[ron scubadiver]

Originally Posted by Bassment

It's just uncertainty from trump, people don't want to do a large non-essential purchase right now

I agree. On Facebook 90% of what I see now is political. It's just as bad as before the election.

[SpeedIsLife]

Originally Posted by ron scubadiver

I agree. On Facebook 90% of what I see now is political. It's just as bad as before the election.

I'd say it's actually worse now.

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

GM can't discount the Camaro for the remainder of it's production run..it's simply not practical.

Individual dealers can always discount a car and cut into their individual profits, but GM can't constantly be throwing down big cash on the hoods of the Camaro to make it sell.

GM also can't use the Camaro to prop up the costs of Alpha for the ATS and CTS without expecting lower sales.

GM can't rehash old styling without addressing visibility issues without expecting lower sales.

[freddyD]

people are buying suv's-look at traffic-I see vans and tons of all makes of suv's I think people like room inside now the inside of camaro's is small!

[AlexM]

Originally Posted by ClaunchOfficial

Then why haven't you made the move, they've been selling at huge discounts for months. You could've had a 2SS in the $35K range.

I wasn't really looking for one back then. There are few members claiming they got 2SS's for less than that, lower 30K...
I guess I'll wait and see, they HAVE to do something about it if they want to move the almost 6 months stock they already have on the lots now.

[ron scubadiver]

Originally Posted by AlexM

I wasn't really looking for one back then. There are few members claiming they got 2SS's for less than that, lower 30K...
I guess I'll wait and see, they HAVE to do something about it if they want to move the almost 6 months stock they already have on the lots now.

Claimed. A lot of these deals were not on pristine cars, or they lacked a popular option like NPP. Some were sold as certified used cars, but they had not been titled before. They don't mention fees which can easily top $1000. Still, 20% off is a good deal.

[ron scubadiver]

Remember, the third shift at the Camaro/Cadillac plant was laid off on January 16th. A two or three week shutdown was also scheduled. There will doubtless be more production cutbacks or even a shortened model year unless things really pick up this spring.

[doc7000]

It will be a shame if the suv kills the pony car......

[Dudie7]

Not good for the Camaro...making it not good for the entire segment. It's all fun and games dishing on who's the best until numbers seriously fall, competition wains and then the ax drops. All 3 need healthy rivals to survive in this market.

[SpeedIsLife]

Originally Posted by doc7000

It will be a shame if the suv kills the pony car......

It didn't before, it won't now.

[Dudie7]

Originally Posted by germanicus

Challenger has a MUCH larger TV advertising presence as well. I am constantly seeing Dodge AWD adverts for Challengers and Chargers.

I only ever see Camaro in occasional glimpses with other GM vehicles.

I NEVER see Mustangs in commercials.

You've never seen the Mustang commercial with the yellow S550 and the model holding the microphone next to the tailpipe? It's on all the time.

[Wireeater]

I really don't come in here to troll, I like the Camaro, but I know some will take offense to my comment but either way:

As someone who cross shopped both, I can see why the Camaro is struggling to outsell. From a performance perspective it is a great car. On paper, the numbers look triumphing. For previous, loyal Camaro owner the decision to upgrade to another Camaro will be easy. You know the brand, you know the car, you know the engine, you know the reliability.

Then you have someone like me, which represent more of the car buying market than enthusiastic and loyal customers. When I went to test out the Camaro back in June I only had 2 cars I wanted. Either the G6 Camaro or the G6 Mustang.

I test drove both and decided overall, the Mustang with just a better all around package. The exterior (which is subjective) of the Camaro some what struggles to flow from front to back. The side of the car has a great profile, slighter slimmer than G5 but it still was not a huge change over the previous gen. The car has too many conflicting angles. Some angles the car look great (mostly from the front/side) and some of the angles just are kind of, meh. The rear of the car struggles to identify with the Camaros we are use to seeing. I have a large group of car friends, very diverse and when most of them see the new Camaro (with the exception of my LS fanboi buddies) just seem to have a hard time finding the car too appealing and they always reference back to the Mustang just look more complete, with a flowing design and I agree.

The interior of the Camaro has awesome interface and gadgets but overall, it felt like it was trying to hard. The interior in the Mustang just felt more comfortable to me. The dash, bezels and everything just seemed to present themselves better with the car. They still give it that old school feeling with modern flair. The interior also offered what seems to be a decent amount of room and visibility over the Camaro. I'm not a huge guy so I am never struggling for room but I do have a son who rides in the car with me when I take it out. Have just the little extra room to move around, kick the seat up, etc helped. The trunk of the Camaro reminded me of the EVO X. Very small compared to the Mustang. Again, who buys the cars for these things. Not the people looking to own an awesome, fast sports car, but it's nice having something when you need it.

The performance of the Camaro is definitely felt through tighter steering and more torque but it truly didn't feel mind blowing between my test drives (SS VS GT PP). Add in the fact that the Mustang tends to offer a bigger aftermarket for those who like to mod their car I basically felt that I could sacrifice a 1/2-1 second of performance and just toss a little money at it later. Upside to Camaro, responds much better to NA mods. Downside, FI doesn't seem to be as robust as the Mustang GT. Coyote is a proving block, with plenty of cars pushing 700-800whp without issue.

Last factor was price. When I was looking in June, every dealer that had an SS on the lot, was spec'd out 2SS, not a single one being under 40k. I don't like to order cars because I don't have the patience. I like to walk on a lot, find something I like and get it. One lot had 10 SS, not a single one would budge on the price. Cheapest was 38k. I wasn't looking for that. I got my PP GT for 33k before TTL. I am all about the bang for your buck. Did my GT come with all of the amenities, not really but they were features I was not looking for in a car that would not be my DD.

