[JaxChris]

Has the front sway and wider front tires helped with your understeer fight?

Also, who is this guy running a 2015 Transit Connect Wagon? I'd love to see a video of him whipping it around any course...

[destoups]

Originally Posted by Gefiltefish

I run a Fiesta ST in H Street on the ProSolo/National scene right now, but am considering the 6th gen Camaro for next year. Not sure if will be an SS for FS or an LT for a potential DS car (I wrote into the SAC asking them to consider moving the 2.0T 6gen into DS since they are moving Ecoboosts and what not as well).

Sam, I just bought a 2.0T with the same idea in mind. 265s for now though ... /Des Toups

[Gefiltefish]

Originally Posted by destoups

Sam, I just bought a 2.0T with the same idea in mind. 265s for now though ... /Des Toups

Good stuff Des! I am highly considering the Camaro. I was looking at EB Mustangs but believe it or not - I watched your videos and saw how much shifting you were doing. Those videos sold me that I did NOT want an EB. If the FiST has taught me anything, its that I HATE shifting to 3rd and back down on an autocross course. RWD and high power is gonna be a lot different for me regardless, so set-it and forget it in second is a plus for me.

There are some arguing that the 1LE SS should be in FS, but I think that would be a damn good car and open up the SAC to bring in other options like the GT350. We will see how the SS's do in two weeks.

I personally feel the following:
2.0T = DS
V6 = FS (including 1LE)
SS = FS
SS 1LE = BS or AS
ZL1 = AS or bury it in SS

I will be at the Town Hall and (more importantly) the SAC breakout meeting and will bring up 1LE and the 2.0T.

If they put the 1LE V6 in FS, I would consider going that route over the regular SS. Call me a wimp, but the power seems easier to manage and there would be a decent weight advantage.

If they class the 1LE SS in FS - then we are talking $45k which is asking a lot of me. I would hope the 2.0T ends up in DS then.

Des - out of curiosity, did you get an RS package or stick with a base so you can run 17's?

[Egon]

Originally Posted by Gefiltefish

Good stuff Des! I am highly considering the Camaro. I was looking at EB Mustangs but believe it or not - I watched your videos and saw how much shifting you were doing. Those videos sold me that I did NOT want an EB. If the FiST has taught me anything, its that I HATE shifting to 3rd and back down on an autocross course. RWD and high power is gonna be a lot different for me regardless, so set-it and forget it in second is a plus for me.

There are some arguing that the 1LE SS should be in FS, but I think that would be a damn good car and open up the SAC to bring in other options like the GT350. We will see how the SS's do in two weeks.

I personally feel the following:
2.0T = DS
V6 = FS (including 1LE)
SS = FS
SS 1LE = BS or AS
ZL1 = AS or bury it in SS

I will be at the Town Hall and (more importantly) the SAC breakout meeting and will bring up 1LE and the 2.0T.

If they put the 1LE V6 in FS, I would consider going that route over the regular SS. Call me a wimp, but the power seems easier to manage and there would be a decent weight advantage.

If they class the 1LE SS in FS - then we are talking $45k which is asking a lot of me. I would hope the 2.0T ends up in DS then.

Des - out of curiosity, did you get an RS package or stick with a base so you can run 17's?

I ran against a guy this week at our regional autocross with a 2015 Mustang GTPP. He routinely beats everyone but this event we had a course that really let my 1LE stretch its legs on one part of the course. He was consistently hitting his rev limiter in one section where I was just powering through it in 2nd, and I think that is why I was able to beat him by 0.133 seconds this time. Those longer gears definitely do make a difference in Autocross. (I also desperately need to switch to RE-71r's like he is using)

I have also been wondering about the classing for the 2017 1LE for next season. If they allow it to stay in F-Street with the SS I believe it is likely to dominate the class completely. I believe the 6th Gen SS will dominate too, it's just that the 1LE will do it by a much wider margin. You bring up a great point however, that it is possible for them to move the GT350 out of AS into FS to offset the 2017 1LE advantage. The result however is that any region where a competitor has either one of those vehicles they are likely to upset things quite a bit, and it is my belief that they will just put the 2017 1LE into A-Street where the GT350, 5th Gen Z/28 and the F80/F82 M's from BMW are.

