[IOMike]

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

Do you just wander into threads and bash Ford?

GM vehicles have been a cut above Ford's for a while, that's not bashing.

Ford has some clever marketing and a lot of underwhelming vehicles. A few nice ones, but mostly underwhelming.

[396ssrat]

Originally Posted by 87GNX

Sorry, but a camaro is not a status symbol. The Germans are not the least bit worried.

To me personally, the BMW has about as much "status" as a Prius.

[Camaro_Corvette]

Originally Posted by 396ssrat

To me personally, the BMW has about as much "status" as a Prius.

So you would look at two people the same when one buys a luxury BMW, and the other buys a cheap fuel efficient Prius? Whatever helps you sleep at night.

[Thor142]

Originally Posted by Camaro_Corvette

So you would look at two people the same when one buys a luxury BMW, and the other buys a cheap fuel efficient Prius? Whatever helps you sleep at night.

Or maybe he's saying that the type of car some one buys doesn't give that person any "status" in his mind. Which I agree with if that's the case.

[Camaro_Corvette]

Originally Posted by Thor142

Or maybe he's saying that the type of car some one buys doesn't give that person any "status" in his mind. Which I agree with if that's the case.

That would be the only case. which I can understand that. I've seen the filthy rich drive next to anything.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by Cuda7050

We owned a BMW for three years. It was a great road car with beautiful leather interior and an awesome sound system. But it did have several electrical problems. When I was ready to get something new I wanted a more primal experience and ended up with a Camaro SS. My wife wanted something refined and more reliable, she got a Lexus. I think a Gen 6 is in my future, hopefully a ZL1.

I have four family members that in the last 10 years have traded in their BMW's for Porsches, Mercedes and Lexus' due to reliability issues. BMW should be worried about its product and its competition.

Agreed. Everyone I know who has owned a BMW says if you want to get one then only lease it during the 4 year warranty because they are terribly expensive to own due to constant repairs and high maintenance. And not your basic problems, we are talking electrical issues, engine issues, etc.

I am a big "bang for your buck" buyer, which is why the Camaro and Corvette are so attractive. I just hope Chevy doesn't keep inflating the prices of these cars so much that they get out of reach for most folks. I mean I grew up driving Trans AMs and Camaros as a kid and my 2013 SS 1LE is ~$40k. Chevy, please keep the 1SS in the $35k range. Please do it for our country. :-)

[Noob]

We Germans fear nothing except the EU idiots ruled by small, curupted and mostly bankrupt nations.

back to cars:
Our market is much smaller than yours and so are the roads, cities and parkslots.
This is in fact a serious problem of selling big cars or sporty cars like Camaro with huge blind spots. Even with rearcam they suck when driving into a parkhouse in germany. That´s why we drive so many hatchbacks and smaller car´s. Another fact are the high fuel prices and further more idotic EU taxes and own germany thing; our government supports Diesel engines, beside the fuel economy the diesel price is 10% lower than gasoline. In other countries gasoline is cheaper than diesel.
Drove Mustang GT 2013 a lot, 1 time a Camaro SS and a C7 for a week. Mustang was the best in daily driving (good mpg for such a power!) but with bad (soft and bumpy) suspension on bad roads or fast autobahn driving. C7 (also very good MPG !!)was best in track mode on autobahn, tour mode is much to soft and uncontrolled, sporty, so lala but for Autobahn only track mode offers the right feeling and pretty much sound ...never forget the rev matching growl when i pass fast cars with over 200km/h and look beside.....they got frightened,hehe my wife too
than buckle off and feel real free ! perhaps idiots are not only in the EU government, some sit in a crazy US car
Those rough,exotic or maybe oldschool things cant offer a german brand because they are petty bourgeois. Neither they can imagine what a driver like sometimes to do nor did they put this in their perspective....a Wheel Lock for tire shredding out of a factory car ? i´m sure many engineers and managers of BMW.AUDI,Mercedes dont understand, perhaps laugh a bit but all in all they dont take that seriously, better ignore. Sure its useless thing and a HUD is much more practical and a safety feature on autobahn but Ford did it, why not ? That´s exactly what i like from US car makers or some asia brands.....pls stay different and get your own niche and hold it ! Dodge 707hp serial cars ...... a thunderclap in our carworld, unfortunately all US brands are rare in germany, only Ford because it has a big factory in cologne which many germans see as a own brand. Remember, they produced over 50% of all military trucks for Adolf and at the same time for the US Army in the states. Haha, real capitalists support god and deal with the devil if they smell a profit

A problem all foreign brands have here are the import taxes and regulations for the market. A 2015 Mustang GT costs 45-50000€ which isn´t cheap !
A C7 75000-90000€ ! Still they are a bit cheaper than our own brands but not that much as in your country and now comes my question: Why on earth can offer our brands (AUDI,Benz,VW,BMW) their cars cheaper in USA than in germany ? Because otherwise they would sell nothing. But this brings u the next question; why dont your brands do they same in germany to get a foot into the market ?
Do they rather went with a few sold cars and big margin? perhaps ....but than US cars will never get in the main attention by the buyers.
greetings.....i cant wait to drive thet new SS with MRC and HUD.
Did someone know if the HUD does include the Navi feature from the C7 and which exhaust has the better sound ? The std. or the 4 pipes ? And i would like to have this nice front cam as in the C7 !

