[adamjwilson]

Thanks everyone for the education on E! So where can someone get test kits to test the E at the pump?

[KingLT1]

You don't need a test kit. Just get a gauge or app on your phone that reads ethanol content.

Go to the pump mix it 50/50, drive around for 10 minutes and see what the ethanol gauge says. If it's off one way or another, go back to the pump and pump anither gallon of 93 or e depending which way you need to go. It won't take long to figure out once your have done it a few times. Either way a 50/50 mix will get you close. You don't need to be exactly on. The ECU will adjust the tune automatically for anything from E0 to 85.

[JimGnitecki]

Originally Posted by KingLT1

You don't need a test kit. Just get a gauge or app on your phone that reads ethanol content.
. . .

You said "get a gauge or app on your phone". How can a phone app read your ethanol content without there being some sort of gauge physically present?

Jim G

[LT1ornothing]

Originally Posted by JimGnitecki

You said "get a gauge or app on your phone". How can a phone app read your ethanol content without there being some sort of gauge physically present?

Jim G

Using an App like the torque app in combination with a Bluetooth obd2 dongle, you can see the ethanol content the car is detecting in real time. There are several other values you can also monitor.

[SATINSTEEL1LE]

Originally Posted by LT1ornothing

Using an App like the torque app in combination with a Bluetooth obd2 dongle, you can see the ethanol content the car is detecting in real time. There are several other values you can also monitor.

ONLY if he has the flex fuel sensor installed. Otherwise the car cannot see the E content whatsoever.

[LT1ornothing]

Originally Posted by SATINSTEEL1LE

ONLY if he has the flex fuel sensor installed. Otherwise the car cannot see the E content whatsoever.

Correct, I was assuming the OP was already aware as that response was already given to him earlier on this thread.

[JimGnitecki]

Originally Posted by SATINSTEEL1LE

ONLY if he has the flex fuel sensor installed. Otherwise the car cannot see the E content whatsoever.

Ok. On my LT1 2022 Camaro with Magnuson 2650 kit, I have a Banks DataMonster conencted fulltime to the OBD2 port in order to have realtime display of Boost, IAT, and other readings. One of the fields that the DataMonster can display is "ETHANO" which Banks says is the "Fuel Ethanol Percentage".

So, if I got a flexfuel sensor installed, I could see this ETHANO field presumably.

I don't currently plan to modify my tune beyond the Magnuson-provided tune. I enjoy the car immensely as is, and I could not use any additional power anyway without changing the rear wheels from the OEM LT1 8.5 inch width, and in Canada a new pair of wider (still only 9.5") rear wheels that match my current wheels would cost $1800 Canadian plus sales tax, which is ridiculous. I just want to be able to see what the local ethanol content is in the 91 octane fuel we have available here (no 93 octane and no e-50 or e-85), and how much that ethanol percentage VARIES, since that will cause variation in performance.

However, 3 questions arise:

1. What is the parts and labour cost, plus tuning change cost (if required) for a flexfuel sensor?

2. What ECU software tune change(s), if any, are required to merely ensure that this ethanol percentage field in the OBD2 output is populated? (I already know that Banks requires the addition of their physical "data bus" add-on to see outputs from any sensors added beyond OEM sensors)

3. Davenport Motorsports told me that Magnuson's warranty is valid only if the Magnuson-provided tune is unaltered. Would the software changes to the ECU be potentially viewed as an alteration that therefor voids the warranty? (I suspect it would be viewed as an alteration)

I am beginning to see the potentially bottomless cost pit encountered if I mod the car beyond its current just-fine state . . .

Jim G

[LT1ornothing]

Originally Posted by JimGnitecki

Ok. On my LT1 2022 Camaro with Magnuson 2650 kit, I have a Banks DataMonster conencted fulltime to the OBD2 port in order to have realtime display of Boost, IAT, and other readings. One of the fields that the DataMonster can display is "ETHANO" which Banks says is the "Fuel Ethanol Percentage".

So, if I got a flexfuel sensor installed, I could see this ETHANO field presumably.

I don't currently plan to modify my tune beyond the Magnuson-provided tune. I enjoy the car immensely as is, and I could not use any additional power anyway without changing the rear wheels from the OEM LT1 8.5 inch width, and in Canada a new pair of wider (still only 9.5") rear wheels that match my current wheels would cost $1800 Canadian plus sales tax, which is ridiculous. I just want to be able to see what the local ethanol content is in the 91 octane fuel we have available here (no 93 octane and no e-50 or e-85), and how much that ethanol percentage VARIES, since that will cause variation in performance.

However, 3 questions arise:

1. What is the parts and labour cost, plus tuning change cost (if required) for a flexfuel sensor?

2. What ECU software tune change(s), if any, are required to merely ensure that this ethanol percentage field in the OBD2 output is populated? (I already know that Banks requires the addition of their physical "data bus" add-on to see outputs from any sensors added beyond OEM sensors)

3. Davenport Motorsports told me that Magnuson's warranty is valid only if the Magnuson-provided tune is unaltered. Would the software changes to the ECU be potentially viewed as an alteration that therefor voids the warranty? (I suspect it would be viewed as an alteration)

I am beginning to see the potentially bottomless cost pit encountered if I mod the car beyond its current just-fine state . . .

