[JasonK]

The whole thing makes me sick. Everyone who had knowledge of this and done the "bare minimum" should rot in hell.

[earn88hardt]

happy valley no more.........

[8cd03gro]

IMO anyone that knew about it and didn't go straight to the police needs to go. I don't give a damn about this university procedure bullshit and neither should any of you. Just because you're a coach/trainer/administrator/etc. at a University doesn't give you a free pass to let this stuff go down. Oh, he reported it to his superior? That's what you do when there's a spill on aisle 6, not when there are young children being sexually abused. You go to the police as soon as you know it's happening, end of story.

[hotrodsally]

I wonder if this incident will result in the "Sherrice Iverson Law" becoming a federal law.

Named for 7 year-old Sherrice Iverson who was raped and murdered in 1997, the law criminalizes failure to report such crimes against children under 14, to police.

http://articles.latimes.com/2000/sep/19/local/me-23477


"The test of the morality of a society is what it does for its children".
~Dietrich Bonhoeffer


I guess we still have a long way to go.

[G-Oil Guy]

Board of Trustees acted like a bunch of ][Dussies and fired JoePa but didn't do anything to McQueary or the other two who were placed on leave.

Just fired JoePa and the University President.

[RubyCamaro]

Well the university is beginning to act as it should.....................finally. Let me speak to this matter as a Mental Health Therapist. One of my specialties treating child victims of sexual abuse and have done trainings at National conferences. I cannot speak to any laws except those in Tennessee. But in TN anyone who has reason to suspect that a child may have been abused in any manner covered by law is obligated to report it to POLICE/the Department of Children's Services. Failure to do so can result in being charged for failure to report the abuse. The person with said knowledge is not exempted from this law by reporting it to their supervisor/chain of command at work. A lot more folks need to be fired & charged in this case. A child abuse perpetrator never has just one victim. They don't stop victimizing. They can be treated, but not cured. There have been countless more victims in the years that have passed since this grossly negligent failure to report occurred. Having treated countless numbers of such victims I can tell you that their lives are shattered as are those of many of their family members. These over-compensated people who failed to protect these kids should have to pay for their mental health treatment for the rest of their lives plus a huge chunk of $ for pain & suffering AND have the legal book thrown at them!

[Skill377]

He just got fired by the board of trustees. It's doesn't surprise me that the board took this kind of action since the allegation were pretty serious!

[SSE 4 2SS]

Originally Posted by Ark5thGenGirl

I personally think that if Joe reported it to the athletic director, then he did his job. The athletic director should be the one to get roasted, not Joe. It's not his place to go to the cops, as I'm sure there are procedures to follow in these circumstances.

Maybe I'm missing something.

You're missing something... No offense intended.... Reporting it to a supervisor does not end responsibility... That's a start... when little or nothing is done, then it only makes you culpable if you do not follow up, up to and including going to the police... Would you so quickly forgive anyone... ANYONE... involved if they even had an inkling of knowledge and ddidn't report it... if it was your child...

Originally Posted by PQ

Having tried my best to give him the benefit of doubt, I put myself in his shoes. (assuming I'm 74 years old the way he was when he first found out what was going on. My age now I go to the shower and Sandusky doesn't leave til the copos get there or he beats my ass) An assistant just came to me and told me he saw Sandusky with a naked kid in the shower having sex do I report it to my boss and forget about it? Even watch Sandusky show up with other kids later? And just assume nothing is wrong?

Sorry. I go to the cops. He was 74 years old so he couldn't open up a can of beat down but for him to just pass the word along the chin of command is ludicrous. And so he must have been really convicing for NOTHING to have happened. The message stopped somewhere. And EVERYONE at that school from the eye witness to the last one told about it is equaly culpible in my eyes.

Again, we aren't talking about a dui cover-up, or paying players here.... children were RAPED. That word is just as hideous and vile and evil to me now as it was the first time I ever heard it and knew what it meant. Maybe it became mainstream and easy to hear down the line. But it's RAPE. And they were children.

Ugh..................

You don't just go to your boss and say...... 'Here's the budget for July, we gave 32 scholarships and have a few MRI's to complete, the feild crew needs to look at that sprinklerhead sticking up, a kid was raped in the shower, and and cancel me press conference I need to look at some game film from Saturday.

