[shaffe]

Originally Posted by ST1LE

GM's MSRP also already includes Destination, so tack on another $1,000+/- to the Mustang.

That said, this PP2 is lookin pretty awesome!! 305's all around!! heck yeah!

So did my figure, I don't know why ford doesn't show it in theirs but I make sure I included it when discussing

Base GT Price

35,095

301A Package

2000

Active Exhaust

895

PP2

6500

Destination

900

= 45390

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

Does the PP2 not come with Recaro seats? I see them in the pictures, but some are saying they aren't part of the package.

I can't see that being right as it makes it look even more overpriced.

I can't tell, one of the things I read said customers can choose cloth or leather so I don't know if they are or not. It is very vague

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by 68fbjjz109

The base 18' GT is very similar to the 15-17' GTPP

18' GTPP1 is faster than that 18' GT, prob comparable or slightly faster than SS

18' GTPP1 is 3.5 seconds faster around Grattan than the 18' GTPP1, depending on the track and torque gains, it may very well be faster than a GT350 TP, as it has much better tires.

The GT350 will always be unique and desired I don't personally see this as really hurting GT350 sales, especially given the fact it has been very successful and extended already, and on it's way out. The GTPP2 is very much a 1LE competitor in terms of availability.

If the GT PP1 is comparable to the standard SS AND if all the issues from the 15-17s are resolved and if it offers similar options while coming in at a good price then I will give Ford respect. If the PP2 can keep up with the 1LE then even more respect.

As far as the GT350, I'm not seeing how or why anyone would buy the non-R if it is on the same level as the GT PP2. I mean, why would anyone buy a ZL1 if the SS was just as fast, cornered just as well, has the same options, and was $15K-$20K cheaper?

Originally Posted by shaffe

It does seem like the GTPP2 will be able to give the GT350(Non R) all it can handle, the 350 will still have the advantage in brakes and HP so I guess it would depend on what type of track.

If that is the case I do kind of wonder why they are offering the 350 for 18. Could be that they planned internally for it to end in 18 or who knows.

I still think the 1LE will hold the advantage, but I think the PP2 will make the GT respectable and at least on the same page

A thought I toyed with before and even mentioned here was that perhaps they will give the Shelbys their own body style now that the 18s are different. Maybe the Shelbys and Mustangs will be like the Corvettes and the Camaros. I could see Ford trying something like that. Give the Shelbys much more extreme performance and then start making the Mustangs like the Camaros...PP2 increased to take on the ZL1...PP1 increased to take on the 1LE...standard GT to take on the standard SS. And for the Shelby the GT350 can be upped to take on the Z06 while the GT500 is upgraded to take on the ZR1. Maybe have the special edition Mustangs (Boss, Bullitt, Mach 1, etc) as a standard continuous model on the level of the standard Corvette and the Grand Sport. Just some ideas I came up with when wondering why the Shelby wasn't getting the refresh.

[SpeedIsLife]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

c

As far as the GT350, I'm not seeing how or why anyone would buy the non-R if it is on the same level as the GT PP2. I mean, why would anyone buy a ZL1 if the SS was just as fast, cornered just as well, has the same options, and was $15K-$20K cheaper?

One word:

Shelby

It carries prestige (earned or not). It carries "exclusivity".

Ford really isn't that concerned with stepping on a Shelby's toes. You had the GT500KR, and the very next year they released the refreshed GT500 with the same power level in the same generation.

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

One word:

Shelby

It carries prestige (earned or not). It carries "exclusivity".

Ford really isn't that concerned with stepping on a Shelby's toes. You had the GT500KR, and the very next year they released the refreshed GT500 with the same power level in the same generation.

Agreed. Some people really do care about that. The new higher cost of the GT has also really closed he gap in price between the two, and I think many people can justify the extra $ for the Prestige and that Voodoo.

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

Does the PP2 not come with Recaro seats? I see them in the pictures, but some are saying they aren't part of the package.

I can't see that being right as it makes it look even more overpriced.

From what I read, no they won’t. They talk all about the features of the pp2, yet no mention of Recaros. But at the end, they say this.


The only visual cues on a car outfitted with the new Performance Pack Level 2 are black detailing on the splitter and spoiler, the tire spat on the back edge of the rear wheel wells and the 10-spoke Dark Tarnish wheels, which are exclusive. Customers who opt for Performance Pack Level 2 have a
unique opportunity to select Recaro® seats in either leather or cloth to help stay firmly planted while cornering.

