[MySS8U]

the point of headers is performance increase. Get them with high flow cats, and from the cats back leave it stock. Also get a CAI. After all this, tune it at a dyno or a mail order tune. If all you want is headers your wasting time and money. The amount of money per hp/tq ratio is not worth you loosing your warranty for.

[USAFS197]

Other than Atomic Ed, it seems a lot of folks aren't taking into account the emissions factor. Granted it's been a while since I've lived in California but still, if you're going to modify your vehicle, do your absolute best to try to stay within the confines of CARB standards and get emissions legal modifications. Last thing you need is to get pulled over by the CHP for speeding and they suspect that you've illegally modified your vehicle--that'll be a bad day for you.

Long tubes are not legal in California. Period. Touching your stock catalytic converters in any way outside of replacing them because they were damaged or were malfunctioning with anything other than another stock replacement, is also illegal. Unless you want to go through the hassle of taking long tubes on and off each time you need to do a smog check, I'd avoid it and get something emissions legal.

Realistically, if I were still in California and I was hellbent on making more power, I'd look at a CARB legal supercharger and then get an axle back and call it a day.

[DFW1LE]

Its interesting that when Katech installs their head/cam package, for emission reasons they will not install headers unless the car comes into their shop with the headers already installed. Still seems the stock system is pretty good, considering that Katech package adds ~ 100 hp without headers. I am debating initially just eliminating the secondary cats alone, and seeing how things work with a heads/cam package. I could always add headers later.

[Tr6]

Originally Posted by USAFS197

Other than Atomic Ed, it seems a lot of folks aren't taking into account the emissions factor. Granted it's been a while since I've lived in California but still, if you're going to modify your vehicle, do your absolute best to try to stay within the confines of CARB standards and get emissions legal modifications. Last thing you need is to get pulled over by the CHP for speeding and they suspect that you've illegally modified your vehicle--that'll be a bad day for you.

Long tubes are not legal in California. Period. Touching your stock catalytic converters in any way outside of replacing them because they were damaged or were malfunctioning with anything other than another stock replacement, is also illegal. Unless you want to go through the hassle of taking long tubes on and off each time you need to do a smog check, I'd avoid it and get something emissions legal.

Realistically, if I were still in California and I was hellbent on making more power, I'd look at a CARB legal supercharger and then get an axle back and call it a day.

Very valid points right here. Most don't live in nazifornia, so we can rock full on straight pipes if we cared to. But if you do live in Cali, definitely wouldn't be worth the hassle of messing with emissions crap.

Only CARB certified SC is the eforce. Grab that and an axle back which the 2 would be your safest bet.

[Atomic Ed]

As TR6 eludes to, the overall best $/hp is forced induction. I have an E-force and it was really tough to dole out that kind of money up front, but its been more than worth it!

As I stated in the other post, I have a used set of the shorty Hooker Blackheart headers I'm going to play with by re-working the flange area to open them up about a 1/2" to match the inlet to the primary cats. Not expecting any really big power increase, but should provide some reduced back pressure and allow me to move more air up front with a smaller pulley on the E-force.

[Tr6]

Originally Posted by Atomic Ed

As TR6 eludes to, the overall best $/hp is forced induction. I have an E-force and it was really tough to dole out that kind of money up front, but its been more than worth it!

As I stated in the other post, I have a used set of the shorty Hooker Blackheart headers I'm going to play with by re-working the flange area to open them up about a 1/2" to match the inlet to the primary cats. Not expecting any really big power increase, but should provide some reduced back pressure and allow me to move more air up front with a smaller pulley on the E-force.

Couple people I know have the E-force and they are very happy with it. 2 do live in Cali and they do pass the emissions too. Glad you are enjoying your Eforce! If memory serves me right, you were one of the first if not the first to have it done too so it's been a while!

[Atomic Ed]

Yep! Had it installed at the dealer since they were one of the first five recipients of the Camaro E-force package.

It's been over a year now and I still smile every time I take the Camaro out for a drive. It's a really well integrated, seamless, package for those of us that just want a better power to weight ratio on the street. It just drives like a big cubic inch, NA engine.

I love the quite, sleeper qualities of this package. Everyone thinks, WOW, that's what a stock Camaro can do?...and I just smile some more.

Don't really need the shortys, but I like to fiddle and I need to work on my welding skills.

[MAGAUSA]

Originally Posted by MySS8U

the point of headers is performance increase. Get them with high flow cats, and from the cats back leave it stock. Also get a CAI. After all this, tune it at a dyno or a mail order tune. If all you want is headers your wasting time and money. The amount of money per hp/tq ratio is not worth you loosing your warranty for.

On the outset I agree with you, and you you're making very valid points. However, I'm not convinced non stock cats are required for my use and a couple of horse do not matter. Wasting money is relative. Youre also assuming that a warranty is lost. It may be. It may not be.

[JFM-jr]

Originally Posted by Fraxum

Sorry once you move the cats further downstream with LTs you WILL get CELs. The only way to avoid this is to tune out the rear O2s.

Exactly!

[hamilton2008]

lets make this simple.... the new copo runs the hooker blackheart stuff... and I chose the black heart stuff and seen considerable gains

[Burly]

Originally Posted by hamilton2008

lets make this simple.... the new copo runs the hooker blackheart stuff... and I chose the black heart stuff and seen considerable gains

With the Hooker setup, did you keep stock cats and did you tune?