[mlee]

Originally Posted by NYTMARE23

Yes, it IS nice to see some actual pics of it for sure. . Just feels like GM did all of us dirty with the Panthers and G56's paint and decal packages... Just imagine if they actually put some EFFORT into a farewell Camaro!?....man, what could have been!!!

Please tell me what decals you're talking about on the Panther that is any different than what's on the regular Camaro. They took the current ZLE X sticker and made it a panther. The sticker term is worn out already and totally not true for the Panther.

Not a single Camaro Special Edition has ever had a performance upgrade and no one is left on the GM Camaro design team since 2018 so can't expect that either. I could name a whole bunch of things like LT5 that I would like to have but reality is, they took the best of Camaro and put together a bad ass ZL1 that is also limited.

[NYTMARE23]

Originally Posted by mlee

Please tell me what decals you're talking about on the Panther that is any different than what's on the regular Camaro. They took the current ZLE X sticker and made it a panther. The sticker term is worn out already and totally not true for the Panther.

Not a single Camaro Special Edition has ever had a performance upgrade and no one is left on the GM Camaro design team since 2018 so can't expect that either. I could name a whole bunch of things like LT5 that I would like to have but reality is, they took the best of Camaro and put together a bad ass ZL1 that is also limited.

That's what I meant....Panther=paint, G56's= decals. I get what you're saying about having no one since 2018, but GM HAS the money, they just chose to put it into the stupid C8 than give us Camaro enthusiasts something GREAT as a farewell. Paint and decals are a joke of a farewell. Great for those that want/got one though, they're cool cars..
The Panthers and G56's are in no way more "badass" than my 2023 ZL1 performance wise though. Rarity, sure..but not performance wise...they are ALL the same car(chassis, engine, transmissions, brakes, etc...) Those that chose to buy either one of those for 85, 95, 100k...good on you. I'll enjoy mine as well that I paid 67k for, even if it's not limited or rare.

[Gunkk]

Originally Posted by mlee

Compliments of the Camaro Cave...

Thanks for sharing, mlee!

[Camfab]

Originally Posted by NYTMARE23

That's what I meant....Panther=paint, G56's= decals. I get what you're saying about having no one since 2018, but GM HAS the money, they just chose to put it into the stupid C8 than give us Camaro enthusiasts something GREAT as a farewell. Paint and decals are a joke of a farewell. Great for those that want/got one though, they're cool cars..
The Panthers and G56's are in no way more "badass" than my 2023 ZL1 performance wise though. Rarity, sure..but not performance wise...they are ALL the same car(chassis, engine, transmissions, brakes, etc...) Those that chose to buy either one of those for 85, 95, 100k...good on you. I'll enjoy mine as well that I paid 67k for, even if it's not limited or rare.

You mean like a real enthusiasts car company, run by engineers and a CEO that is a hard core racer. Hmmm who would that be?
2015 destroys Detroit with the 707hp Hellcat, next comes the 840hp Demon, then the 797hp Red Eye, then the 807 Super Stock. Game over, oh wait, not until we crush everyone again with the 1025hp Demon 170. Lady’s and Gentlemen a car company that actually understands its audience, just saying.
No disrespect to those folks here who bought or are excited about GM’s final Camaro offerings.
There is so much Irony in the Garage 56 car, I just don’t know where to start. First off the Real car is a straight up NASCAR with ZERO and I mean zero connection to a ZL1 production vehicle. Having said this, the car made such an impression with the fans, and isn’t that what racing is, a business venture that excites potential customers.
After Oppenheiser created the greatest Camaro to ever grace the road course ( that’s a fact), GM banished him somewhere to be never heard from again. That’s what you do, when a Camaro ZLE destroys the world with a front engined, no where near 50-50 balanced anchor of a car suddenly takes away from your new mission of changing your Halo car to a euro envisioned mid engined soon to be powered by a 100% admittedly copied outdated Ferrari powerplant. I have to give credit to GM that they admitted that they had to copy Ferrari, apparently even though the old Vette dominated LeMans we can’t design an engine like the Europeans. Ok I got out my anger toward the C8.
Finally, sorry for all that, Hendick enters a good old boy overweight pig of a NASCAR (In the minds of any foreign race fan and many Americans) as an exhibition car. Again this is all about exposure for NASCAR but wouldn’t you know it, that lowly American brute got something going in all those race fans minds. Give me some of that pushrod American V8. Now mind you Chevrolet has, as we know, let the Camaro rot for the last 6 years. Suddenly, and I’ll bet the farm on this one, someone in marketing went, oh shit, people loved this car, ah wait, that right there is a Camaro, Chevrolet’s favorite car. Let’s print those stickers, cause that’s a ZL1 guys who hoo.
So what’s the last great real American Chevrolet, in my mind it’s the front engined supercharged pushrod V8 in the Camaro. Garage 56 or not. Get’m while you can because Chevrolet is now a copier rather than an innovator. No more manuals, supercharged pushrod V-8’s. It makes me want to throw up, but Ford is the last man standing.