Amen...

As I am married to an NCAA Athletic Director, I hear some of the details of the occurances that occur on campus... in a much smaller University... I also hear about a lot of the shennigans the NCAA is involved with... as for the "NCAA", I personally think the whole lot should be lined up and sent to a remote island somewhere... What a catastrophic situation that is... They couldn't manage a peewee basketball tourney... It's all about money... pure and simple... and thats a shame since it involves amateur athletics..

If someone reported a similar incident to my wife, she would movee heaven and earth to remove the person, insure the police were involved... and work to expunge every remnant of that person ever having been there... and if they, the University, tried to place a gag order and failed to follow up on it, she would no longer be employed there... Yes we discussed this situation specifically...

I have no empathy, and most assuredly no sympathy for any of the persons that knew anything and are now being publicly chastised... In a case involving child abuse, sexual child abuse... they all need to rot in hell... There is even a status level among prisoners... and child abusers are the lowest form of scum even in our jacked up prisons..

Do we in the name of sports, or winning, or whatever other ****amamie excuse allow tragic events like this to go on, or to be covered up... for JoePa... for the President of the University, or the President of the United States... Come on people... If you put the reputation and standing of a coach above the safety of a child... of proper actions... of moral actions... then you need to re-evaluate your priorities...

Originally Posted by Wantconvertible

He should have called the cops,

Originally Posted by PQ

Originally Posted by Zeaux6

What specifics he knew about (or not) does not excuse him from ensuring something is done. Why he never followed up with his superiors especially after seeing that Sandusky was still around is criminal in my opinion. Put your own child in that position and question what was an obligation on Paterno's part. It is pretty easy to see since I have three kids.

Separate the football godlike image of Paterno from him just being a person with moral obligations to question when something does not seem right. In my opinion he is just as culpable.

If it wasn't Paterno, then most of this unfortunately wouldn't be nationally news worthy... That's on us... All Schools and most businesses would want this to quietly go away... but for this idiot to be allowed back on campus... Does he still have his childrens charities... if so... then I ask why... How???

Originally Posted by PQ

Memo to all of my freinds, family members, kids, and anyone I know. If you don't call the cops if someone tells you a child was being raped on your job don't call on me for sympathy.

- Randy PeQueen

Don't call me either...

Originally Posted by BackinBlackSS/RS

This is a tragedy on so many levels. Not the least of which are those poor children. Seeing Jo Pa end his career like this is just a damn shame, but he just didn't do what he needed to do. We have to ask why? If he had made sure it was reported to authorites initially, this would have gone down in such a more positive manner for Joe, the administration and the entire University.

I just saw the news where Paterno was fired... good riddance... If he knew about it in 2002 and didn't do anything more than he did... he is just as culpable and should be gone...

Originally Posted by BackinBlackSS/RS

It was reported that Sandusky was at the facillities last week working out. Is that not true, because if it is, that's all I need to know that they ALL must go, NOW.

yup... and unfortunately for thee remains of Penn State... They'll be years living this onee down...

Originally Posted by Zabo

Big Ten is dead.

SEC will soon follow (their shenanigans are no less than what the Big Ten is getting 'found out' on, even though the NCAA probably knew about this Penn situation for YEARS).

Then probably Pac 10 or Big 12..

Huh??? flinging crap to other locations will not reduce the implications for Penn State.. I agree, the NCAA is out of control... They ought to do away with the amateur status of all the events and participants and treat it like as it is... but then all the NCAA admins would loose their income... can't have that can we...

Originally Posted by BackinBlackSS/RS

Oh, also, what about the muriel of Sandusky on the football stadium/complex that they JUST today painted over. Why was that even still up there? They still had this guys picture on the football stadium up until today. What does that tell you?

uh... we know nothing..nothing...nothing... Sgt. Schultz... voice

Originally Posted by PQ

I totaly agree.

BUT, again, put yourself in Joes shoes. GA comes to you and reports that he SAW that. Heard, saw, doesn't matter, you have to protect what you love. And for Joe it was his program in this case. To simply report it and forget it is negligence. RAPE??? I'm sorry, but I know better than that.

