Katech Stage 2 engine : 552WHP 488 FTLbs - Page 2

kropscamaro16 · 08-27-2020, 11:51 AM

oh yea im only full bolt ons and tuned just sucks living in cali and driving on the streets and having to worry about the cops

*Joshinator99* · 08-27-2020, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nabush

I think the 118 LSA of the Katech cam helps the idle...
The GPI had 112 LSA and idle was crappy as hell

Exactly. I had my cam ground on a 120 so that I’d have some semblance of a decent idle with an otherwise good size cam (229/245).

s346k · 08-27-2020, 12:38 PM

those look like stock cam tq numbers. also, why did you end the pull so soon? big duration and 118 lsa should pull forever.

6spdhyperblue · 08-27-2020, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by s346k

those look like stock cam tq numbers. also, why did you end the pull so soon? big duration and 118 lsa should pull forever.

Exactly my thought as well. This cam really looks like like a stg3 in terms of power band but delivers stock like drivability...which is nice. Yes this cam can keep going. It didn’t even fall off at all, I’d want to go to the point of intersection with the next gear.

For my goals, looking for torque focused on the cammotion titan 1 as more street. Unless Katech cuts this on a 114 or less. For road course, that cam looks great

Nabush · 08-27-2020, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by s346k

those look like stock cam tq numbers. also, why did you end the pull so soon? big duration and 118 lsa should pull forever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6spdhyperblue

Exactly my thought as well. This cam really looks like like a stg3 in terms of power band but delivers stock like drivability...which is nice. Yes this cam can keep going. It didn’t even fall off at all, I’d want to go to the point of intersection with the next gear.

For my goals, looking for torque focused on the cammotion titan 1 as more street. Unless Katech cuts this on a 114 or less. For road course, that cam looks great

Yes, stock cam torque but higher in the rpm and way longer.
Katech recommends 6800 rpm with those springs and lifters. It can pull to 7000 rpm without dropping power, but not recommended for extended use.

RideZX6R · 08-29-2020, 09:33 PM

Weird. I did 575/485ish over a year ago with a slightly lope-y cam (from Pray) and had no issues once I had a proper tuner get their hands on it (for the record it wasn't PRAY - he's a great tuner but he wasn't local at the time - Kaizenspeed in WA tuned it)...

Surprised you had to go thru 3 cam setups to get similar numbers. Who tuned the other two setups? Tuning an NA setup with an aftermarket cam in the LT1 is an art

Motor Fast · 06-26-2021, 11:37 PM

Nabush, are your headers 1 7/8" or 2"?

cmitchell17 · 06-30-2021, 02:50 PM

I feel like all these shops with the usual 22X/23X 114 cams leave a lot to be desired. I think we need more custom intake manifolds where we can choose better area cross sections, port tapers, and runner lengths to make a proper optimized NA setup. I think the intake specs matter. I think the only thing the shops care about is making a cam that lopes at idle but doesn't surge and I think they've found the formula with the 22X/23X 114 cams. They know most people only care about the lope and the actual power it makes is so subjective anyway and there is so much error in quantifying it and comparing it to the competition it doesn't matter to them.

I made a sim of a custom setup with slightly less intake manifold runner area with about an inch or so added to the runners with a 218/238 .630/.620 120-LSA cam like Nabush with 12.95:1 compression (from .015 milled heads and .028 head gasket). Yes it looses torque below about 4500 to the usual cam setup but it makes 40 more hp and it makes it where it matters in the 4500-7000 rpm range where the engine actually operates in at WOT. I bet it also would have a lot more smoother idle, but then again it wouldn't be "cool" with a smoother idle. Yellow line is stock, light red is the 218/238 cam and dark red is the usual 226/238 114 LSA:

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I am putting my motor back together with a new cam motion cam but it has the usual 226/238 114 cam and I think I am really going to regret it that I didn't go with a cam like Nabush while I had the chance. We need better intake manifold options.

