[TP2SS]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

"Flex fuel" means an arbitrary composition of gasoline and ethanol, typically ranging from 15% to 85% ethanol (sometimes simply referred to as "alcohol"). "Flex fuel cars" are those that are equipped to use regular gasoline as well as a gasoline/ethanol mix. Gas stations that sell "E85" provide a mix that is up to 85% ethanol.

Since ethanol has a lower energy density, more volume of it is required to produce the same horsepower, so fuel systems need to be sized to be able to supply the additional fuel volume. Ethanol burns cleaner and cooler, which allows for more aggressive tuning and thus more power in the end, provided the fuel system can cope with the extra volume requirement. (Obviously, fuel economy will take a hit when using ethanol, but ethanol is typically much cheaper than octane 93 gas.)

For this reason, not all modified Camaros (equipped with an aftermarket "flex fuel kit" and the associated tune, which is a prerequisite) are able to use full E85; depending on how capable their fuel system is, they need to use a mixture that is down to E70-60-50 etc.

Fortunately, however, most of the achievable power gains are realized at E60-65, after that, the law of diminishing returns kicks in, so using straight E85 out of a pump is more a matter of convenience than necessity. From what I read here, stock and even FBO SS powertrains can use E85, the fuel system only needs to be upgraded when using forced induction.

I think he meant which BRAND kit to get, not which type of E

[knighti2]

A Rotofab intake was already installed when I baselined my car which was 400rwhp.
I had a Solar 87mm ported TB, Kooks headers / green cats, MSD wires and new plugs, a flex fuel system and the requisite tuning.

This was all on a local shop's mustang dyno:
On 93 Octane the car made 429rwhp.
On E85 the car made 460rhwp.


I kept the stock NPP muffler as well.

[arpad_m]

Originally Posted by TP2SS

I think he meant which BRAND kit to get, not which type of E

Whatever... it's in my signature anyway.

[Need4Camaro]

Originally Posted by carlythecamaro

which flex fuel do you recommend I get?

They just used a regular AC Delco sensor for mine:

ACDelco Part Number: 13507129
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ado-13507129

And this wiring harness:

ACDelco Part Number: 23153101
https://www.gmpartsdirect.com/oem-pa...rness-23153101

[FlukeSS]

Originally Posted by Need4Camaro

I have similar mods and with everything installed (full exhaust and CAI + E85 tune) tuned at one time I picked up between 50 and 70 HP but there is skepticism that the dyno I used wasnt accurate so I would say 50 HP to be safe.

Not necessarily inaccurate.

My tune yielded almost 85hp increase at the crank from stock. Minus 15%+ parasitic loss. 72.25 hp gain at best at the wheels. Which means at worst my car would have baselined for ~387 rwhp without mods or if we factor 50 hp like you stated, then 400-410 hp baseline before mods (making it a unicorn from the factory which is statistically rare)

It is a safer bet to assume you do not own a unicorn, as most of our cars baseline between 390-400 a majority of the time, with a few outliers, highest I know of is 419 rwhp from the factory, which is ultra uber rare as I've never found anyone else making that claim. In which case your gains are closer to 30-40 rwhp gain in retrospect with all of the same mods you and I have.

[Capricio]

I think most stations are selling something close to 50% ethanol now that subsidies are mostly gone? Understand that converting to ethanol means "oversizing" your injector compared to running premium gasoline only. So while you can still run premium gasoline, you will end up "front loading" your injector charge and not atomizing as thoroughly through the entire intake stroke. Not sure how much this decreases performance/efficiency compared to running a regular size non-flexfuel injector on 93 Octane, but something to be aware of. General rule is to run the smallest injector capable of getting the job done. e85 is getting harder to find (for me, anyways), i'd settle for the convenience/efficiency of 93 Octane over compensating for variability/availability of e85. I wish my truck wasn't factory equipped for flex fuel because i think it could get better mpg if it didn't have it. ...but if your intent to run e85 all the time and you have a good local source for it, go for it!

[OB0001]

Michigan station E85 in the summer is close or above the 85% in my neck of the woods (random testing) E85 sensor

[GTO_Gregory]

In the middle of Texas where I'm at it's about 76% ethanol per my measurements.
The E85 costs vary from $3.25 - $3.95 per gallon.

[Equalizer]

Originally Posted by carlythecamaro

I was thinking about buying a flex fuel kit for my '17 SS but I was curious as to how much horse power I would see or if it would even make a difference. Also which brand of flex fuel kit I should purchase.

I know this is old and I'm sure you got this figured out by now but I would like to leave this here for any future readers that may come across this forum.

Q: What horsepower increase will I see?

