[cadyshac]

I have a '18 2 SS M6 (TR6060). I bought the car about 9 months ago with less than 6K miles on it, now has 16K. The only mod on the car is I installed skip shift eliminator. Shortly after purchasing I switched out the transmission fluid to Royal Purple. I've had issues with 2nd gear from the start, the switch to RP had no effect. First shift of the day to 2nd is always notchy and usually comes with a slight grind. From the beginning I attributed this to internals of the tranny but now I am having questions about the shifter itself. Sometimes getting it to go "all the way" into 2nd gear is tough and if you release the clutch to soon it will pop out of gear and grind if your hand is still on shifter. Sometimes it goes normally into 2nd with the feel of out of 1st to neutral detent and then fully into 2nd detent. And sometimes it seems to go fully from 1st into 2nd with no detents at all. And finally sometimes it goes out of 1st into neutral detent but then only about half or 3/4 shifter travel into 2nd and this is when problems happen if you let the clutch out. After several grinds I've learned to get my hand off the shifter before letting the clutch out to avoid possible grind. A few times when shifting into 1st at a complete stop it has been hard to get fully into gear and will "pop" out of gear if not fully engaged and you let the clutch out. (I hope this makes sense)
The fact that the car was such low miles with 2 previous owners leads me to believe that one of those owners was not great at shifting and probably tried to override the CAGS by forcing the shifter into 2nd and perhaps causing some damage to the shifter?
After much reading, searching and analyzing my experiences with the car I am thinking the problem may be mostly in the stock shifter. I am thinking about switching to the Hurst short throw shifter is this the one I should be looking at?
https://www.holley.com/products/driv.../parts/3916047

This is not the same as the 1LE factory shifter, correct?
Also I have read about the rubber/plastic bushings that wear out but are these only on the 4 & 6 cylinder cars?
It looks like the Hurst shifter comes with metal bushings?
I contacted full metal bushings and they confirmed their metal bushings are only for the non SS cars.
Thanks in advance for your responses/help with this. BTW I am not a stranger to the TR6060 and I do not expect a shifter swap to fix the 2nd gear grind.

[DeuceCam]

Mine also doesn't like shifting into 2nd when cold. Shifting from 1st-to-2nd is fine after 5-10 mins of driving. (I bought a 2006 WRX STI new and it had similar issues.) However, if I shift into 2nd while stopped, sometimes it feels like it won't go all the way into gear, in which case I have shift back to neutral and try 2nd again - I often have the same problem with 1st gear. Sometimes 1st and 2nd gear engage butterly smooth, but this is not the norm in my experience.

The SS shifter is not the same as the 1LE shifter, but I think the 1LE shifter can be optioned on the SS. The only difference (that I know of) is a small reduction in throw, but I wonder if the 1LE also gets stiffer bushings.

I didn't realize the fullmetalbushing offering was only for the TR3160. Thank you for pointing that out. I also wonder if the TR6060 shifter has plastic bushings in the same spot.

I too am thinking about the Hurst shifter because of this. (I changed the shifter to a Kartboy unit on my old STI and it completely got rid of the 2nd gear notchiness, even when cold.)

The other day I swapped in a weighted shift knob with a height extension and it does help some, but does not fix the 2nd gear cold issue, or the notchy 1st gear.

[Ventmaster]

Over time I've tried multiple aftermarket synthetic gear oils in the Camaro's manual trans and it just seems temperature dependent no matter which is in it. Until the trans is a bit warmed up and in order to minimize trauma to the 2nd gear synchro, I just do a first to third gear shift. If you're not in a rush, it's no problem for these 6.2L motors. You won't "bog " the engine, IMHO.

[cadyshac]

So the 1LE shifter is not the same as the aftermarket Hurst short throw either, correct?
Even after my trans is warmed up I sometimes randomly have problems with the shifter pulling all the way into 2nd gear and I am now thinking this is a shifter problem, not a trans internal problem. Once warmed up there is no "grind" but it just doesn't want to go all the way into gear and will "pop out" if you let the clutch out in that situation.

[DeuceCam]

^Sometimes I have the same issue when trying to select 1st or 2nd gear while stopped. I also have a feeling the issue is in the shifter/linkage assembly. I wish swapping the shifter assembly was easier. (There's many interesting engineering decisions GM made on this model.)