Puddin · 06-30-2021, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmitchell17

I feel like all these shops with the usual 22X/23X 114 cams leave a lot to be desired. I think we need more custom intake manifolds where we can choose better area cross sections, port tapers, and runner lengths to make a proper optimized NA setup. I think the intake specs matter. I think the only thing the shops care about is making a cam that lopes at idle but doesn't surge and I think they've found the formula with the 22X/23X 114 cams. They know most people only care about the lope and the actual power it makes is so subjective anyway and there is so much error in quantifying it and comparing it to the competition it doesn't matter to them.

I made a sim of a custom setup with slightly less intake manifold runner area with about an inch or so added to the runners with a 218/238 .630/.620 120-LSA cam like Nabush with 12.95:1 compression (from .015 milled heads and .028 head gasket). Yes it looses torque below about 4500 to the usual cam setup but it makes 40 more hp and it makes it where it matters in the 4500-7000 rpm range where the engine actually operates in at WOT. I bet it also would have a lot more smoother idle, but then again it wouldn't be "cool" with a smoother idle. Yellow line is stock, light red is the 218/238 cam and dark red is the usual 226/238 114 LSA:

Attachment 1072651

I am putting my motor back together with a new cam motion cam but it has the usual 226/238 114 cam and I think I am really going to regret it that I didn't go with a cam like Nabush while I had the chance. We need better intake manifold options.

Sadly I don't think we're going to get many more manifold options especially every time you turn around the Camaro is dead/alive just about every month. I haven't heard anything new on the TSP manifold and the Btr Trinity doesn't have any real world data on it that I know of.

s346k · 06-30-2021, 03:44 PM

i think the biggest problem you run into with big duration and wide lsa is piston to valve clearance. also, not very many people are willing to spin the engine the rpm it needs to be productive. i've been trying to come up with a smooth idle camshaft that will be decent everywhere else. something like 217/234 115+0 unsure of lift, but it wouldnt be a lot, i want mild lobes. use with a hi ram and i'd expect it to make power well into the 7k range. i think a set of cid heads or something of the like would compliment the hi ram and camshaft both. we shall see. i'm about ready to pull the trigger on some real parts. waiting to see if btr releases the shaft mount stock rocker setups for our cars this year.

edit: the btr trinity isn't going to do anything na with the intake runners it comes with. they are literally about half as long as the msd runners. btr claims several runner options, but i've yet to see any others. i have one of those manifolds sitting on my kitchen table, but chose not to test it bc i think it's 100% wasted effort with those short ass runners on a stock long block, bolt on car.

cmitchell17 · 06-30-2021, 04:38 PM

Yeah I know what you are saying for PTV, I even bought tools to cut my piston relief on the intake side. I am not even sure I am going to cut it anymore because I don't think I even need too after checking clearance.

I wanted to get a better cam but I knew if I let my car sit any longer it might not even ever go back together.

08-27-2020, 11:51 AM	#15
kropscamaro16 Drives: 2016 1ss camaro Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: 909 Posts: 10,136	oh yea im only full bolt ons and tuned just sucks living in cali and driving on the streets and having to worry about the cops __________________ 16 1SS NIGHTFALL GRAY METALLIC WITH NPP #BECAUSERACECAR #SAVETHEMANUALS

08-27-2020, 12:38 PM	#17
s346k Drives: like an old lady Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: indiana Posts: 2,485	those look like stock cam tq numbers. also, why did you end the pull so soon? big duration and 118 lsa should pull forever. __________________ 2016+ camaro: everyone’s first car

08-29-2020, 09:33 PM	#20
RideZX6R Probably tired right now Drives: 1Lap1LE \| EV6 FE \| DenaliHD \| E92M3 Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: At the office (CLT, NC) Posts: 1,144	Weird. I did 575/485ish over a year ago with a slightly lope-y cam (from Pray) and had no issues once I had a proper tuner get their hands on it (for the record it wasn't PRAY - he's a great tuner but he wasn't local at the time - Kaizenspeed in WA tuned it)... Surprised you had to go thru 3 cam setups to get similar numbers. Who tuned the other two setups? Tuning an NA setup with an aftermarket cam in the LT1 is an art __________________ '17 SS 1LE - 1LAP 1LE (Now with more 447!) '24 Denali Ultimate 3500 DRW '22 Kia EV6 First Edition '12 E93 M3 '25 911 (ordered) Formers... '18 RS3 (1 of 2) Cumulus Blue \| '19 RS5 Sportback Sonoma Green \| '07 Cayman S 6MT \| '16 Audi S3 Prestige Viper Green (APR Stage 3+) \| '19 Mustang Shelby GT350R \| '17 SS 1LE MBM 575whp all-motor Last edited by RideZX6R; 09-14-2020 at 11:40 AM.

