[Eric SS]

Originally Posted by oldman

actually I think it is too much the 1le is a track car first and foremost. It used to be sold without A/C just so GM did not have to listen to the complaints. Now it has A/C but sorry bose and heated seats and you can't Velcro your door opener somewhere is actually too much for a purpose built track car. You are better off with a 2ss and some rims.

I feel that my opinion is just as valid as yours. I do disagree with your statement above in bold however. If this was first and foremost a track car, it would not even have a radio, A/C, sound deadening, back seat (a leather one at that this in not on the 1SS), etc. This is a track capable street car. This is not a "track car first and foremost" any way you look at it. I would rather GM swing all the way in the opposite direction like the 3rd Gen 1LE with no A/C than meet somewhere in the middle. It would make my decision a lot easier.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by oldman

actually I think it is too much the 1le is a track car first and foremost. It used to be sold without A/C just so GM did not have to listen to the complaints. Now it has A/C but sorry bose and heated seats and you can't Velcro your door opener somewhere is actually too much for a purpose built track car. You are better off with a 2ss and some rims.

I think there's some misunderstanding of what the 1LE is. It is not a purpose-built track car; it's a phenomenal track-focused performance package. The Z/28 was a purpose-built track car. There's a very distinct, and important difference there.

If you pay attention to some of the articles written based off of interviews with Al, he would seem to indicate that a 1LE-style chassis is more fitting to a ZL1 (essentially a Grand Tourer), while a Z/28 would require a more simplified, purpose-built approach (ie racecar).

My 2014 2SS/1LE was the most fun and track-capable car I've ever owned...having heated seats didn't harm that... I would have loved to replace that car with a 6th gen 2SS/1LE...but as of right now, it seems that's not in the cards. I've got some thinking to do, and I'll likely end up with a ZL1 (I know...real disappointing )

Regardless of all that...I'm real curious at some people's insistence on not offering certain items they would never purchase, anyways...essentially limiting the choices of others to what, sooth some ego? It's a little bit elitist, to be frank. To me, it's an attitude that's as similar and as ridiculous as someone insisting that Chevy only ever offer the colors red, black, and yellow, because nothing else looks fast or sporty. If there was a 2SS version....you'd still be able to get a lighter, less-contented 1SS...so why is it a thing that shouldn't be?

GM does, indeed, listen to the consumers. They have to make tough choices in terms of packages, content, and options because they can only offer so many different choices, and maintain production efficiency and quality. I have to imagine the 1SS limitation was based on sales of the 5th gen...

So if there's a demand for a 2SS, I'm sure they'll offer it. But if there's not...it probably won't happen.

[HumanWiki]

Originally Posted by bigdonut

I know it's a money issue, but I'm curious as to why some people would get a 1LE if they're not going to track it. I understand it has the cool factor but it defeats the purpose of buying the package if one will not track it. The 1LE is begging to be tracked as it's a track-focused car. My question is, why bother getting the 1LE if you're never or seldom going to track the car? Just looking for different viewpoints.

For the same reason that people over on CF buy a C7 Z07 and then let it live most its life in the garage seeing only the local parking lot car shows and "nice day" cruises..

[Iron Oak]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

I'm generally with you, with regards to the folks who criticize these things, but never intend to take it to a track...

Now...what about folks (like me) who take the car to a track regularly...but also drive it every day and would like the amenities? Is that such a bad thing to ask for an option in that respect?

If I'm honest, it was a bummer to find out the package was restricted to 1SS models. I get it; and hopefully it was a good decision in terms of sales.

No offense but maybe a ZL1 would be a better choice for you then (i know you owned one in the past)

Here's my reasoning. The 1LE is pretty much a compromised Z/28. Meaning its not a 100% track focused car because it does come with a bunch of amenities that the Z/28 forgoes. Randy Pobst said it best I think. "The 1LE is 90% of the Z/28, just with less power.." Does that make sense? When you start to add the automatic transmission and all these other things, it takes away its uniqueness. What makes it special.

I think it was smart of GM's part to only offer it in the 1SS trim. It keep the price point down and took some of the cool stuff from the 2SS and included it in the 1LE package (e.g. the HUD) Sticking to their 1LE roots a bit more.

The only other amenity I would consider would be the heated seats. Nice for long road trips but not a necessity. The other things, I could really care less about. But that's just me.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Iron Oak

No offense but maybe a ZL1 would be a better choice for you then (i know you owned one in the past)

Here's my reasoning. The 1LE is pretty much a compromised Z/28. Meaning its not a 100% track focused car because it does come with a bunch of amenities that the Z/28 forgoes. Randy Pobst said it best I think. "The 1LE is 90% of the Z/28, just with less power.." Does that make sense? When you start to add the automatic transmission and all these other things, it takes away its uniqueness.