I'm NOT saying Joe Paterno should be held criminaly responsible, but he let down that kid and a few kids later as well. And so did ANYONE at that school with knowlege of this at the time.

So, Joe Paterno has the power to tell the whole school "Screw you, I'm not quiting. I'll coach until I decide I want to quit" but doesn't have the power to make sure Sandusky is brought to light? The GA waited a day to report what he witnessed and Joe waited another day to report after that. THAT'S what's so disturbing here.

I certainly hope I'm wrong. You're Not...

AND I'M JUST GOING BY WHAT I'M FINDING OUT. And Joe Paternos own words.

Bottom line, the most powerful, influential and capable person in this whole thing was Joe. And he dropped the ball. I hate to use the old clishe' but it fits here. With great power comes great responsibility. If those who are capable and influential won't help, it makes it much harder.

Absolutely agree 100%

He should be ashamed of himself to the uttmost.

Agreed.

But even though Sandusky didn't work for Joe, Joe had the power ot make sure something was done.

Originally Posted by G-Oil Guy

I cannot excuse the university administration or the janitors, local police, university police or the District Attorney. They all had ample time and cause to nip this in the bud long before 2002. Same thing goes for JoePa the minute he knew... why is he exempt when none of the others are, because he's a coach... Not flying down here...

I still think JoePa did nothing wrong. Also, I do not know if he went to legal counsel or not or if he was following procedure of Penn State or not, I was simply stating how it is at another university and a company in the private sector. If I stumbled upon something like this at work, I'd be required to contact company legal counsel first who would then direct me how to involve the local authorities.

This is inherently wrong... Legal counsel first screams cover up... I'ld go to my supervisor.... and if in short order the person was still around... then I would follow up... and I would damn sure havee some answers from someone why it wasn't being pursued... or, I would have to find employment elsewhere and believe me, the news would damn sure hear about it then... and I would be asking the local police if they were aware of the situation... There is right and wrong... and fortunately I know the difference... I also remember that these cultural icons called coaches/athletes etc... are people, and not above the laws... I have more respect for the average soldier, firefighter etc... Someone that actually puts it all on thee line for us... not an overpaid premadonna...

Originally Posted by G-Oil Guy

Morality and Legality go hand in hand. Unfortunately in this litigious society that we now live in, it could have gone very bad for PSU (monetarily I mean) had they acted hastily and handed Sandusky over or made the accusations public.

Nowadays morality takes a back seat to legality. I'm sorry but if I'm told by a superior to STFU and GBTW and that they will take care of it, I'm going to do just that. This then covers me and my company legally. Morally, I'll hate myself but unless I can assure that I can get this to the police under complete anonymity, I'm going to stop. It's then the responsibility of the lawyer (as they know of an on-going crime) to notify the authorities.

The only way they could have gone further is if they had actively encouraged the GA to go to the police as he was the only eye witness that they knew of at the time (I don't know if they knew what the Janitors had seen).

Monetarily... big mouth full there...

You are covered legally if they tell you to STFU and GBTW...
wrong... you knew... nothing was done... and the actions continue... you're culpable... your employed, but just as culpable as the rest...

Ever hear of the whistle blowers act... look it up... yes, you'll possibly end up leaving a bad situation...on your own... but you'll remain free and be able to sleep comfortably at night...

Originally Posted by JasonK

The whole thing makes me sick. Everyone who had knowledge of this and done the "bare minimum" should rot in hell.

AMEN....

[Moose]

Joe can look in the mirror and find the person to blame for his career ending this way.

It's disgusting.

[toesuf94]

As a Nittany Lion, I lost a hero and a friend today. I had the great pleasure of spending time with Joe on many occasions while I was a student at Penn State from 92-94. He was always giving of his time and always was humble in his actions when praised. He spent 46 years living by the book - not one NCAA violation. If a player so much as stepped the slightest bit out of line, he was either benched or off the CAMPUS - not just off the team. This man wrote the book on toeing the line. This is why I can say with some certainty that Joe would not lie about something as deviant as Sandusky molesting a child. It is just not in his make up to lie about something like this. For him to get fired like this is the most disheartening thing I have ever experienced, it is like losing a family member! The university is in cover it's ass mode right now and the blood is going to spill - even that of our hero - and frankly, it sucks.

