[KMPrenger]

Originally Posted by 2SSRS@Gen5diy

IMO there validating the OEM power upgrades to the turbo, IE there may be ways to up the power on the car from the 275 HP to 400? with factory add on parts.

PS IMO this will be a better car then the V6 car.

2.0T with a tune will easily make more TQ than even a modded N/A V6, but with the V6 it is likely going to be easy to push 350 - 360+ HP with nothing more than basic bolt ons and a tune on the V6. To reach that level of HP on the 2.0 will require bolt ons and a pretty aggressive tune (nearly 90HP increase). But it seems that 75 - 100 TQ gains are the norm for aftermarket tunes.

I can't wait to see what an aggressively tuned 2.0 with tires does at the track. I'm guessing mid 12s or better?

But I also have zero doubt that this generation of V6, with the weight loss and 8 speed auto will see n/a V6s hitting high 12s as well.

I can see GM offering a factory backed tune for the 2.0 making something like 295HP/320TQ

[90503]

Originally Posted by Jeffro19

Yep GM will want to sell what's in demand right off the bat. Once it gains popularity then the they will bring out the turbo 4 and vert.

Of course models that require to be ordered with an engine that otherwise wouldn't be built, will appear to be "in demand". You have to "demand" one, otherwise you're sol...There is no need to demand what comes as standard equipment...

If the V-6 was standard and the Turbo-4 engine needed to be chosen as an option, I'm sure the T-4 would appear to be the model in the most demand.

[KMPrenger]

It will be very interesting to see over a few years time how the V6 and 2.0T sell. If the prices between the two are very close, then I can see the sales being close.

I love the fact that Chevrolet didn't neuter one or the other like Ford did with the Mustang. I don't think the 2.0 will be that much better than the V6 on fuel economy especially when you consider the V6 has AFM on its side now but the 2.0 should still be better when driven normally.

Those purchasing on a tighter budget, wanting max economy, or max easy of modding will go for the 2.0.

Those wanting more HP and performance stock and not planning to mod, or better sound, or those that just prefer the V6 for whatever reason will opt for the V6.

[90503]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

It will be very interesting to see over a few years time how the V6 and 2.0T sell. If the prices between the two are very close, then I can see the sales being close.

I love the fact that Chevrolet didn't neuter one or the other like Ford did with the Mustang. I don't think the 2.0 will be that much better than the V6 on fuel economy especially when you consider the V6 has AFM on its side now but the 2.0 should still be better when driven normally.

Those purchasing on a tighter budget, wanting max economy, or max easy of modding will go for the 2.0.

Those wanting more HP and performance stock and not planning to mod, or better sound, or those that just prefer the V6 for whatever reason will opt for the V6.

I think the most telling remarks I've heard were regarding the popularity of 4cyls with the younger crowd, who prefer that type of engine regardless of any numbers or cost....It's for an untapped source of buyers who wouldn't drive an 6 or an 8 no matter what type of car it was in.

[EchoSide]

I stand corrected on the V6 having a manual...Read the ordering guide wrong...

The Colbalt SS and the turbo Sky/Sol all had upgrades but they were fairly cheap, I think around $500ish for a 30-40/hp/tq gain...That alone could probably beat the V6 at least during your typical street race...So you have to wonder maybe they'll charge more like $1000-$2000 because if you can buy the cheaper 2.0T pay only another $500 and be faster than the V6, why buy the V6?

[fastball]

Originally Posted by 90503

...All good points, but....I don't see the V-6 being that much more of a money-maker for Chevy.....

Unlike Ford, GM is positioning the 2.0T as the entry level in the Camaro hierarchy. So they are most certainly going to charge a premium for the V6. Even if it doesn't cost GM much to make the V6 model, they can charge more since it is now going to be the mid-level engine instead of the base as it is with the current 2010-15 5th gen. So, GM will get greater margins on every V6 they sell than they do now.

[fastball]

Originally Posted by EchoSide

I stand corrected on the V6 having a manual...Read the ordering guide wrong...

The Colbalt SS and the turbo Sky/Sol all had upgrades but they were fairly cheap, I think around $500ish for a 30-40/hp/tq gain...That alone could probably beat the V6 at least during your typical street race...So you have to wonder maybe they'll charge more like $1000-$2000 because if you can buy the cheaper 2.0T pay only another $500 and be faster than the V6, why buy the V6?