I think it was smart of GM's part to only offer it in the 1SS trim. It keep the price point down and took some of the cool stuff from the 2SS and included it in the 1LE package (e.g. the HUD) Sticking to their 1LE roots a bit more.

The only other amenity I would consider would be the heated seats. Nice for long road trips but not a necessity. The other things, I could really care less about. But that's just me.

And I get that. Completely....track focus, track car, less options = better for those that aren't interested in the equipment. I said something similar about the 1LE in relation to the Z/28, and it's true: the formula is the same, lightweight car (compared to the ZL1) w/ naturally aspirated engine, and a track-oriented suspension/tires. The scale and cost is different, but the result was the same; an astonishingly well-balanced toy for the track...for very little $$.

But what would it hurt to allow people to buy it in 2SS trim? It'll still be a potent track toy. 20lbs of kit just isn't going to matter to the non-competitor. It'll still be worthy of the reputation of 1LE, after all the 5th-gen 1LE is the car that earned that reputation anew...and it was offered as a 2SS.

If you look at a Stingray - a thoroughly track oriented car from the top to the bottom of its lineup - a buyer is allowed the option of a Z51 base car, or a "luxury"-equipped Z51 car. Same on the Z06...the ultimate track car short of the 918 Spyder...you can get it loaded with every option under the sun, (including a roof, or an automatic!).....or not. I would have liked to see that philosophy extend to the Camaro.

What is "special" about restriction and exclusivity on a $40,000 car? And why is "special" so important, anyways? Isn't the pleasure and enjoyment of the driver #1 focus? If a person wants status or reputation...() Get a ZL1...

I'll leave it alone from here, because I don't want to beat a dead horse, and I'm not really that upset. I just don't think it makes a ton of sense for the sake of the buyer...it was Camaro Team's decision to make, and I trust they had their reasons.

On a separate note, I don't really agree with the "get a ZL1" argument...a theoretical 2SS/1LE would cost far less than a ZL1.....unless it won't be that much less, in which case the ZL1 will be a simply astounding value...we shall see...

[Iron Oak]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

I think there's some misunderstanding of what the 1LE is. It is not a purpose-built track car; it's a phenomenal track-focused performance package. The Z/28 was a purpose-built track car. There's a very distinct, and important difference there.

If you pay attention to some of the articles written based off of interviews with Al, he would seem to indicate that a 1LE-style chassis is more fitting to a ZL1 (essentially a Grand Tourer), while a Z/28 would require a more simplified, purpose-built approach (ie racecar).

My 2014 2SS/1LE was the most fun and track-capable car I've ever owned...having heated seats didn't harm that... I would have loved to replace that car with a 6th gen 2SS/1LE...but as of right now, it seems that's not in the cards. I've got some thinking to do, and I'll likely end up with a ZL1 (I know...real disappointing :roll eyes

Regardless of all that...I'm real curious at some people's insistence on not offering certain items they would never purchase, anyways...essentially limiting the choices of others to what, sooth some ego? It's a little bit elitist, to be frank. To me, it's an attitude that's as similar and as ridiculous as someone insisting that Chevy only ever offer the colors red, black, and yellow, because nothing else looks fast or sporty. If there was a 2SS version....you'd still be able to get a lighter, less-contented 1SS...so why is it a thing that shouldn't be?

GM does, indeed, listen to the consumers. They have to make tough choices in terms of packages, content, and options because they can only offer so many different choices, and maintain production efficiency and quality. I have to imagine the 1SS limitation was based on sales of the 5th gen...

So if there's a demand for a 2SS, I'm sure they'll offer it. But if there's not...it probably won't happen.

Haha. I just read this on the next page after responding to your first reply. I could concede to the fact of a 2SS in a delayed release, say in a year or two. Maybe a 2018/2019 offering. Especially with the repackaging and pricing of the GT350 and it receiving the track pack standard in lieu of Chevy's 1LE unveiling. The 2SS variant of the 1LE would be a better contender for that particular car in both price point and amenity offerings.

But for me, Chevy hit the nail on the head as far as everything I would want with the 2017 SS 1LE. I am absolutely blown away with its offerings. I will have one by this time next year. And I will track it! ( I work for a road course, so I freaking better! LOL)

[Mud Z06]

While I will be tracking it, let's assume I won't be. I would still want:

- the seats. as a slim guy I need the support.
- wheels. would not be looking aftermarket with those 1LE wheels with but would want to go aftermarket in a regular 1 or 2SS
- that e-diff. great for leaving the work parking lot.
- 6-piston brembos + mag ride - great value with the 1LE package vs. optioning up a 2SS.

[Iron Oak]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

Isn't the pleasure and enjoyment of the driver #1 focus?