[arpad_m]

Originally Posted by Camfab

You mean like a real enthusiasts car company, run by engineers and a CEO that is a hard core racer. Hmmm who would that be?
2015 destroys Detroit with the 707hp Hellcat, next comes the 840hp Demon, then the 797hp Red Eye, then the 807 Super Stock. Game over, oh wait, not until we crush everyone again with the 1025hp Demon 170. Lady’s and Gentlemen a car company that actually understands its audience, just saying.
No disrespect to those folks here who bought or are excited about GM’s final Camaro offerings.
There is so much Irony in the Garage 56 car, I just don’t know where to start. First off the Real car is a straight up NASCAR with ZERO and I mean zero connection to a ZL1 production vehicle. Having said this, the car made such an impression with the fans, and isn’t that what racing is, a business venture that excites potential customers.
After Oppenheiser created the greatest Camaro to ever grace the road course ( that’s a fact), GM banished him somewhere to be never heard from again. That’s what you do, when a Camaro ZLE destroys the world with a front engined, no where near 50-50 balanced anchor of a car suddenly takes away from your new mission of changing your Halo car to a euro envisioned mid engined soon to be powered by a 100% admittedly copied outdated Ferrari powerplant. I have to give credit to GM that they admitted that they had to copy Ferrari, apparently even though the old Vette dominated LeMans we can’t design an engine like the Europeans. Ok I got out my anger toward the C8.
Finally, sorry for all that, Hendick enters a good old boy overweight pig of a NASCAR (In the minds of any foreign race fan and many Americans) as an exhibition car. Again this is all about exposure for NASCAR but wouldn’t you know it, that lowly American brute got something going in all those race fans minds. Give me some of that pushrod American V8. Now mind you Chevrolet has, as we know, let the Camaro rot for the last 6 years. Suddenly, and I’ll bet the farm on this one, someone in marketing went, oh shit, people loved this car, ah wait, that right there is a Camaro, Chevrolet’s favorite car. Let’s print those stickers, cause that’s a ZL1 guys who hoo.
So what’s the last great real American Chevrolet, in my mind it’s the front engined supercharged pushrod V8 in the Camaro. Garage 56 or not. Get’m while you can because Chevrolet is now a copier rather than an innovator. No more manuals, supercharged pushrod V-8’s. It makes me want to throw up, but Ford is the last man standing.

Many great points made here, from Dodge through NASCAR and vinyl packages to the C8 (that I'm not a big fan of either, it's a cheaper Ferrari lookalike that doesn't appeal to me personally).

GM disbanded the Camaro team and dispatched Oppenheiser in late 2018 to lead the Hummer EV project.

The sales of that vehicle five years later, in Q2 2023, was 47 (yes, forty seven) units. And that's somehow okay, but the Camaro selling 20x more during the same period is dismal. I think that says it all, even though Hummer EV sales did pick up a bit in Q3. Yes, I know it's a completely different segment, but can we please focus on the point rather than challenging minutiae.

[ZPirate]

Originally Posted by Camfab

You mean like a real enthusiasts car company, run by engineers and a CEO that is a hard core racer. Hmmm who would that be?
2015 destroys Detroit with the 707hp Hellcat, next comes the 840hp Demon, then the 797hp Red Eye, then the 807 Super Stock. Game over, oh wait, not until we crush everyone again with the 1025hp Demon 170. Lady’s and Gentlemen a car company that actually understands its audience, just saying.
No disrespect to those folks here who bought or are excited about GM’s final Camaro offerings.
There is so much Irony in the Garage 56 car, I just don’t know where to start. First off the Real car is a straight up NASCAR with ZERO and I mean zero connection to a ZL1 production vehicle. Having said this, the car made such an impression with the fans, and isn’t that what racing is, a business venture that excites potential customers.
After Oppenheiser created the greatest Camaro to ever grace the road course ( that’s a fact), GM banished him somewhere to be never heard from again. That’s what you do, when a Camaro ZLE destroys the world with a front engined, no where near 50-50 balanced anchor of a car suddenly takes away from your new mission of changing your Halo car to a euro envisioned mid engined soon to be powered by a 100% admittedly copied outdated Ferrari powerplant. I have to give credit to GM that they admitted that they had to copy Ferrari, apparently even though the old Vette dominated LeMans we can’t design an engine like the Europeans. Ok I got out my anger toward the C8.
Finally, sorry for all that, Hendick enters a good old boy overweight pig of a NASCAR (In the minds of any foreign race fan and many Americans) as an exhibition car. Again this is all about exposure for NASCAR but wouldn’t you know it, that lowly American brute got something going in all those race fans minds. Give me some of that pushrod American V8. Now mind you Chevrolet has, as we know, let the Camaro rot for the last 6 years. Suddenly, and I’ll bet the farm on this one, someone in marketing went, oh shit, people loved this car, ah wait, that right there is a Camaro, Chevrolet’s favorite car. Let’s print those stickers, cause that’s a ZL1 guys who hoo.
So what’s the last great real American Chevrolet, in my mind it’s the front engined supercharged pushrod V8 in the Camaro. Garage 56 or not. Get’m while you can because Chevrolet is now a copier rather than an innovator. No more manuals, supercharged pushrod V-8’s. It makes me want to throw up, but Ford is the last man standing.