Speaking of 2 weeks from now, it is interesting to note that there will be 9 drivers in 2016 Camaro SS's and 11 drivers in 2015-2016 Mustang GT's in F-Street this year at Nationals. That's a big improvement in Camaro representation since there were a total of 6 5th Gen Camaro drivers last year in that class. There is only a single co-driver entry for the GT350 in A-Street that I have seen this year, and I haven't seen a single entry for the GT350 at any of the Championship Tour events either. I am definitely going to be keeping my eye on all of these at nationals to hopefully see how this may affect classing next season.

[destoups]

Originally Posted by Gefiltefish

Good stuff Des! I am highly considering the Camaro. I was looking at EB Mustangs but believe it or not - I watched your videos and saw how much shifting you were doing. Those videos sold me that I did NOT want an EB. If the FiST has taught me anything, its that I HATE shifting to 3rd and back down on an autocross course. RWD and high power is gonna be a lot different for me regardless, so set-it and forget it in second is a plus for me.

There are some arguing that the 1LE SS should be in FS, but I think that would be a damn good car and open up the SAC to bring in other options like the GT350. We will see how the SS's do in two weeks.

I personally feel the following:
2.0T = DS
V6 = FS (including 1LE)
SS = FS
SS 1LE = BS or AS
ZL1 = AS or bury it in SS

I will be at the Town Hall and (more importantly) the SAC breakout meeting and will bring up 1LE and the 2.0T.

If they put the 1LE V6 in FS, I would consider going that route over the regular SS. Call me a wimp, but the power seems easier to manage and there would be a decent weight advantage.

If they class the 1LE SS in FS - then we are talking $45k which is asking a lot of me. I would hope the 2.0T ends up in DS then.

Des - out of curiosity, did you get an RS package or stick with a base so you can run 17's?

I've run the car just once -- yesterday -- and the only thing I can say for sure is you don't want to run 17s on it That would pretty much erase any gains at the top of second. The 35 series on the 18s look *tiny* on the car, too. But going to the RS and 19s would be a problem in low-speed digs, which are already weak. There's just not enough power down low to give up any -- it's certainly the most noticeable difference between the EB and 2.0T.

I think I would consider the brake package if there were 18s that fit over them. Stock brakes are inconsistent and weak compared with EB.

The engine is much smoother, and it does pull nicely all the way to redline rather than giving up at 5500 rpm as the EB does. The Camaro will feel massive after the Fiesta, but it does feel smaller on course than the Mustang (makes me think the 2.0T ATS, which is three inches narrower still, might be the real sleeper).

I'll look at adding a rear bar and some toe-out to the rear to help turn-in until shocks I can afford are available. Yesterday was fun; the Mustang offers enough power instantly that I had to enter corners differently in the Camaro, where the actual acceleration comes a couple of beats after you floor it.

Results here. Not sure it's indicative of anything; course was certainly a showcase for the extended top of second gear, so I am not sure I would have done better in the EB but it certainly would have been faster in the slow spots.

[Gefiltefish]

Originally Posted by Egon

Speaking of 2 weeks from now, it is interesting to note that there will be 9 drivers in 2016 Camaro SS's and 11 drivers in 2015-2016 Mustang GT's in F-Street this year at Nationals. That's a big improvement in Camaro representation since there were a total of 6 5th Gen Camaro drivers last year in that class. There is only a single co-driver entry for the GT350 in A-Street that I have seen this year, and I haven't seen a single entry for the GT350 at any of the Championship Tour events either. I am definitely going to be keeping my eye on all of these at nationals to hopefully see how this may affect classing next season.

I also have an inside tip that many of the Camaro drivers from the Detroit area are actually GM Performance Team drivers. They have been doing very well locally and could be sleepers for a class win. I still give the advantage to a certain SS driver from the PNW that has Nationals experience though!

