[pinoyscorpion951]

Dedicated Matt and DMS, you guys can go and shove it. I'll probably get banned for this but I don't care as you guys aren't a sponsor here. I'm on these forums constantly and personally have seen the time and effort Tim has gone through for the benefit of everyone here on these forums all and most of the stuff that he's done has been on his own dime. You lost my business and I'll be the first to go to all of Camaro FB groups to tell everyone the same. THANK YOU TIM FOR EVERYTHING YOU'VE DONE!!

[Dedicated-Matt]

The one thing you guys need to realize is I wasn't in communication with Tim at all, although I'm one of the owners at Dedicated I don't always interact with people. What I do know is I've been working on a FF kit for the 2016 Camaro for quite some time, because this is what we do FOR A LIVING. The main issue was for some time people we're reporting that the ethanol content shown in the Hp Tuners scanner would not rise above 35%. Andrew knew I was waiting on conformation before releasing the product.

Its easy to sit back and tell us to shove it or that we suck based on the emails posted. Keep in mind I'm the one that actually made the kit and didn't receive any advice from anyone on how to build it or where the sensor would be placed. Today I've spoken from my perspective without knowledge of the verbage used by Andrew. This is our job, day in and day out to build and sell flex fuel kits. We employee 11 people and have a 24,000 sq foot brick and mortar shop.

It kills me to see people react the way they are. We care about our products and our customers or I wouldn't be here standing up for my product. We are not the type of people to copy or deface people.

Matt

[EFI Tuning]

You didn't come in here to stand up for your product. No one was bashing your product. It's a quality product. You talked without knowing what you were talking about and in the process tried to portray me as a liar and thief which I proved was not the case.

Let this one go.

[Dedicated-Matt]

I'm standing up for the product that has since been copied. Purchasing a product, reverse engineering the components while turning around and selling it as your own has never gone over well with any manufacturer, ever. Especially in this industry.

You presented yourself as a qualified individual with knowledge of how things work and you had a car to test on. People like you are great for the community and I applaud that.

Here's how the convo went between Andrew and I. "This guy Tim tested the alcohol content using a signal generator and was able to register more that 35%" I responded by saying "hey we should give that guy a discount".

Done
Matt

[EFI Tuning]

Reverse engineer what exactly? I contacted Dave Steck last spring about doing a harness. Do I need to deliver that e-mail trail as well?

There is nothing in your kit that anyone on this board can't procure. You had the physical mockup done in a couple of hours the day the loaner car came in. Hardly an engineering effort.

There are 3 connectors for the sensor... POWER, GND, and SIGNAL to the ECM. I looked at the schematics for all of this 8 months ago on ACDelcoTDS. I'm an electrical engineer. I've worked on things I can't even discuss. Do you think I need your expertise to figure the FF out? Why didn't you guys figure out the FF worked on your own? Seems like you were the beneficiary of my actual engineering work. I actually had to write code to prove out the E85.




Tim

[BowtieRocket]

Let it go Dedicated-Matt, you called someone a liar without even knowing what you were talking about, if that is even the case. Makes me question your manufacturing at this point to me... Certainly makes me question your ability for customer service. You were proven wrong and have defaced a customer with limited knowledge. Again, if that is even true.

[BowtieRocket]

Sounds to me more like you didn't know wtf you were doing until Tim figured it out for you...

[EFI Tuning]

[Dedicated-Matt]

Figured out what exactly? If I'm understanding correctly Hp Tuners did an update which cured the content issue. The FF kit is quite simple and it is the bread and butter of our business. I assure you we know it very well. Dave Steck of DSX tuning is an employee of DMS and big part of our business as a whole.

This is being blown way out of proportion. Its not like Tim showed us how to wire it or which pin to populate or even which term was the proper term for a E92 ecu. This is what we do everyday.

Why did we not test it? Because we did not have a 2016 SS in our shop. Despite the large amount of interest in our kit we did not release it to be sold until we could verify the E92 ecu would report the proper content.

