[jlaudio11]

Setup of the car is in my signature and I haven't done a lot of racing this year like I did last year. I actually haven't even ran the car to the 1/4 on a prepped track to try to better my 9.28@153. I have been dailying the car more, trying to dial in the drivability more and more and have had pretty good success.

Yesterday I drove the car to work everything working smoothly and rolled into it after manually shifting down and took it from about 60 to 120 in 5th under light boost ( wastegate pressure of 6lbs). After work I came out, flashed the ecm only with some fuel changes, let it warm up for a little bit and then headed home. As I pulled out onto a main road and got the car up to speed I noticed the converter wasn't locking up. I was actually logging to capture the fuel changes and saw tcc line pressure going up but converter slip still high as if the converter was unlocked. I stopped and tried flashing the ecm/tcm this time, no difference. I stopped again and flashed the tune that I drove into work on and still nothing. The only code I'm getting is a P2817 solenoid H performance/stuck off. I reached out to Circle D thinking it was an issue with the converter and they suggest I pull the pan and look at the fluid, that p2817 is a valve body issue and I have some kind of contamination. That's what I'm going to do. It's just wild and I can't really explain why it would have such a dramatic issue so suddenly. Looking at the log from the drive in, the tcc slip was rock solid. The drive home it just decided it wasn't any longer.

[cjperformance]

I don't have any advice, but didnt want to leave you hanging! I sympathize with the torque converter lockup woes. Mine still doesn't lock at WOT. Hopefully your fix is a solenoid and/or fluid switch away. Good luck!

[jlaudio11]

I took the car out Wed night to see if it would magically fix itself like it broke or give me more clues. It actually was clicking this time and still not locking up. From research I think it might be something with the pump drive gear/ idler. The gears on a GM 10 speed are helical compared to straight cut on the fords. Apparently the idler gear will walk off the bearing its pressed onto, start getting into the front cover and cause issues with the pump. I found a deal on a used trans, 2020 with 34k mi on it, getting it shipped from detroit to my work in Gary, IN (near Chicago) for $2400. So I plan to pull mine this weekend, open it up and try to see what actually failed and if my suspicions are correct. Then send out the converter to circle d for inspection. The new used should be here next week. If the gears are the problem on mine, I might try swapping the new unit to the the ford design before it goes in. Who knows maybe my current trans isn't in too bad of shape. The same way that I've enjoyed learning to build engines, tuning etc I might try to build my own transmission over the winter or something but the car will be drivable in the meantime.

[jlaudio11]

Some updated info. I got the old trans out, pulled the pan to inspect and sent the converter off. I’ll attach some pictures here. The fluid was dark but still had red to it and was not burnt. In any of my logs I don’t think fluid temp has gotten up over 180. The most info I’ve gotten from someone with experience was Fisher Built, a transmission builder. When I told him what I had going on and showed him these pics he said my 1356789 clutch pack had failed and then the converter failed. He basically said hard lock up and multiple clutches being applied for each gear covered the clutch wear until it couldn’t anymore. I did send the converter back to circle d for inspection. They say that the lock up clutch had some wear but that there was no mechanical damage inside the converter. I am having them loosen it up while they have it. I’m hoping looser will help get up into the power easier. I’ve tried different launch rpms and gears but have not gotten the car to 60’ much harder than my 9.28 pass.

[Joshinator99]

Good info, thanks for the update.

[cmitchell17]

Originally Posted by jlaudio11

Some updated info. I got the old trans out, pulled the pan to inspect and sent the converter off. I’ll attach some pictures here. The fluid was dark but still had red to it and was not burnt. In any of my logs I don’t think fluid temp has gotten up over 180. The most info I’ve gotten from someone with experience was Fisher Built, a transmission builder. When I told him what I had going on and showed him these pics he said my 1356789 clutch pack had failed and then the converter failed. He basically said hard lock up and multiple clutches being applied for each gear covered the clutch wear until it couldn’t anymore. I did send the converter back to circle d for inspection. They say that the lock up clutch had some wear but that there was no mechanical damage inside the converter. I am having them loosen it up while they have it. I’m hoping looser will help get up into the power easier. I’ve tried different launch rpms and gears but have not gotten the car to 60’ much harder than my 9.28 pass.