In reading the indictment, Joe is never once mentioned as WITNESSING anything between Sandusky and any child. He was made a party when Mike McQuery DIRECTLY WITNESSED Sandusky raping a child in the shower of the football building after hours on a Friday night around 9...and did nothing to stop the act from happening or helping the child escape from Sandusky. He should have beaten Sandusky to a pulp and THEN called police. Instead he calls his own father, then Joe. That just does not make sense to me at all. For his inaction, a coaching legend has fallen. I agree that Joe should have done more, but his calling the police as a non-witness based on what Mike McQuery told him he saw would have done nothing. That would be hearsay at that point and would be something the cops could do nothing with. McQuery however SHOULD HAVE BEEN MADE TO CALL THE COPS - Why he wasn't is one of the things I have been asking myself over and over again. This happened in a University building - university police should have been notified immediately.

If we go back further, in 1998 a mother of one of the victims DID call police. The cops listened in at a distance while the mother confronted Sandusky about what was going on and Sandusky admitted to touching her boy while naked, and admitted to what amounted to 'innapropriate touching' with her son. He also apologized and commented that he "wished he were dead" for what he had done...and the police did NOTHING. This could have stopped right there...and it did not. She did not press charges and the cops did not either.

There will be more to come out about this as the months roll on. More victims are coming forward every hour it seems. I am praying for those who have not come forward as of yet to find the strength to come forward and hopefully find some resolution in all of this. I will pray for those who have suffered for so long under this piece of shit Sandusky, and all of those lives that he has destroyed or forever darkend through his sick actions.

And to answer some questions as to why Sandusky had keys to the football building: He is an alumnus of Penn State and it was part of his retirement package to have access to the campus and the football facilities where he had an office. He was spotted on campus last week working out, and he was only totally banned from the campus after his arrest on Saturday. As an alumnus, I am allowed to use facilities on campus as well when I go back to visit.

I will still cheer for the current team to win out this year and hopefully get a shot at the B1G 10 championship. This is not about the current players on the team or anything that THEY did - this is about the administration and the fact that they did not put an end to Sandusky's behavior when they had the chance. As a Nittany Lion, I want to know why they chose not to act. It is my right.

And to clear something up: Yes, I agree that Joe should have been fired for not following up on what was happening with Schultz and Curley after McQuery had met with them. I am really happy to see the president of the university get canned as well. Much like Joe, I regret he did not do more - something, ANYTHING, more to keep this from lasting as long as it did. I am sad to not see Joe's career ending like this, but he had the power to make a difference and did not. (WE do not know if he was told to keep it quiet however - if he was, I hope it is proven and the person who made that call is hanged)

[PQ]

Originally Posted by toesuf94

I agree that Joe should have done more, but his calling the police as a non-witness based on what Mike McQuery told him he saw would have done nothing.

I respect your post and agree with much of it. Joe Pa is not evil. Just hideously negligent and maybe a bit cowardly.

But I do aboslutely disagree with what I quoted here.

If Joe paterno goes to the police with this story (as he should have) the cops go STRAIGHT TO McQUERY. And Joe pushes his weight around at that point and shit gets done. GAURANTEED.

Again, set the scene....... the way it should have happened.

McQuery: Hey coach, I saw Jerry Sandusky in the locker room raping a young boy who looked to be maybe 10 years old.

Joe Pa: (dropping EVERYTHING he was doing) What? Now? Where? (heading for the door) Are you sure? (sense of urgency as he heads toward the door to go to the locker room)

McQuery: No no, it was last night, I was here late and I saw it.

Joe Pa: (as serious as he's ever been in his life) Are you SURE? Did you call the police? Where's the police? (now headed down the hall toward the ADs office) Holy shit, are you sure? And you just **** left him there?

McQuery: I, I , didn't know what to do, I was scared.....

Joe Pa: (Now yelling while walking) AND HOW DO YOU THINK THE KID FELT YOU ****ING MORON.

*get's to the ADs or whoevers office*

Joe Pa: CALL THE POLICE, JERRY SANDUSKY RAPED A LITTEL BOY LASTNIGHT HERE IN THE LOCKER ROOM.