A: Horsepower difference when using Flex Fuel is around 20+ depending on supporting mods or even if you're bone stock. Those saying it doesnt make a difference are either trolling or they have a bad tune.

Q: Which brand of Flex Fuel kit should I buy?

A: While there are many brands of Flex Fuel kits they all essentially do the same thing. What you're paying for is durability and reliability. Imo DSX has the most well built Flex Fuel kit. It almost looks factory when installed.

Additional info: E85 is generally cheaper than your standard octane gasoline. It runs cooler, cleaner, and smells way better too (big help if you're running catless). E85 does get worse economy than octane but its offset by the cheaper price. My personal experience with I didn't see it draining as fast as I thought it would. It last me maybe 1 day less than standard octane. Lastly some other car brands have to have a specific tune for a specific content of E in there tank (E50 or E30 are examples), the nice thing about Flex Fuel kits for Camaros is that it does not matter what content of E is in your tank. It can run on E85 - 91 octane or any level of E in between. For reference standard gas cars can run on E15 MAX, but most gas stations add ~10% E to their mix.

The key to anything when modifying cars is the tune you get. The tune is the glue that holds everything together. If you have a bad tune, your car will run the same if not worse than it did before. My tuner got me the most gains and you can't even tell I'm running E (aside the smell). So make sure you do your research and go to a reputable tuner in your area. Don't trust any Joe Shmo with it.

[Dabjbr]

Just ran the numbers (using AI) for my city in California... Since both gas stations are within reasonable range, e85 makes sense for power and cost:

Since fuel economy varies a bit, I will use realistic averages for an LT1 SS:

• 91 octane average: 20 mpg
• E85 average: 15 mpg
(These numbers sit right in the middle of what most owners actually see.)

Cost per mile calculation
91 octane at 4.69 per gallon
Cost per mile = price per gallon divided by mpg
4.69 ÷ 20 = 0.2345 dollars per mile
That is 23.45 cents per mile

E85 at 2.94 per gallon
2.94 ÷ 15 = 0.196 dollars per mile
That is 19.6 cents per mile

Final comparison
• 91 octane costs about 23.5 cents per mile
• E85 costs about 19.6 cents per mile
Even with the lower mpg, the cheaper fuel price means E85 still comes out ahead. You save about 3.9 cents per mile running E85.

On 91 octane at 4.69 per gallon
Sixteen gallons times 4.69
Total is 75.04 dollars per tank

On E85 at 2.94 per gallon
Sixteen gallons times 2.94
Total is 47.04 dollars per tank

[2023-SS]

dumb Q....

so E85 requires a larger diameter fuel hose & a larger injector, and therefore a tune.

however, the linked ACDelco parts (wires & sensor) and DSX flex fuel kit show a sensor & some wires.

can we put that sensor & wire on & just run E85? it seems more complication would be ensuing......

it does STINK when I remote start my car in my garage. E85 might help that.

[m6-lt1]

Originally Posted by 2023-SS

dumb Q....

so E85 requires a larger diameter fuel hose & a larger injector, and therefore a tune.

however, the linked ACDelco parts (wires & sensor) and DSX flex fuel kit show a sensor & some wires.

can we put that sensor & wire on & just run E85? it seems more complication would be ensuing......

it does STINK when I remote start my car in my garage. E85 might help that.

It only requires the sensor and a tune.

[Lethal6SS]

Is there a right or wrong way to run ethanol? Meaning once I get a tune should I just strictly run ethanol? Can I use a mixture of ethanol and 91 octane to get an octane boost yet still get better gas milage? Going back to 91 octane after summer months into the winter OK? Any benefit or harm to using a mix of both? Thanks!

[bishopts]

Originally Posted by Lethal6SS

Is there a right or wrong way to run ethanol? Meaning once I get a tune should I just strictly run ethanol? Can I use a mixture of ethanol and 91 octane to get an octane boost yet still get better gas milage? Going back to 91 octane after summer months into the winter OK? Any benefit or harm to using a mix of both? Thanks!

Calculating miles per gallon on e85 will make you think it's crap.
Drivable distance on e85 is much lower than 93.
Money removed from your bank account on a tank of e85 if lower than 93.
So to truly compare apples to apples, calculate miles per dollar between the 2.

I run 93 pretty much all the time. If i have a plan to go to the track i will run my tank out and fill it with e85. But for me, my car is mostly a daily driver. So trying to get the extra power from e85 just incase i need to win a street race would be me trying to hard. And I'm not going to try hard for a street race.

E85 doesn't lube the injectors like gas does. That's probably the worst downside to it. It's not something that is a guaranteed failure, just something to be aware of. People run strictly e85 for years with no problems.