[RonatVengeance]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

With all due respect, and not to start a war on the subject...but just because your particular system requires a tune does not give you the right to say that all tuneless systems will not yield gains. There have been several independent dynos showing that RF without a tune has made gains over the stock system. There were at least 2 on this forum alone, and others on the many 6th Gen Camaro pages on Facebook all confirming this. The SS has had gains, the ZL1, and even supercharged SS Camaros that switched from the stock box to other setups have shown gains. I get it, you wanna advertise your system and it does require a tune. But to say that other systems offer no gains is just false. Even GMPP is now using the CAI system (or vice-versa) as a performance upgrade over the stock box and that is tuneless. Nobody should have to void their warranty for a cai if you ask me. It is nice you have this system and it is something I would be willing to try in the future when I get mods that require a tune (LTs, pulley). But we all know that a well developed intake system will make more power over a stock box without a tune.


With all that said, maybe you can post some pics of your system installed and un-installed...it would be cool to see.

My post has little to do with advertising and you are certainly entitled to your own opinion. I am simply stating facts. Facts I have confirmed over and over again with continual in house installations and testing. Our primary focus at Vengeance Racing is on building/modifying vehicles. With that said, our client base is not concerned about the OE warranty so we do not see to many folks who are just looking for a cold air.... Our clients want camshaft/pulleys/methanol/larger superchargers etc so the cold air needs to be as efficient as possible.


We only develop parts when we feel there is a short coming in the aftermarket. After testing various cold air systems we felt we could design a better performing unit for the performance packages we offer to our clients, so that is exactly what we did. I am not trying to knock other manufacturers by making these statements, but our needs are different from others as is obvious in this case.

I do not wish to get into a debate on tuning required/not required, but I will state I have yet to see a vehicle on our chassis dyno (specifically speaking LT4/E92 ECU) with an aftermarket cold air that did not require recalibrating the ECU... Either from the air fuel being off/additional boost requiring timing adjustments or from the throttle blade closing due to the added horsepower production.

[Roto-fab 1]

Originally Posted by TheRedhead

I may have to pick one up, specifically, if I am not going to do any major mods, because of rarity.

If not, I'll definitely tune and go with something tune required.

Our system is built to keep up with any "tune required" intake on the market! We use a huge filter with a 6" clamping surface, which steps down to a 4" MAF housing with a radiused entry. Then the system tapers evenly from the MAF housing to the throttle body.

It is important to remember that an intake which requires a tune does not necessarily flow more air than a "No tune" system. For example, if we reduced the size of our MAF housing by .250" and left all other variables the same, our system would likely require a tune. But that does not mean it is flowing more air or making more power.

Not to take anything away from the VR intake, as I'm sure they have done a great job developing their system. But I am confident our intake can compete on cars pushing 800+ hp.

[TheRedhead]

Very interesting point of views here.

Someone needs to do a back to back to back to back test.

I'll buy one from the person who gives me the best deal! AND THE MOST STICKERS!

[neely_8]

Originally Posted by Sales @ CAI Inc

Good news! It will be available by Mid-August. Thanks!

Great news! Tune or NO-Tune? Thanks!

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by RonatVengeance

My post has little to do with advertising and you are certainly entitled to your own opinion. I am simply stating facts. Facts I have confirmed over and over again with continual in house installations and testing. Our primary focus at Vengeance Racing is on building/modifying vehicles. With that said, our client base is not concerned about the OE warranty so we do not see to many folks who are just looking for a cold air.... Our clients want camshaft/pulleys/methanol/larger superchargers etc so the cold air needs to be as efficient as possible.


We only develop parts when we feel there is a short coming in the aftermarket. After testing various cold air systems we felt we could design a better performing unit for the performance packages we offer to our clients, so that is exactly what we did. I am not trying to knock other manufacturers by making these statements, but our needs are different from others as is obvious in this case.

I do not wish to get into a debate on tuning required/not required, but I will state I have yet to see a vehicle on our chassis dyno (specifically speaking LT4/E92 ECU) with an aftermarket cold air that did not require recalibrating the ECU... Either from the air fuel being off/additional boost requiring timing adjustments or from the throttle blade closing due to the added horsepower production.