Great points Camfab. Obviously, Dodge gets the enthusiast market, having dominated that market in recent years by continuing to upgrade its offerings. As arpad_m stated Chevy disbanded the Camaro team in 2018 and left the Camaro rot on the vine, with very little effort to enhance the car, except mainly with price hikes. In the end all the remaining Camaro team could do is offer cars with special decals, different paint colors and variations of existing oem parts. Instead GM threw all of its performance eggs in the C8 basket. Likely because it's not only the halo car, but also more profitable.

What's a damn shame is that the Camaro platform is still today the best muscle car platform of the three American car companies. Its truly the sports car of the bunch. The Dodge Charger/Challenger platform is ancient and a porker and Ford's S650 platform is basically just a refresh of the S550. Had Chevy taken Dodge's approach it could have continued to improve the car during the remainder of its life cycle and sold a lot more Camaros. The irony is that the popularity of the Garage 56 project proves that.

Unfortunately, it's all water under the bridge at this point. I'm just glad I was able to buy a ZL1 before it all comes to an end.

[Camfab]

Ya sorry guys, I went off on a tangent there.

[ZPirate]

Originally Posted by Camfab

Ya sorry guys, I went off on a tangent there.

No need to be sorry.

[NYTMARE23]

Originally Posted by ZPirate

No need to be sorry.

Absolutely not! You guys BOTH made good and valid points. We Camaro enthusiasts have a right to be mad at GM for giving up on the Camaro...

[mlee]

Originally Posted by NYTMARE23

even if it's not limited or rare.

That's the difference (numbered too) and something that will help these hold value as well. If you're into performance like I am then the ZLE is still the top dog street legal Camaro.

Originally Posted by Gunkk

Thanks for sharing, mlee!

Originally Posted by Camfab

Ya sorry guys, I went off on a tangent there.

All great points and no one would have been more excited than I if GM had done what Dodge did as far as performance. Totally understand the disappointment but I guess I felt it and came to accept it a few years ago. I've also never bought into any of the click bait articles creating hype around performance upgrades.

[jfkheat]

On Chevrolet.com most of these cars show as in transit. There are a couple that don't show that. On the actual dealership sites one shows that it has a deposit but one shows that it is for sale at MSRP. Someone here may want to check it out.

https://www.lesstanfordchevrolet.com...-MI/5742291910

[mlee]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

Many great points made here, from Dodge through NASCAR and vinyl packages to the C8 (that I'm not a big fan of either, it's a cheaper Ferrari lookalike that doesn't appeal to me personally).

GM disbanded the Camaro team and dispatched Oppenheiser in late 2018 to lead the Hummer EV project.

The sales of that vehicle five years later, in Q2 2023, was 47 (yes, forty seven) units. And that's somehow okay, but the Camaro selling 20x more during the same period is dismal. I think that says it all, even though Hummer EV sales did pick up a bit in Q3. Yes, I know it's a completely different segment, but can we please focus on the point rather than challenging minutiae.

Maybe they saved them up for Q3 then...


https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/11...arter-2023-q3/



Hummer EV sales has never been an issue. Meeting the demand is a different story. I had to wait almost 2 years to get one and only had it 2 weeks before flipping it as the demand was crazy. Turned it into a gas guzzling ZR2


sorry to go off topic.

[mlee]

Originally Posted by jfkheat

On Chevrolet.com most of these cars show as in transit. There are a couple that don't show that. On the actual dealership sites one shows that it has a deposit but one shows that it is for sale at MSRP. Someone here may want to check it out.

https://www.lesstanfordchevrolet.com...-MI/5742291910

Wonder what this means?

[LateBrakeU2]

A couple short years ago you could buy new ZL1's for 70k, 24's are 80, panthers and G56's are 90, and that's at MSRP. To each his own,and if you paid 100k + for one you'd better be doing it because you love the car. it will be interesting to see where these are at in five years relative to valuation. They did the same deal in 02 with the Z4C Special Edition,you can find them still in the wrapper for not much more than MSRP twenty years later.