06-26-2021, 11:37 PM	#21
Motor Fast Drives: 2018 Camaro SS 1LE Join Date: Jun 2020 Location: Florida Posts: 226	Nabush, are your headers 1 7/8" or 2"? __________________ 2002 Camaro SS \| 2003 Corvette Z06 \| 2008 Corvette \| 2012 Corvette ZR1 Inferno Orange with PDE \| 2016 Corvette Z06 C7.R \| 2018 Yenko Camaro

06-30-2021, 02:50 PM	#22
cmitchell17 Drives: 17 2SS, 8L90, Cam, Heads, E85 Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: US Posts: 1,213	I feel like all these shops with the usual 22X/23X 114 cams leave a lot to be desired. I think we need more custom intake manifolds where we can choose better area cross sections, port tapers, and runner lengths to make a proper optimized NA setup. I think the intake specs matter. I think the only thing the shops care about is making a cam that lopes at idle but doesn't surge and I think they've found the formula with the 22X/23X 114 cams. They know most people only care about the lope and the actual power it makes is so subjective anyway and there is so much error in quantifying it and comparing it to the competition it doesn't matter to them. I made a sim of a custom setup with slightly less intake manifold runner area with about an inch or so added to the runners with a 218/238 .630/.620 120-LSA cam like Nabush with 12.95:1 compression (from .015 milled heads and .028 head gasket). Yes it looses torque below about 4500 to the usual cam setup but it makes 40 more hp and it makes it where it matters in the 4500-7000 rpm range where the engine actually operates in at WOT. I bet it also would have a lot more smoother idle, but then again it wouldn't be "cool" with a smoother idle. Yellow line is stock, light red is the 218/238 cam and dark red is the usual 226/238 114 LSA: I am putting my motor back together with a new cam motion cam but it has the usual 226/238 114 cam and I think I am really going to regret it that I didn't go with a cam like Nabush while I had the chance. We need better intake manifold options.

06-30-2021, 03:44 PM	#24
s346k Drives: like an old lady Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: indiana Posts: 2,485	i think the biggest problem you run into with big duration and wide lsa is piston to valve clearance. also, not very many people are willing to spin the engine the rpm it needs to be productive. i've been trying to come up with a smooth idle camshaft that will be decent everywhere else. something like 217/234 115+0 unsure of lift, but it wouldnt be a lot, i want mild lobes. use with a hi ram and i'd expect it to make power well into the 7k range. i think a set of cid heads or something of the like would compliment the hi ram and camshaft both. we shall see. i'm about ready to pull the trigger on some real parts. waiting to see if btr releases the shaft mount stock rocker setups for our cars this year. edit: the btr trinity isn't going to do anything na with the intake runners it comes with. they are literally about half as long as the msd runners. btr claims several runner options, but i've yet to see any others. i have one of those manifolds sitting on my kitchen table, but chose not to test it bc i think it's 100% wasted effort with those short ass runners on a stock long block, bolt on car. __________________ 2016+ camaro: everyone’s first car

06-30-2021, 04:38 PM	#25
cmitchell17 Drives: 17 2SS, 8L90, Cam, Heads, E85 Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: US Posts: 1,213	Yeah I know what you are saying for PTV, I even bought tools to cut my piston relief on the intake side. I am not even sure I am going to cut it anymore because I don't think I even need too after checking clearance. I wanted to get a better cam but I knew if I let my car sit any longer it might not even ever go back together.

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