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Noob

We Germans fear nothing except the EU idiots ruled by small, curupted and mostly bankrupt nations.

back to cars:
Our market is much smaller than yours and so are the roads, cities and parkslots.
This is in fact a serious problem of selling big cars or sporty cars like Camaro with huge blind spots. Even with rearcam they suck when driving into a parkhouse in germany. That´s why we drive so many hatchbacks and smaller car´s. Another fact are the high fuel prices and further more idotic EU taxes and own germany thing; our government supports Diesel engines, beside the fuel economy the diesel price is 10% lower than gasoline. In other countries gasoline is cheaper than diesel.
Drove Mustang GT 2013 a lot, 1 time a Camaro SS and a C7 for a week. Mustang was the best in daily driving (good mpg for such a power!) but with bad (soft and bumpy) suspension on bad roads or fast autobahn driving. C7 (also very good MPG !!)was best in track mode on autobahn, tour mode is much to soft and uncontrolled, sporty, so lala but for Autobahn only track mode offers the right feeling and pretty much sound ...never forget the rev matching growl when i pass fast cars with over 200km/h and look beside.....they got frightened,hehe my wife too
than buckle off and feel real free ! perhaps idiots are not only in the EU government, some sit in a crazy US car
Those rough,exotic or maybe oldschool things cant offer a german brand because they are petty bourgeois. Neither they can imagine what a driver like sometimes to do nor did they put this in their perspective....a Wheel Lock for tire shredding out of a factory car ? i´m sure many engineers and managers of BMW.AUDI,Mercedes dont understand, perhaps laugh a bit but all in all they dont take that seriously, better ignore. Sure its useless thing and a HUD is much more practical and a safety feature on autobahn but Ford did it, why not ? That´s exactly what i like from US car makers or some asia brands.....pls stay different and get your own niche and hold it ! Dodge 707hp serial cars ...... a thunderclap in our carworld, unfortunately all US brands are rare in germany, only Ford because it has a big factory in cologne which many germans see as a own brand. Remember, they produced over 50% of all military trucks for Adolf and at the same time for the US Army in the states. Haha, real capitalists support god and deal with the devil if they smell a profit

A problem all foreign brands have here are the import taxes and regulations for the market. A 2015 Mustang GT costs 45-50000€ which isn´t cheap !
A C7 75000-90000€ ! Still they are a bit cheaper than our own brands but not that much as in your country and now comes my question: Why on earth can offer our brands (AUDI,Benz,VW,BMW) their cars cheaper in USA than in germany ? Because otherwise they would sell nothing. But this brings u the next question; why dont your brands do they same in germany to get a foot into the market ?
Do they rather went with a few sold cars and big margin? perhaps ....but than US cars will never get in the main attention by the buyers.
greetings.....i cant wait to drive thet new SS with MRC and HUD.
Did someone know if the HUD does include the Navi feature from the C7 and which exhaust has the better sound ? The std. or the 4 pipes ? And i would like to have this nice front cam as in the C7 !

You left out the fact that Germans, UNLIKE us Americans tend to prefer German made products. When I was in Germany a few years ago, I asked what the blue abandoned building was. "Oh, that was a Walmart. It closed. Cheap Chinese made goods don't sell well here." Germans buy German cars. It's why even Toyota/Lexus sells like crap there. There is a HUGE amount of German pride. Walk through the shop or office areas of OPEL and you see many signs and banners, "Opel is German". It's not, they know it, but hate it that they are an American company.

[Noob]

@Number3 sure there are still many who pay way to much for their overpriced german brand ! But the main reason for me is the price difference between a VW and a Toyota is not that much ! Same with US brands. Only Hyundai and KIA have adequate cars now on high std. very well eqiupt and are a good portion cheaper (thanks to a former AUDI designer Peter Schreyer)......i drive a KIA, too. And it had not 1 failure in 3 years now. Sure they are still a bit behind in suspension and finetuning but materials and quality of assembling seems very high and much more constant. In germany, with bad luck, you can get cars which are complete shitboxes, we call them Mondaycars because Monday most workers suffers from their sunday football play or beer,lol. In Asia they work 8-10 hours all day at same level seems to me, like robots, and only a few holiday days; unbelievable. The walmart was a few years to early in germany !....now we have many 1€ (each thing for 1€) markets and other´s. In some degree i´m surprised too because the life std. of average Fritz goes down from year to year but he still tries do drive a german brand, even if he cant afford it anymore. On the other hand many people work direct or indirect for/with the carindustry, so their is another reason. I think that´s not very different from your country.

[ajp]

Interested thread, I am actually looking at a used M4 vs a Gen6 convertible.

[Noob]

Originally Posted by ajp

Interested thread, I am actually looking at a used M4 vs a Gen6 convertible.

Hi, today a saw a M4 parking in dark orange metallic or something. Yeah from behind (quad exhaust and big tires) you can see the power but front and side is not much different at the first peek. Still a Limo. Audi RS5 looks more aggressive and sporty. Problem in Germany is, we see BMW,AUDI,Benz and their not very unique designs and montonic forntgrills all day long ...that was an M4 ? hm, ok, so what.
If a Mustang (before the actual softwash) or camaro or Challenger/Charger comes along....all eyes goes with it . and with it´s pure much better sound as long it´s a V8 !
perhaps its the way around in your country.
Why compare a M4 coupe against a heavy convertible ?
Good match for M4 is the Caddy ATS-V but it is not available in germany ...LOL same with the 8 speed automatik in C7....not available !
WHY ???