL1 1LE solid rear cradle bushing made a huge difference on my car. Now take that and apply it to every suspension component on the car. Add-in after that fact, that the suspension is then tuned for that bushing set.

People tend to look at the obvious like tires, springs, etc, but often it's what you don't see that matters the most.

[Wyzz Kydd]

Originally Posted by TRZ06

People always forget what isn't obvious. One of the BIGGEST differences between the standard SS and the 1LE are the BUSHING SET used.

It sounds simple and underwhelming, but the bushings play a HUGE part of feel and tightness of a car. AND it is NOT an easy task to swap out all the bushings after the fact. Think about it, every suspension connection point, there is a bushing.

Hell, even on the SS 1LE with its upgraded bushings, just by adding the ZL1 1LE solid rear cradle bushing made a huge difference on my car. Now take that and apply it to every suspension component on the car. Add-in after that fact, that the suspension is then tuned for that bushing set.

People tend to look at the obvious like tires, springs, etc, but often it's what you don't see that matters the most.

I can't argue with that!

I'm not a mechanic and I stopped working on cars back in the 80s. I always thought of the bushings as part of the suspension!

These days I buy the best car I can afford and pay others to bust their knuckles maintaining/modifying what I have. Heck I don't even change my own oil anymore.

I've thought about changing the rear cradle bushing, but there's no way I would try to do it myself and I have no idea what it would cost to have my local dealer do it.

Others have already said this, but the Recaro seats are a big difference too and surprisingly the HU display is much more useful than I expected.

[TRZ06]

Originally Posted by Wyzz Kydd

I can't argue with that!

I'm not a mechanic and I stopped working on cars back in the 80s. I always thought of the bushings as part of the suspension!

These days I buy the best car I can afford and pay others to bust their knuckles maintaining/modifying what I have. Heck I don't even change my own oil anymore.

I've thought about changing the rear cradle bushing, but there's no way I would try to do it myself and I have no idea what it would cost to have my local dealer do it.

Others have already said this, but the Recaro seats are a big difference too and surprisingly the HU display is much more useful than I expected.

The rear solid cradle bushing swap is a 8-10 hour job.