Jim G

1. You would need a flex fuel kit installed, whichever your tuner prefers. Should be 1 or 2 hours for labor.

2. Someone else can answer, I do not know.

3. Your blower warranty will be voided if you use another tune. I wouldn't worry about blower warranty, you won't hurt the blower with how slow it is spinning, and from what I understand, the warranty on the blower is BS.

Yes, this is why people either just do bolt ons, or just bolt on a blower and let it be. It gets really expensive really quickly to go further.

[RobZL1]

#2- yes, you can set it up to basically just report the ethanol content in pump gas. Kind of a lot of effort to do that without planning to run Ethanol content, though.

Once you turn it on in the tune, there are a ton of tables that will now get referenced. You could just populate them with zeros and ones as needed to make them essentially inactive when they are referenced, as well as maintaining the AFR for pump gas across the board in the tune.

Doing those things would basically allow you to read the ethanol content in pump gas and not affect the way the car runs. Seems like a lot of effort unless you're doing it yourself to learn and play within HPTuners. If you're paying someone, just wait until you get the full ethanol setup (fueling system to support it) before you bother, in my opinion.

[SATINSTEEL1LE]

FYI I started with the maggie tune and it was COMPLETE TRASH. The car was running horribly and it was running out of lowside fuel pressure. I'd be VERY careful with that stock tune. When I had Ted do a real tune for me, my car picked up almost 100hp over the maggie tune.

No way after seeing the logs for that tune, would I ever run that tune.

[JimGnitecki]

Originally Posted by SATINSTEEL1LE

FYI I started with the maggie tune and it was COMPLETE TRASH. The car was running horribly and it was running out of lowside fuel pressure. I'd be VERY careful with that stock tune. When I had Ted do a real tune for me, my car picked up almost 100hp over the maggie tune.

No way after seeing the logs for that tune, would I ever run that tune.

I have heard that from others on htis forum as well, BUT my Magnuson tune, which is very recent (end of September), produced the following (below) dyno chart and the below on-road log, all done at 3000 foot elevation and with traction control active during the entire on-road log (still on at over 80 mph) because of my narrow LT1 wheels and OEM run flat tires.

The dyno chart basically shows OEM ZL1 level power at mid and peak rpms, and more than OEM ZL1 power at low rpm. It also shows a reasonable AFR curve.

In the log chart (from the Banks DataMonster), the traction control is obviously retardingg the timing, but that's not the tune's fault. It's the narrow wheels and the OEM run flat tires. I have recently replaced the OEM 245 width rear tires with 275 Nitto 555R2 drag radials, but cannot do another log run now with the cold temperatures and ice & snow we are getting. :(

Since the engine power with the Magnuson tune exceeds what my rear tires can handle already, I have no reason to complain about the tune.

Jim G

[GAOLDGUY]

Originally Posted by laynlo15

I agree, my stations never have over E70 and most of the time it's about 65 which is good for me, no mixing required. If you were to have stations like ours you'd be way below E50 with the equal amount of 93. So for sure you should be a tester. .

Hey laynlo15,

If you had access to E85 you could use it because of the "toohipsi" plate system you are running, correct? I've watched your build closely because it seems to me a good build with good reliability should be a Maggy 2650, toohipsi system, with straight E85.

[SATINSTEEL1LE]

Originally Posted by JimGnitecki

I have heard that from others on htis forum as well, BUT my Magnuson tune, which is very recent (end of September), produced the following (below) dyno chart and the below on-road log, all done at 3000 foot elevation and with traction control active during the entire on-road log (still on at over 80 mph) because of my narrow LT1 wheels and OEM run flat tires.

The dyno chart basically shows OEM ZL1 level power at mid and peak rpms, and more than OEM ZL1 power at low rpm. It also shows a reasonable AFR curve.

In the log chart (from the Banks DataMonster), the traction control is obviously retardingg the timing, but that's not the tune's fault. It's the narrow wheels and the OEM run flat tires. I have recently replaced the OEM 245 width rear tires with 275 Nitto 555R2 drag radials, but cannot do another log run now with the cold temperatures and ice & snow we are getting. :(

Since the engine power with the Magnuson tune exceeds what my rear tires can handle already, I have no reason to complain about the tune.

Jim G

Yeah you're making about 8psi. Should be ok with that LT1 fuel system. Im seeing 14.5-15psi of boost at WOT. And their tune was total trash. I was getting just shy of 600rwhp on stock ZL1 with maggie 2650. Total let down. Once Ted tuned it, nothing else changed, it picked up and made 695rwhp and 630rwtq. Like I said almost 100 more than the maggie tune. It was all over the board bad from the logs we were seeing.

[JimGnitecki]

Originally Posted by SATINSTEEL1LE

Yeah you're making about 8psi. Should be ok with that LT1 fuel system. Im seeing 14.5-15psi of boost at WOT. And their tune was total trash. I was getting just shy of 600rwhp on stock ZL1 with maggie 2650. Total let down. Once Ted tuned it, nothing else changed, it picked up and made 695rwhp and 630rwtq. Like I said almost 100 more than the maggie tune. It was all over the board bad from the logs we were seeing.

I'd say my psi is more like only 7.5. Higher than that only occurs as a "flash" during the shifts.

Your car is evidently a ZL1, so yes, it can be tuned notably higher due to the stronger pistons, etc.

I realize that you want a much more aggressive tune than the conservative one that Magnuson gave you. But how, specifically, was that tune "total trash"? Was there anything else "wrong" with it other than being conservative? You said "It was all over the board bad from the logs we were seeing." What specifically does that mean?

Jim G