[vtirocz]

Suspiciously missing from either PP1 or PP2: Transmission, diff, and engine oil coolers (unless I missed it?). It will be interesting to see if these are needed. I'm anxious to see the road test comparison articles!

[glenB]

https://blog.caranddriver.com/level-...formance-pack/

" The Mustang’s not always comfortable Recaro sport seats—cloth on the base car, leather on the Premium—remain a $1595 extra on both Level 2 trim levels."

[ChefBorOzzy]

Originally Posted by glenB

https://blog.caranddriver.com/level-...formance-pack/

" The Mustang’s not always comfortable Recaro sport seats—cloth on the base car, leather on the Premium—remain a $1595 extra on both Level 2 trim levels."

Ouch.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

One word:

Shelby

It carries prestige (earned or not). It carries "exclusivity".

Ford really isn't that concerned with stepping on a Shelby's toes. You had the GT500KR, and the very next year they released the refreshed GT500 with the same power level in the same generation.

Originally Posted by ST1LE

Agreed. Some people really do care about that. The new higher cost of the GT has also really closed he gap in price between the two, and I think many people can justify the extra $ for the Prestige and that Voodoo.

I get it that the Shelby has the prestige and all that. But on the same token, it should be the top dog during the year(s) it is out. Again, what if the SS performed exactly as good as the ZL1? Or if the Stingray could keep up with the Z06. Or if the SRT8 could keep up with the Hellcat. That should not happen. The price gap got smaller between the GT and Shelby. But it is still a considerable difference in money you're paying for what should be the top dog in Ford's Muscle Car lineup. It just seems odd to me.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by glenB

https://blog.caranddriver.com/level-...formance-pack/

" The Mustang’s not always comfortable Recaro sport seats—cloth on the base car, leather on the Premium—remain a $1595 extra on both Level 2 trim levels."

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

Ouch.

I agree and disagree with the ouch. Yes it would be nice for them to be standard. But on the other hand, rounder fellows like myself don't exactly fit well in Recaro's hahaha. So that is nice not to be forced into them.

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

I get it that the Shelby has the prestige and all that. But on the same token, it should be the top dog during the year(s) it is out. Again, what if the SS performed exactly as good as the ZL1? Or if the Stingray could keep up with the Z06. Or if the SRT8 could keep up with the Hellcat. That should not happen. The price gap got smaller between the GT and Shelby. But it is still a considerable difference in money you're paying for what should be the top dog in Ford's Muscle Car lineup. It just seems odd to me.

Doesn't the Grand Sport pretty much offer like 90% of the Z06 performance for less $?

Either way I agree it is odd that the it seems the PP2 will be that close to the GT350. But I think GM Forced Ford's hand with the GT PP2. they had to do something IMO and it got close to the base 350 oh well.

[ChefBorOzzy]

The reason I said ouch is because of the price and it not coming with Recaro seats. If the Recaro seats are a no cost option, then I have no issues with it. 1LE still seems like it offers more goods for the money, but PP2 should be a solid performer with the stiffening and the fat tires.

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

The reason I said ouch is because of the price and it not coming with Recaro seats. If the Recaro seats are a no cost option, then I have no issues with it. 1LE still seems like it offers more goods for the money, but PP2 should be a solid performer with the stiffening and the fat tires.

The 1LE certainly does offer a better value. The 2018 package offerings for the GT have basically nullified the only advantage the Mustang had, price. It does seem like the new packages will bring the S550 in to this generation at least though, which I am very happy to see.

[Oaktotem]

I still don't' see anything on the PP2 about additional transmission and oil coolers as is standard on the SS.

[SpeedIsLife]

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

The reason I said ouch is because of the price and it not coming with Recaro seats. If the Recaro seats are a no cost option, then I have no issues with it. 1LE still seems like it offers more goods for the money, but PP2 should be a solid performer with the stiffening and the fat tires.

Apparently the cloth Recaro's will be a n/c option for the PP2, where the leathers will be something like $1,800.

I wasn't impressed with the recaros in the 2015 GTPP I drove..they weren't comfortable. They restrained and such well..but..I wouldn't enjoy a long drive in them.