Tim, again nothing new here. As you know its a 150 fitting there and a 120 degree fitting on the opposing side. With the sensor placement being the same as 1000's of the 5th gen Camaros we've sold. Again nothing new.

[Megahurtz]

Greed and dishonesty. Bad Karma.

[Dedicated-Matt]

I'm still confused. I have not lied. I'm far from greedy as I make far less per hour than my employee's.

We made a kit because its what we do. We asked someone to verify that the content reported was correct because we didn't have a car here running ethanol. The first kit was built on a customers car here at DMS for Tim Sloper. At that time I had no idea who Tim was or that he was planning to open a business. I assure you we are very far from bad people.


Matt

[Megahurtz]

Originally Posted by Dedicated-Matt

I'm still confused. I have not lied. I'm far from greedy as I make far less per hour than my employee's.

We made a kit because its what we do. We asked someone to verify that the content reported was correct because we didn't have a car here running ethanol. The first kit was built on a customers car here at DMS for Tim Sloper. At that time I had no idea who Tim was or that he was planning to open a business. I assure you we are very far from bad people.


Matt

You accused Tim of being a liar and a copier. He never bad mouthed your company. He proved you were rather ignorant about that information. I get the whole business side of things. no contract, no writing, nothing owed.

I don't buy the "far less per hour than your employees" line. Maybe company paid salary is less and maybe you working longer hours than your staff waters down your rate, but surely you're paid your portion of the profits from being an owner. Who would stay in business and do this as a living making scraps? Sounds like BS to me. That's the kind of side mouth statement that doesn't sit well with me.

The only way you're going to get any respect around here is to man up and admit you were ignorant and maybe made some comments that were assumptions. Then, leave Tim alone and let him do his own thing. He has the evidence to support his stance more than you. You think he didn't help you as much as he thinks he did...well that is a subjective point of view. I can see both sides of this. From a business stand point you didn't owe him anything. But you also didn't give him any charity either.

All of that said and aside from the DMS FF kit, its only the dishonesty that does not sit well. The greed comment may have been overly aggressive and i take it back with apology. But I still think you're in the wrong some here in this situation.

[Dedicated-Matt]

Yes I made some comments based on only knowing what I knew. Without seeing the emails from Andrew who used some poorly chosen words. I'm paying for it now with egg on my face. I knew that someone was using a photo of the DMS kit on their website to sell their own product.

1. The fact is I made a flex fuel kit without knowledge from anyone besides Dave Steck.

2. Putting the FF sensor directly on the hardline is the same thing we've done on every single Camaro kit ever sold in the history of DMS DSX.

3. Tim Sloper did not provide any information or data that influenced anything with the DMS products except the fact that the new Hp tuners firmware update has fixed the alcohol content report.

4. Yes while it may be private info, my employee's make more than I do. You don't decide to dive into this industry solely for the profits. Its fun and I love what I do.

I'm sorry if everyone thinks I'm some asshat. Put yourself in a business owners shoes. Truth is after surfing around the threads and seeing what I've seen I would have approved a discount status for the 6th gen Camaro kits for Tim that would be a deeper level than most. To show thanks for the amount of time spent on the forums, providing support and advise to the community.

[AndyUK]

Originally Posted by Dedicated-Matt

.

I'm sorry if everyone thinks I'm some asshat. Put yourself in a business owners shoes. Truth is after surfing around the threads and seeing what I've seen I would have approved a discount status for the 6th gen Camaro kits for Tim that would be a deeper level than most. To show thanks for the amount of time spent on the forums, providing support and advise to the community.

Instead of which, without doing any fact checking whatsoever you've come on to a forum and decided to start throwing loads of accusations at someone who actually helped your business and helped sell your product.

You've managed to do far more harm to your own business than Tìm ever could have done.

Gratz.

(And yes as a business owner I don't go around bad mouthing my competitors, suppliers, customers or trading partners in any form)