That's one reason they are bringing out the LTG for the Camaro. So GM can appeal to the tuner crowd. They've found that there are a lot of people who would love a Camaro but because it has only the V6 or V8 that they aren't as easy or cheap to tune as a 4 cylinder they don't want them. GM is positioning the LTG Camaro for the tuner crowd, sort of those who loved working on Hondas during the height of Fast and Furious - there's still a substantial market for that, and GM's taping into it.

They can make a boatload on accessories and tuner parts for the LTG.

However, there are also plenty of Camaro customers who want a personal luxury coupe, wants something smooth and quiet yet powerful, and maybe aren't GM loyalists but like the Camaro, or who are Camaro/GM enthusiasts but don't want to or can't afford to pay for the price/gas/insurance of the SS. For them GM will ALWAYS have the V6. Especially now that the new LGX makes 335-340 hp.

Getting the LTG to LGX power levels is going to be fun for the tuner crowd, and help GM make more money on accessories. But that's absolutely not a reason for GM to quit selling the V6. The V6 will remain the top seller of the three engines, even if the prices for the LGX and LTG are similar.

[fastball]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

I love the fact that Chevrolet didn't neuter one or the other like Ford did with the Mustang.

Ford is doing nothing but confusing the hell out of their customers with that hierarchy scheme.

C&D just tested the V6 and liked it. They thought a limited slip diff and other performance upgrades available on the EcoBoost would do wonders for it, but you can't get them. You can't get ANYTHING on the V6. Not even leather.

It's as if Ford feels their V6 is so awful they are trying to hide it from the public.

[whiteboyblues2001]

Originally Posted by fastball

It's as if Ford feels their V6 is so awful they are trying to hide it from the public.

From what I understand, Ford only added the V6 at a late stage as a cheaper version of the Mustang for fleet sales.

[Goblue1313]

That's the sad part of it. That V6 is a strong and very dependable engine. Like was said the rental car companies were not prepared to commit to the turbo engine Ecoboosts without more track record for reliability. So, the V6 was added back to the lineup. It would have been nice to have had the 4 as the base engine and the V6 as the option and let the marketplace decide which would be the popular choice. But cafe drives a lot of things now. If they can up their cafe average by one mile per gallon by pushing more Ecoboosts then that's what's gonna happen.

I'm just glad GM isn't doing that with the Camaro. Would love to be able to soup up the 4cyl but the reality of the situation is that it'll be my daily driver and I don't have the time or extra funds to spend on all the go fast parts. So I'd opt for the extra little bit for the V6 up front and enjoy that bump in power and not worry about warranty issues with the hot rod parts.

Originally Posted by fastball

Ford is doing nothing but confusing the hell out of their customers with that hierarchy scheme.

C&D just tested the V6 and liked it. They thought a limited slip diff and other performance upgrades available on the EcoBoost would do wonders for it, but you can't get them. You can't get ANYTHING on the V6. Not even leather.

It's as if Ford feels their V6 is so awful they are trying to hide it from the public.

[EchoSide]

I haven't looked this up, but usually forced induction requires premium fuel and perhaps both the mustang's and 6's V6 run on regular?

[laborsmith]

Usually but GM has detuned some turbo engines to run on 87. In the Playbook it states Premium is recommended for the 2.0T.

Laborsmith

[LbulletM]

I'm really interested to see sales numbers for 4 vs 6. Personally, I would want to go NA from the factory until I can't. No replacement for displacement!

[EchoSide]

I haven't been in any newer GM cars with a turbo like the ATS, but have been in the turbo'ed Cobalt SS & Sky redline along with STIs, WRXs and Evos...I've also been in V6 & V8 Camaros...Generally turbo cars are a way different experience...NAs, usually, pull pretty linear, feel the same g-force acceleration throughout...Turbo car, usually is more progressive, you mash the gas, there's .5-2 seconds of lags when it despite moving forward you feel like you're in a standstill, then it pulls you back in your seat and keeps pulling harder...Will be interesting to see how much of the turbo noises you'll hear along with if you'll be able to hear the blowoff valve...