And he has McQuery there for the cops. He calls the cops himself if he has to. And to not call the cops, he put the University over the child.

For Paterno to hear about it from the coward (McQuery) and then tell the AD or whoever the next day is ludicrous, calice and irresponsible. And then to ignore what happens later. Even further down the pathetic hole.

If Joe has lost that much common sense and sense of reality then so be it. His seeming remorse tells much of the story though.

[toesuf94]

Originally Posted by PQ

I respect your post and agree with much of it. Joe Pa is not evil. Just hideously negligent and maybe a bit cowardly.

But I do aboslutely disagree with what I quoted here.

If Joe paterno goes to the police with this story (as he should have) the cops go STRAIGHT TO McQUERY. And Joe pushes his weight around at that point and shit gets done. GAURANTEED.

Again, set the scene....... the way it should have happened.

McQuery: Hey coach, I saw Jerry Sandusky in the locker room raping a young boy who looked to be maybe 10 years old.

Joe Pa: (dropping EVERYTHING he was doing) What? Now? Where? (heading for the door) Are you sure? (sense of urgency as he heads toward the door to go to the locker room)

McQuery: No no, it was last night, I was here late and I saw it.

Joe Pa: (as serious as he's ever been in his life) Are you SURE? Did you call the police? Where's the police? (now headed down the hall toward the ADs office) Holy shit, are you sure? And you just **** left him there?

McQuery: I, I , didn't know what to do, I was scared.....

Joe Pa: (Now yelling while walking) AND HOW DO YOU THINK THE KID FELT YOU ****ING MORON.

*get's to the ADs or whoevers office*

Joe Pa: CALL THE POLICE, JERRY SANDUSKY RAPED A LITTEL BOY LASTNIGHT HERE IN THE LOCKER ROOM.

And he has McQuery there for the cops. He calls the cops himself if he has to. And to not call the cops, he put the University over the child.

For Paterno to hear about it from the coward (McQuery) and then tell the AD or whoever the next day is ludicrous, calice and irresponsible. And then to ignore what happens later. Even further down the pathetic hole.

If Joe has lost that much common sense and sense of reality then so be it. His seeming remorse tells much of the story though.

I agree 100% of your post of what SHOULD have happened - this is probably where you find Joe's remorse. He should have gone against the University rules of reporting this to 'higher ups' and done more. I would also like to point out that a Grand Jury investigation of 8 years resulted in absolutely ZERO charges or any wrong doing on Joe's part...and a week of flimsy reporting by the media without much facts or true knowledge of what actually occured to destroy a 46 year carrer. We do not know the full story here, but the media took the opportunity to focus on the wrong guy. Sandusky should have been the focus here...but that wasn't the story that sold.

I wish the media would spend as much time vetting our congressmen, senators, and president as they did an 84 year old football coach.

[2ndgenz28]

So Joe is fired, but the guy who directly witnessed the crime in action, will be on the side lines at the next game?

[TurboTA]

Originally Posted by toesuf94

I agree 100% of your post of what SHOULD have happened - this is probably where you find Joe's remorse. He should have gone against the University rules of reporting this to 'higher ups' and done more. I would also like to point out that a Grand Jury investigation of 8 years resulted in absolutely ZERO charges or any wrong doing on Joe's part...and a week of flimsy reporting by the media without much facts or true knowledge of what actually occured to destroy a 46 year carrer. We do not know the full story here, but the media took the opportunity to focus on the wrong guy. Sandusky should have been the focus here...but that wasn't the story that sold.

I wish the media would spend as much time vetting our congressmen, senators, and president as they did an 84 year old football coach.

You make some good points but then repeatedly defend Paterno. He ran that institution PERIOD. He could have done whatever or told whoever he wanted. According to his own words, he was told that there was some fondling and inappropriate touching of a child by a grown man naked in the shower. That wasn't enough for him to act? These coaching staffs spend more time with each other than their own families. Do you honestly think that he and McQueary or the other coaches ever discussed it again. He continued to let Sandusky use the facilities and run a program for children knowing full well what happened. He makes me sick. The whole staff makes me sick. THEY KNEW! The FEDS are now involved with the lack of reporting the incident. Joe is in hot water still.