I wasn't stating any opinion of mine. I was stating facts that have been posted up here many times. Companies like CAI, Roto-Fab, Vararam, and others have been shown and proven to provide gains without a tune. Anywhere from 5 hp up to 15 hp. In fact the only brands that say you only get gains with a tune are the brands that make tune-required intakes. And it really wasn't a debate. I'm just pointing out that there are brands that have put enough time and money into R&D and have products that will make gains without a tune. In case someone wanted to mod their car without blowing their warranty. I'm sure your product is great. If it was a non-tune intake then I would probably buy one just to see how it is compared to the RF. Anyway good luck.

Originally Posted by neely_8

Great news! Tune or NO-Tune? Thanks!

From what they told me it will be a non-tuned intake. I'm looking forward to it!!

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Roto-fab 1

Our system is built to keep up with any "tune required" intake on the market! We use a huge filter with a 6" clamping surface, which steps down to a 4" MAF housing with a radiused entry. Then the system tapers evenly from the MAF housing to the throttle body.

It is important to remember that an intake which requires a tune does not necessarily flow more air than a "No tune" system. For example, if we reduced the size of our MAF housing by .250" and left all other variables the same, our system would likely require a tune. But that does not mean it is flowing more air or making more power.

Not to take anything away from the VR intake, as I'm sure they have done a great job developing their system. But I am confident our intake can compete on cars pushing 800+ hp.

Your system is pretty neat. And it seals off engine bay heat pretty good. The shop I bought it from gave me 2 free dynos with it but I haven't had a chance to get up there for the runs. I'll post the results when I do get up there!!

[jdasnt3]

Originally Posted by djfury05

To me that tuning statement is just a catch all. Any company could use the same statement as a "save your ass" move. Shouldn't be making any claims without data on hand at time of release in my opinion. Acceptable data to me would be their CAI on a completely stock car with and without a tune. Not data on the car in their pics which at least has headers meth and a tune.

I know Ron personally and other VR guys for many years.
This is far from my first go around. I think it could be more aesthetically pleasing but that's what you get when you use bent sheet metal instead of a molded composite.

Any insight on other upcoming offerings?

Agreed. I read "highest output possible" as the most they could get from their design. It doesn't mean to claim that they are better than the rest, just the best Vengeance could get.

[djfury05]

Any further offerings people know about?

How about any 3rd party Vengeance CAI results yet? Is an air straightening device or velocity stack incorporated on this CAI?

[Evolvedx27]

Any more reviews?

[BSR-1]

Originally Posted by Evolvedx27

Any more reviews?

[unavailablezl1]

Couldn't you just get a tune without a CAI and just a lower restriction K&N flat filter and get more horsepower? Why buy a CAI and HAVE to tune. What is the point?

[djfury05]

Originally Posted by unavailablezl1

Couldn't you just get a tune without a CAI and just a lower restriction K&N flat filter and get more horsepower? Why buy a CAI and HAVE to tune. What is the point?

Have you seen the inside if the stock airbox? It's very restrictive and not condusive to maximum airflow. Roto Fab doesn't have to be tuned either.

[unavailablezl1]

Originally Posted by djfury05

Have you seen the inside if the stock airbox? It's very restrictive and not condusive to maximum airflow. Roto Fab doesn't have to be tuned either.

I was talking about, The Green Monster, not Roto Fab. That one requires a tune, so why buy it. When you can get a tune without buying it and get more horsepower with a plain K&N for $50 or whatever.

I don't know, I am leaving mine alone until there is really something better with a tune that has more horsepower and does not void my warranty.

[djfury05]

Originally Posted by unavailablezl1

I was talking about, The Green Monster, not Roto Fab. That one requires a tune, so why buy it. When you can get a tune without buying it and get more horsepower with a plain K&N for $50 or whatever.

I don't know, I am leaving mine alone until there is really something better with a tune that has more horsepower and does not void my warranty.

I'm lost reading your posts lol. Why would you want to get a tune and not get an aftermarket CAI if the warranty will be voided anyways is beyond me.

If you get any tune, the warranty is voided plain and simple. Unless you find an awesome dealer who'll overlook things and GM as well when the info is sent to them.

Nobody has any data yet on the Vengeance CAI with the green hipo filter. I've seen another post here with a drop in replacement green filter but no data on that either. Vengeance's CAI will undoubtedly make more power than the stock airbox with drop in filter, no question about it. I don't even need data to come to that conclusion when you see the construction of the inside of our airbox it is very evident.

I do like the Vengeance CAI price point compared to others. It's ridiculous however how much these things cost nowadays from every vendor though. Just a few years ago CAI's were half or less than they are now.
That's why I hope more options become available so they have to be competitive with one another.