[cadyshac]

I've researched what is involved in changing out the shifter and I am thinking of doing it myself anyway. I just wish I could be more assured that the new shifter would be an improvement. I am also thinking of swapping out the Royal Purple for another brand of tranny fluid.

[m6-lt1]

Unfortunately I think you have a clutch disengagement issue since your car struggles to go into first. I still think you should try what I suggest to see if the 1-2 shift improves when cold.

1) turn rev match on and keep it on. It doesn’t just match revs on downshifts. It matches on upshifts and makes each shift occur perfectly at the perfect rpm based on speed.
2) after you turn your car on go through all the gears before you drive away including reverse. Go through each gear at least 2 times. You can keep your foot down on the clutch or lift between shifts.
3) drive away and slow your shift speed down on the 1-2 shift. The rpm will not drop down too fast because rev match will hold it at the proper rpm for a few seconds before it falls down too fast idle speeds.

I bet if you do all that your 1-2 shift will be better. Your car may even not get sticking trying to enter first. Also don’t enter first unless your car is at a complete stop.

[Ventmaster]

Originally Posted by cadyshac

So the 1LE shifter is not the same as the aftermarket Hurst short throw either, correct?
Even after my trans is warmed up I sometimes randomly have problems with the shifter pulling all the way into 2nd gear and I am now thinking this is a shifter problem, not a trans internal problem. Once warmed up there is no "grind" but it just doesn't want to go all the way into gear and will "pop out" if you let the clutch out in that situation.

Correct. The 1LE shifter provides (if I remember correctly) a 15% reduction in throw and the Hurst does 40%. It sounds kind've radical, but it works so well!
I'm sure 2 previous owners opens up a great many possible abuses in the past, but if you decide to replace the shifter, you'll be glad it's there even if the trans requires (hopefully not), a deeper dive.
Also as previously mentioned, after repeated syn gear oils tried, I just returned to the OE (I believe it's a mineral oil actually) recommended by GM.

[DeuceCam]

^Chevy reports an 8.75% reduction for the 1LE assembly. (It makes one wonder why they even bothered to produce 2 different assemblies.)

https://accessories.chevrolet.com/pr...022&bac=114643

Originally Posted by m6-lt1

Unfortunately I think you have a clutch disengagement issue since your car struggles to go into first. I still think you should try what I suggest to see if the 1-2 shift improves when cold.

1) turn rev match on and keep it on. It doesn’t just match revs on downshifts. It matches on upshifts and makes each shift occur perfectly at the perfect rpm based on speed.
2) after you turn your car on go through all the gears before you drive away including reverse. Go through each gear at least 2 times. You can keep your foot down on the clutch or lift between shifts.
3) drive away and slow your shift speed down on the 1-2 shift. The rpm will not drop down too fast because rev match will hold it at the proper rpm for a few seconds before it falls down too fast idle speeds.

I bet if you do all that your 1-2 shift will be better. Your car may even not get sticking trying to enter first. Also don’t enter first unless your car is at a complete stop.

Interesting. I'll give this a shot. Fwiw, I don't notice a difference with auto rev match engaged only

Side note: Does anyone have issues shifting through gears (with the clutch in) when the car is off? Mine usually won't shift through all gears smoothly; I can usually engage only a gear or two at a time while the other gears feel like they don't want to fully engage, and it's not the same gears every time. Hard to explain. It's odd. I'm not sure if this is normal for these cars.

[cadyshac]

Originally Posted by m6-lt1

Unfortunately I think you have a clutch disengagement issue since your car struggles to go into first. I still think you should try what I suggest to see if the 1-2 shift improves when cold.

1) turn rev match on and keep it on. It doesn’t just match revs on downshifts. It matches on upshifts and makes each shift occur perfectly at the perfect rpm based on speed.
2) after you turn your car on go through all the gears before you drive away including reverse. Go through each gear at least 2 times. You can keep your foot down on the clutch or lift between shifts.
3) drive away and slow your shift speed down on the 1-2 shift. The rpm will not drop down too fast because rev match will hold it at the proper rpm for a few seconds before it falls down too fast idle speeds.

I bet if you do all that your 1-2 shift will be better. Your car may even not get sticking trying to enter first. Also don’t enter first unless your car is at a complete stop.

Thanks, I'll give it a try can't hurt.