I wholeheartedly agree

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Iron Oak

Haha. I just read this on the next page after responding to your first reply. I could concede to the fact of a 2SS in a delayed release, say in a year or two. Maybe a 2018/2019 offering. Especially with the repackaging and pricing of the GT350 and it receiving the track pack standard in lieu of Chevy's 1LE unveiling. The 2SS variant of the 1LE would be a better contender for that particular car in both price point and amenity offerings.

But for me, Chevy hit the nail on the head as far as everything I would want with the 2017 SS 1LE. I am absolutely blown away with its offerings. I will have one by this time next year. And I will track it! ( I work for a road course, so I freaking better! LOL)

Originally Posted by Iron Oak

I wholeheartedly agree

All great thoughts.

I'm extremely happy that the new 1LE speaks so strongly to people that have seen it. They definitely picked and included all the right stuff!

Now...about this road course you work for.........which one is that? I'll have to visit!

[Imp]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

All great thoughts.

I'm extremely happy that the new 1LE speaks so strongly to people that have seen it. They definitely picked and included all the right stuff!

Now...about this road course you work for.........which one is that? I'll have to visit!

I don't know of any road courses in Maine... closest are NHMS in Loudon or Club Motorsports up in Tamworth (not open yet).

--kC

[90503]

Has anyone noticed what's going on with the V-6 "1LE"? Basically it is becoming a base SS with a different engine....

It's a "track -package" without MRC, big brakes, etc....Nothing wrong with that, as far as tracking, it's a non 1LE, V-6, SS suspension and brakes. A little less heavy than a V-8, but that's about the only difference...Interesting that is touted as trackable, but not a non-1LE, non MRC SS is somehow less worthy of tracking....I think this tracking business is perhaps taken a little too seriously...

I've always believed you can track any of these Camaros and have a blast. And if you think you will only be at the track "seldomly" you don't need to spend a ton of money on options...

If you haven't yet, I would suggest you go to a track with your current car, or ride-along with someone and try some tracking first before you decide how deep you want to dig into your pockets for a Camaro model.

Good luck.

[Imp]

Hasn't been lost on me, as lighter weight, to me, makes a car feel "more connected".

I really can't wait to see how the V6 does. Would be interesting if it really is just an SS with a V6 as an engine and not a V8. Makes sense to me that would be the route... SS with V6 option.

--kC

[Cam 6]

Originally Posted by Mud Z06

While I will be tracking it, let's assume I won't be. I would still want:

- the seats. as a slim guy I need the support.
- wheels. would not be looking aftermarket with those 1LE wheels with but would want to go aftermarket in a regular 1 or 2SS
- that e-diff. great for leaving the work parking lot.
- 6-piston brembos + mag ride - great value with the 1LE package vs. optioning up a 2SS.

I agree with most this, and I also want no part of the disco lighting or wing spoiler.

Regardless of any plans to track or not to track, why wouldn't I want better seats, wheels, tires, brakes, suspension, spoiler, splitter, HUD, PDR, etc. for around (speculating) the same price?

When you look at it from that standpoint, I would have to be nuts to buy a 2SS and NOT the 1LE.

[90503]

Originally Posted by Imp

Hasn't been lost on me, as lighter weight, to me, makes a car feel "more connected".

I really can't wait to see how the V6 does. Would be interesting if it really is just an SS with a V6 as an engine and not a V8. Makes sense to me that would be the route... SS with V6 option.

--kC

...Or, could also be a base SS is actually a V-6 1LE with an optional V-8!...lol

Base Model Prices

¨ 1AG37 Camaro 1LT $25,700.00 + DFC $995.00
¨ 1AH37 Camaro 2LT $29,800.00 + DFC $995.00
¨ 1AJ37 Camaro 1SS $36,300.00 + DFC $995.00
¨ 1AK37 Camaro 2SS $41,300.00 + DFC $995.00

Camaro LT 1LE
The Camaro LT 1LE was developed to be the most track-capable sports coupe in its price class. Highlights include:
• 3.6L V-6 rated at 335 horsepower and matched with the six-speed manual transmission
• FE3 suspension components (from the Camaro SS), including dampers, rear cradle mounts, ball-jointed rear toe links and stabilizer bars
• Lightweight 20-inch forged aluminum wheels with Goodyear Eagle F1 245/40R20 front tires and 275/35R20 rear tires
• Brembo 4-piston front brake calipers
• Mechanical Limited-slip differential with 3.27 ratio
• Standard track-cooling package, with engine oil, differential and transmission coolers
• Suede steering wheel and shorter-throw shifter
• Standard dual mode exhaust system
• Camaro SS fuel system for higher-load cornering capability
• Satin black hood, front splitter and unique three-piece rear spoiler
• Unique high flow upper and lower grille with satin black accents
• Available Recaro seats and PDR video/data recording system

...Add a few thou to the 1LT or 2LT for the 1LE upgrade and you'd have everything SS and more with a V-6 for possibly a very considerable amount of money less....looks like the best bargain yet to me.