[LeonardS]

Originally Posted by Xelor

Most everyone wants to say they didn’t paid ADM.
But most do it’s normal.
The lack of necessary supplies needed to fulfill orders and inferior parts being used to build the 2023 models. I now understand why the GM race director of North America said the 2022 model ZL1 was the best of the best.

The same parts that were going in the 22’s are going in the 23’s. There were not a bunch of bins labeled “22’s only” and “23’s only”, so believe what you want. I was at the factory and saw just how it was happening.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by Xelor

Most everyone wants to say they didn’t paid ADM.
But most do it’s normal.
The lack of necessary supplies needed to fulfill orders and inferior parts being used to build the 2023 models. I now understand why the GM race director of North America said the 2022 model ZL1 was the best of the best.

I see ADM mostly for cars on sitting on the lots for folks that willing to pay not to wait. Many dealers are at MSRP for ordered Camaros. I got lucky last Sept and was able to buy a new 2021 that was on the lot for MSRP minus the $500 Educator rebate. This was still hard to swallow since I usually buy GM products at supplier discount or higher. I am usually the guy waiting for those 20% off deals but with supply so low and the uncertain future of the Camaro program I just paid it. They gave top dollar for my trade and the associated tax savings so it wasn't that bad.

As for build quality, I don't know. The parts for our cars come from thousands of suppliers. I am sure there may be some quality control issues if there are poorly trained personnel or a lack of personnel but a lot of these parts either work or they don't.

As for a 2022 being better, I would think in general you get better built vehicles the later in the run as the teams improve build quality, processes and address issues. For example, I owned a 2016 2SS and it was riddled with issues. It had Mosaic Black paint issues, the trunk lid would chip its corner when opening and closing due to poor alignment, interior rattles from the 8" display and headliner, the hot start issue where it wouldn't crank or slowly crank when hot and let's not forget the dreaded A8 torque converter shudder. So, far the build quality of my 2021 ZL1 has been much better. The panel gaps are better, A10 transmission is fantastic, no rattles, etc.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by LeonardS

The same parts that were going in the 22’s are going in the 23’s. There were not a bunch of bins labeled “22’s only” and “23’s only”, so believe what you want. I was at the factory and saw just how it was happening.

Agreed, the difference between a 2021, 2022 and 2023 is the VIN number that designates the model year of the vehicle. So a 2022 is built in April with the same parts as a 2023 built in May.

As long as they had properly trained folks bolting them together there is no difference. If this were the case then all the TVs, computers, cell phones , air conditioners, garage door openers, dishwashers and pool pumps you purchased are doomed as well.

[mliebs]

Originally Posted by mliebs

There's one at Knapp Chevrolet here in Houston and they're asking 10k over sticker.

I've been watching the ad and it looks like the car is no longer available. I'm wondering if someone paid the 10k.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by mliebs

I've been watching the ad and it looks like the car is no longer available. I'm wondering if someone paid the 10k.

I wouldn't be surprised. If they ask for $10k they may take $5k. The only thing that justifies paying $5k over on a 2022 is that the price increase on the 2023s ZL1s is about $3,700 and you get one now. I doubt we will see supply for the Camaros improve much since GM is allocating most of their supply to their more profitable higher volume vehicles.

[LeonardS]

Just to clarify, the Rapid Blue ZL1 I originally posted about is still available. I have no idea about these other Camaros being talked about in this thread.

[KSZLE]

I paid $4k over on what was, at the time, one of the last two Camaros showing on Chevrolet.com as built, in transit but not spoken for because I called almost every dealer within 500 miles. Dealer ended up throwing in a 4 year free maintenance contract from Chevy since the car was not ready when we flew in.

[JBones81]

I ordered a 22 at msrp...didn't get built. I ordered a 23 at msrp...no movement there either. A different local dealer got one in that was 10k over, and I went in and negotiated it down and bought one. Now I actually have one. For anyone willing to wait at msrp and take the chance, I truly hope your dealer comes through and you save the $3000-5000, but know that you're low priority compared to the guy on the street who is willing to play their game.

[Xelor]

Talking with a dealer on Saturday in Florida. He said the market for a ZL1 is not at MSRP pricing. They are not readily available and ADM is the only way to get one.
The 2022 models are over. Due to getting parts and limited availability the 2023 will be hard to get

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by Xelor

Talking with a dealer on Saturday in Florida. He said the market for a ZL1 is not at MSRP pricing. They are not readily available and ADM is the only way to get one.
The 2022 models are over. Due to getting parts and limited availability the 2023 will be hard to get

I think this is true for most cars on the ground but some dealers in Florida will sell ordered cars at MSRP, but as you mentioned allocations are slim.

I just saw a used 2022 Wild Cherry ZL1 show up at a local dealer. It had 3000 miles with an M6 transmission. It was listed for $76k and it was sold in 24 hours. So, yeah, folks are willing to pay about $10k over for used ones as well. It wasn’t that long ago when I used to watch these cars sit on the lots at 15-20% off when gas was $3.00 a gallon and interest rates were 0%. Crazy.

Also keep in mind that the 2023 ZL1 has a hefty $3,700 price increase as well, which will drive up prices on any 2022s.

[zig_zag]

I have a 2022 no options 6 speed, black, bought from a Mom and Pop Chevrolet Dealer in Bum **** No Where, NC. Paid MSRP $64K ... Sales Manger said GM Corp called them and asked them if they wanted it as it was a sold order / walk away the the ordering dealer didn't want. They said they never had one before and the owner wanted to see it. (That's what he said anyway) by the looks of the place when I showed up to buy the car I have no reason to disbelieve the story. I found it by accident calling around on a build out that showed inventory. It happened to be by chance. I called and gave a deposit after they emailed me a signed bill of sale. Sitting in my garage as I write.

Interesting enough: I just did the same thing on a 2022 2SS 1LE A10, same exact story different dealer only difference was this was a dealer spec car. Also, bought it at MSRP won't be in for another 25 days or so.

[activeSS]

Originally Posted by Xelor

Most everyone wants to say they didn’t paid ADM.
But most do it’s normal.
The lack of necessary supplies needed to fulfill orders and inferior parts being used to build the 2023 models. I now understand why the GM race director of North America said the 2022 model ZL1 was the best of the best.

Curious where you say "inferior parts". What inferior parts is Chevy using?