Originally Posted by destoups

I think I would consider the brake package if there were 18s that fit over them. Stock brakes are inconsistent and weak compared with EB.

The engine is much smoother, and it does pull nicely all the way to redline rather than giving up at 5500 rpm as the EB does. The Camaro will feel massive after the Fiesta, but it does feel smaller on course than the Mustang (makes me think the 2.0T ATS, which is three inches narrower still, might be the real sleeper).

I have heard the comments on the brakes which is why (if I go 2.0T) I was gonna do the RS with the brake/cooling package. Just wish it was legal to run 18's.

The Mustang and Camaro seem to have engines that would benefit from the others gearing. The 2.0T is peaky enough it seems that the EB's gear box would be beneficial. And vice-versa with an EB needing the longer gear to use its down-low power.

And interesting note on the ATS. The SAC including that in their DS re-og was my basis for asking for the 2.0T to be included as well.

Des - are you driving a GT at Nats or your Camaro? I see you are registered with Mark in a Mustang but am unsure if that was supposed to be your old car?

[Ace01]

When you guys understeer on the Camaro are you loading the front tires with a little breaking so you can power out of of the turn? Also what do you guys think of these tires for autocross? http://m.bfgoodrichtires.com/tire-se...ils?frompc=yes

[Ace01]

This is the best Video series on how to race that I have ever seen. I wish they would have come out with these a few years ago. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...-wgrjTam_2tH-p

[Ace01]

https://youtu.be/kwSMgPYhWbo?list=PL...-wgrjTam_2tH-p

[destoups]

Originally Posted by Gefiltefish

I also have an inside tip that many of the Camaro drivers from the Detroit area are actually GM Performance Team drivers. They have been doing very well locally and could be sleepers for a class win. I still give the advantage to a certain SS driver from the PNW that has Nationals experience though!



I have heard the comments on the brakes which is why (if I go 2.0T) I was gonna do the RS with the brake/cooling package. Just wish it was legal to run 18's.

The Mustang and Camaro seem to have engines that would benefit from the others gearing. The 2.0T is peaky enough it seems that the EB's gear box would be beneficial. And vice-versa with an EB needing the longer gear to use its down-low power.

And interesting note on the ATS. The SAC including that in their DS re-og was my basis for asking for the 2.0T to be included as well.

Des - are you driving a GT at Nats or your Camaro? I see you are registered with Mark in a Mustang but am unsure if that was supposed to be your old car?

We'll be driving the EB at Nats. While there's no getting around the gearing limitation, it's fully prepped and a terrific handling car.

Actually did a ton of research sorting out the Cadillac options -- and probably could have found one with the right mix given some time -- but it would've cost me $30K and the deal on the Camaro was too sweet to pass.

[Mountain]

Originally Posted by Gefiltefish

I also have an inside tip that many of the Camaro drivers from the Detroit area are actually GM Performance Team drivers. They have been doing very well locally and could be sleepers for a class win. I still give the advantage to a certain SS driver from the PNW that has Nationals experience though!

Eh, they are engineers at GM, yes. They are just regular guys like anyone else. One or two of them just happen to be really avid autocrossers and good drivers. Lets not make them out as ringer professional drivers.

[Norm Peterson]

Seems to me that anybody who's getting paid to drive cars really hard from time to time is getting in a lot of extra practice and "staying current" with their driving skills better than people who can't. This, in a game where a few thousandths is all it takes to separate winners out from the rest of the class.


Norm

[bballr4567]

Wow, someone is really salty to keep spreading that crap around. It's not hard to figure out who started it and it's not surprising either. Let's not fall for it's dumb tricks.

[Egon]

Originally Posted by bballr4567

Wow, someone is really salty to keep spreading that crap around. It's not hard to figure out who started it and it's not surprising either. Let's not fall for it's dumb tricks.

Actually the real conspiracy is that GM has purchased an entire fleet of Mustangs that they regularly take to Cars and Coffee events across the country where they do sick burnouts and crash the cars into crowds when leaving. True story.