In the end the Mustang won me not because it was the fastest (but on the street, the difference really isn't that huge), but because overall it had more things going for it to be an all around, enjoyable car.

I still think the Camaro is a better car overall due to tech and performance but I think Chevrolet killed it when they introduced it with limited advertising. The looks were too similar to the Gen 5 for people who weren't diehards. The price points were too high which then failed to get a lot of them on the road which in return get's other people curious when they seem them. When you start to see a lot of the same cars on a road, as a buyer you are going to assume that theres is a reason why, it's a great car. They missed the opportunity for word of mouth and line of sight sales.

Sure these are all my opinions, but I am a enthusiast of many cars, never have been brand loyal. My money goes where it's spent the best.

I think using weather, politics, etc are just turning blind eyes. The sales are low compared to other year. A business objective is to continually grow over the years, not shrink in the market. At most they want to come even with the previous years. The Camaro seems to be struggling against the competition and the unfortunate part is, the things that aren't helping it sell are things that can't be changed until the next generation. The question is, how will these sales affect the future of the Camaro?

I would highly consider a 1LE on my next purchase assuming they change some of the things I talked about which swayed me more towards the Mustang.

[MiamiBlueCamaro]

Originally Posted by Wireeater

I really don't come in here to troll, I like the Camaro, but I know some will take offense to my comment but either way:

As someone who cross shopped both, I can see why the Camaro is struggling to outsell. From a performance perspective it is a great car. On paper, the numbers look triumphing. For previous, loyal Camaro owner the decision to upgrade to another Camaro will be easy. You know the brand, you know the car, you know the engine, you know the reliability.

Then you have someone like me, which represent more of the car buying market than enthusiastic and loyal customers. When I went to test out the Camaro back in June I only had 2 cars I wanted. Either the G6 Camaro or the G6 Mustang.

I test drove both and decided overall, the Mustang with just a better all around package. The exterior (which is subjective) of the Camaro some what struggles to flow from front to back. The side of the car has a great profile, slighter slimmer than G5 but it still was not a huge change over the previous gen. The car has too many conflicting angles. Some angles the car look great (mostly from the front/side) and some of the angles just are kind of, meh. The rear of the car struggles to identify with the Camaros we are use to seeing. I have a large group of car friends, very diverse and when most of them see the new Camaro (with the exception of my LS fanboi buddies) just seem to have a hard time finding the car too appealing and they always reference back to the Mustang just look more complete, with a flowing design and I agree.

The interior of the Camaro has awesome interface and gadgets but overall, it felt like it was trying to hard. The interior in the Mustang just felt more comfortable to me. The dash, bezels and everything just seemed to present themselves better with the car. They still give it that old school feeling with modern flair. The interior also offered what seems to be a decent amount of room and visibility over the Camaro. I'm not a huge guy so I am never struggling for room but I do have a son who rides in the car with me when I take it out. Have just the little extra room to move around, kick the seat up, etc helped. The trunk of the Camaro reminded me of the EVO X. Very small compared to the Mustang. Again, who buys the cars for these things. Not the people looking to own an awesome, fast sports car, but it's nice having something when you need it.

The performance of the Camaro is definitely felt through tighter steering and more torque but it truly didn't feel mind blowing between my test drives (SS VS GT PP). Add in the fact that the Mustang tends to offer a bigger aftermarket for those who like to mod their car I basically felt that I could sacrifice a 1/2-1 second of performance and just toss a little money at it later. Upside to Camaro, responds much better to NA mods. Downside, FI doesn't seem to be as robust as the Mustang GT. Coyote is a proving block, with plenty of cars pushing 700-800whp without issue.

Last factor was price. When I was looking in June, every dealer that had an SS on the lot, was spec'd out 2SS, not a single one being under 40k. I don't like to order cars because I don't have the patience. I like to walk on a lot, find something I like and get it. One lot had 10 SS, not a single one would budge on the price. Cheapest was 38k. I wasn't looking for that. I got my PP GT for 33k before TTL. I am all about the bang for your buck. Did my GT come with all of the amenities, not really but they were features I was not looking for in a car that would not be my DD.

In the end the Mustang won me not because it was the fastest (but on the street, the difference really isn't that huge), but because overall it had more things going for it to be an all around, enjoyable car.

I still think the Camaro is a better car overall due to tech and performance but I think Chevrolet killed it when they introduced it with limited advertising. The looks were too similar to the Gen 5 for people who weren't diehards. The price points were too high which then failed to get a lot of them on the road which in return get's other people curious when they seem them. When you start to see a lot of the same cars on a road, as a buyer you are going to assume that theres is a reason why, it's a great car. They missed the opportunity for word of mouth and line of sight sales.

Sure these are all my opinions, but I am a enthusiast of many cars, never have been brand loyal. My money goes where it's spent the best.

I think using weather, politics, etc are just turning blind eyes. The sales are low compared to other year. A business objective is to continually grow over the years, not shrink in the market. At most they want to come even with the previous years. The Camaro seems to be struggling against the competition and the unfortunate part is, the things that aren't helping it sell are things that can't be changed until the next generation. The question is, how will these sales affect the future of the Camaro?

I would highly consider a 1LE on my next purchase assuming they change some of the things I talked about which swayed me more towards the Mustang.

"The performance of the Camaro is definitely felt through tighter steering and more torque but it truly didn't feel mind blowing between my test drives "

I just stopped reading right there.....

[SixgenSix]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

Well, let's hope it can survive long enough for the next generation. Maybe then GM will have the spine to push the design. Oh, and give us a little more side window.

I love the chopped look and small windows of the 6th gen. I personally hope that doesn't change lol.