[cadyshac]

Originally Posted by Ventmaster

Correct. The 1LE shifter provides (if I remember correctly) a 15% reduction in throw and the Hurst does 40%. It sounds kind've radical, but it works so well!
I'm sure 2 previous owners opens up a great many possible abuses in the past, but if you decide to replace the shifter, you'll be glad it's there even if the trans requires (hopefully not), a deeper dive.
Also as previously mentioned, after repeated syn gear oils tried, I just returned to the OE (I believe it's a mineral oil actually) recommended by GM.

Yes, I am thinking of going back to the actual Tremec fluid.

[DeuceCam]

I tried what m6-lt1 recommended and no change, but I was already using the rev match feature and shifting into 2nd gear with finesse. cadyshac, your ymmv.

I would also try shifting from 1st-to-3rd the first 5-10 mins of driving until you get a feel for when the trans is warmed up. Stop trying to shift into 2nd gear after a cold start, some transmissions just don't like it. After the trans warms up, when shifting from 1st-to-2nd, try slowing down the movement, as m6-lt1 mentioned; try and let the shifter fall into gear when it wants to, rather than forcing into gear.

Imo, the high location of the armrest & shifter assembly in the car, combined with the low shift knob height (on the shifter assembly) and long shift throw, results in moderate effort required to shift through-the-gears; it's not ergonomic, making the 1-2 shift especially awkward. Raising the shift knob height and increasing the shift knob weight helped in my case with ergonomics, but that said, I wasn't having big issues engaging 2nd gear from 1st (although it is notchy and requires finesse in my case).

cadyshac, does 2nd engage normal under WOT and/or a redline shift?

[cadyshac]

Originally Posted by DeuceCam

I tried what m6-lt1 recommended and no change, but I was already using the rev match feature and shifting into 2nd gear with finesse. cadyshac, your ymmv.

I would also try shifting from 1st-to-3rd the first 5-10 mins of driving until you get a feel for when the trans is warmed up. Stop trying to shift into 2nd gear after a cold start, some transmissions just don't like it. After the trans warms up, when shifting from 1st-to-2nd, try slowing down the movement, as m6-lt1 mentioned; try and let the shifter fall into gear when it wants to, rather than forcing into gear.

Imo, the high location of the armrest & shifter assembly in the car, combined with the low shift knob height (on the shifter assembly) and long shift throw, results in moderate effort required to shift through-the-gears; it's not ergonomic, making the 1-2 shift especially awkward. Raising the shift knob height and increasing the shift knob weight helped in my case with ergonomics, but that said, I wasn't having big issues engaging 2nd gear from 1st (although it is notchy and requires finesse in my case).

cadyshac, does 2nd engage normal under WOT and/or a redline shift?

I also tried what m6-lt1 suggested and it did make a difference for me. I shifted from 1st into 2nd while cold and no grind or problem getting it to go into gear. I will continue to try this for a while and evaluate how this is working.
I have been going 1st to 3rd when cold and that works too.
I've never even had it to redline to go 1st to 2nd but it does go into 2nd with no problem under hard acceleration, maybe 3500-4000 rpms
I am thinking of switching to the actual Tremec brand tranny fluid to see how that does.
I'm not sure I agree with your theory on "shifter geometry" but I don't disagree with you either.
FWIW I also had a 5th gen SS M6 that was "notchy" going into 2nd but Redline D4 fluid seemed to help with that car.
I just want the damn thing to work without having to wave a magic wand at it every morning when it's cold.
I never shift into 1st at more than a very slow roll at a traffic signal. I also have several pieces of equipment at work with unsynchronized transmissions so I am no stranger to "feeling my way" into gear on those tranny's.
I still think my stock shifter may be the culprit when on occasion I can't get it into 1st or 2nd with buttery smoothness, it feels more like the shifter is binding up but only occasionally.
Keep this thread going, maybe we can all benefit from it.

[DeuceCam]

Glad it helped in your case.
The 1-2 shift on mine also operates normal/smooth under heavy load.
In OEM config, shifting from 1-2 feels awkward IMO with where everything is located in the cabin, but maybe it's because I have my seat down as low as it can go (prob just me).
Generally speaking, my car doesn't like shifting through gears when off.
Def interested to hear if the Tremec fluid (or other) is an improvement - I've read mixed things on this, but I have noticed subtle differences using different oils in other models..