Did you actually disassembly the transmission and get pictures of the clutches? Or was he guessing what had happened after you told him the symptoms? I would like to see how the clutches and steels looked. In my opinion transmissions are notorious for not having the supposed "guaranteed" issues and how its a ticking time bomb and everything else like that. You see people everywhere with their theories about how this happens which leads to this and its guaranteed to happen to you and its because some supposedly stupid engineer didn't fix this or that. But given their relative complexity and the fact they have multiple systems working together (hydraulic, electronic, mechanical) they are surprisingly reliable. But of course if you don't have your airflow model correct, after you have done a cam or forced induction, you are going to through off the torque model and a lot of other things and can kill it fast.

I could never get my circle D to lock at all either and I tried a lot of different things and eventually just gave up. Circle D did supposedly go back through it, but at that point I was tired of messing with it and ended up selling it for probably almost half of what I paid since I didn't know if it would lock up or not and I didn't want to pull my engine again and install it just to find out.

[jlaudio11]

Originally Posted by cmitchell17

Did you actually disassembly the transmission and get pictures of the clutches? Or was he guessing what had happened after you told him the symptoms? I would like to see how the clutches and steels looked. In my opinion transmissions are notorious for not having the supposed "guaranteed" issues and how its a ticking time bomb and everything else like that. You see people everywhere with their theories about how this happens which leads to this and its guaranteed to happen to you and its because some supposedly stupid engineer didn't fix this or that. But given their relative complexity and the fact they have multiple systems working together (hydraulic, electronic, mechanical) they are surprisingly reliable. But of course if you don't have your airflow model correct, after you have done a cam or forced induction, you are going to through off the torque model and a lot of other things and can kill it fast.

I could never get my circle D to lock at all either and I tried a lot of different things and eventually just gave up. Circle D did supposedly go back through it, but at that point I was tired of messing with it and ended up selling it for probably almost half of what I paid since I didn't know if it would lock up or not and I didn't want to pull my engine again and install it just to find out.

I have not disassembled it yet. I have a wedding coming up in just over 3 weeks. I was splurging spending money on the trans to have the car there lol. Fisher built just gave his input off of the pictures and info I shared. I asked him what came first the chicken or the egg in reference to the converter and clutch material. I continued to drive the car home about 10 miles with the converter not locking, trying to keep it below lock up speeds. Thats when he said the clutches went first and the converter was hiding it until it couldn't any longer. He says its common in the 8 & 10 speeds for the converter to hide clutch slipping. It doesn't exactly make sense to me but I don't have anywhere near his experience in one of these transmissions.

The weirdest part to me is how it just gave up randomly. I expected it to start slipping under big power and have trouble grabbing the next gear. It never did that. The converter made it almost a year and the trans a year and a half basically, with being boosted, street driving in the 6-700 range and racing closer to 1000.

I had problems getting my circle d converter to lock originally but I believe that was self induced. I took elite tuned's transmission class and it seems like my factory strategy is different than what they were teaching on. They messed with tables turned off in my stock tune. I tried tuning it the way they showed and the converter would not lock whatsoever. I changed everything back to stock and used the tables that were originally being used to get to the same destination basically and my converter started locking up as commanded. There are quirks to it though. If I softened it to make it not grab as hard at part throttle cruising, it would slip when trying to lock at high load situations. So I basically had to deal with it grabbing pretty hard at times at low speeds to make sure it wasn't slipping up top.

[jlaudio11]

Another update for everyone. I got the converter back from circle d and was able to get everything installed and back running/driving. I did have circle d loosen the converter a little bit hoping it will get up on boost easier on the launch. Verified fluid level and the car is back driving well with the used stock replacement trans. Hopefully sooner or later I'll get back to the track to do some testing.

[Joshinator99]

Originally Posted by jlaudio11

Another update for everyone. I got the converter back from circle d and was able to get everything installed and back running/driving. I did have circle d loosen the converter a little bit hoping it will get up on boost easier on the launch. Verified fluid level and the car is back driving well with the used stock replacement trans. Hopefully sooner or later I'll get back to the track to do some testing.

Good stuff!