[shaffe]

Originally Posted by hotlap

The Mach 1 is “the most track-capable 5.0-liter Mustang ever”. “The modern pinnacle of style, handling and 5.0-liter V-8 pony car performance.“

Does that mean the Mach 1 model is the “handling package”?

If not, what is the Mach 1 without the handling package? The freaking Tremec is tied to it.

Is there a Getrag version of the Mach 1? Is the A10 not the most track-capable 5.0?

I get what you are saying I really do because they say most track capable and then have an option to make it better, but why do you act like its a bad thing to have options?

The handling package gives different aero bits and wheels and cup 2s.

If the 1LE was it's own model and not a package, would you be mad if it had an option for even more aggressive tires?

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by shaffe

I get what you are saying I really do because they say most track capable and then have an option to make it better, but why do you act like its a bad thing to have options?

The handling package gives different aero bits and wheels and cup 2s.

If the 1LE was it's own model and not a package, would you be mad if it had an option for even more aggressive tires?

My estimate is that the non-track package Mach 1's are not the most track capable 5.0 Mustang's every. They should have pink ribbons on the back to distinguish them from the ones that actually are.

This is typical Ford. Imagine Chevy releasing the SS 1LE and having an option to add the eLSD and 285/305 F1 SC3 tires. It wouldn't be a SS 1LE. It would be a poser level trim with a black hood wrap.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by hotlap

My estimate is that the non-track package Mach 1's are not the most track capable 5.0 Mustang's every. They should have pink ribbons on the back to distinguish them from the ones that actually are.

This is typical Ford. Imagine Chevy releasing the SS 1LE and having an option to add the eLSD and 285/305 F1 SC3 tires. It wouldn't be a SS 1LE. It would be a poser level trim with a black hood wrap.

Just playing devils advocate. Because all Mach-1s will have all the cooling needed, they are the most powerful 5.0s that by default makes them most track capable 5.0s. The pp1 and pp2 are not track capable, the Mach 1 is so by default the statement is correct.

If your scenario was the same as what Ford is doing I would agree but it is different. All the handling pack adds is different wheels, super aggressive tires and some different aero bits. If the handling pack also added the coolers and all that other stuff I would 100% agree with you.

If you just wanted the car ( lets be honest a good amount of people buy those trims because it looks great/is the best of what fits their budget with no track intent ever people do it with 1LE, PP GT350, hellcat whatever) why shoe horn every buyer into aggressive tires that aren't great on the street? I think offering that in a package is a smart move.

Answer my question I asked you, would you be mad if they offered a aggressive tire/aero option for the 1LE? That would not take away from the 1LE's trackability it would only enhance it to those that actually track it

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by shaffe

Just playing devils advocate. Because all Mach-1s will have all the cooling needed, they are the most powerful 5.0s that by default makes them most track capable 5.0s. The pp1 and pp2 are not track capable, the Mach 1 is so by default the statement is correct.

If your scenario was the same as what Ford is doing I would agree but it is different. All the handling pack adds is different wheels, super aggressive tires and some different aero bits. If the handling pack also added the coolers and all that other stuff I would 100% agree with you.

If you just wanted the car ( lets be honest a good amount of people buy those trims because it looks great/is the best of what fits their budget with no track intent ever people do it with 1LE, PP GT350, hellcat whatever) why shoe horn every buyer into aggressive tires that aren't great on the street? I think offering that in a package is a smart move.

Answer my question I asked you, would you be mad if they offered a aggressive tire/aero option for the 1LE? That would not take away from the 1LE's trackability it would only enhance it to those that actually track it

You know what you call an SS 1LE without the items I mentioned? The SS.

SS 1LE means something and each one is equally capable. The Mach 1s that are tested will - of course - have the track package, and the guys without it will quote its performance when discussing their car. I'm sure the non-track package cars will be fine automobiles. They just won't live up to the hype.

Its Ford's way. I get that. I just think its cheesy.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by hotlap

You know what you call an SS 1LE without the items I mentioned? The SS.

SS 1LE means something and each one is equally capable. The Mach 1s that are tested will - of course - have the track package, and the guys without it will quote its performance when discussing their car.

Its Ford's way. I get that. I just think its cheesy.

And the Mach 1 without the handling package will still be the Mach 1 - it will still have the 480HP engine, the magenride, all the cooling. It just won't have cup 2 tires and different aero. You are acting like the handling package is what is going to define the Mach 1.

So why don't you just answer the question then? Why is it bad to offer an option to make something better? Would you be mad if Chevy had a option package that made the 1LE better? If they offered say the ZLE aero option on 1LE that would be bad according to you

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by shaffe

And the Mach 1 without the handling package will still be the Mach 1 - it will still have the 480HP engine, the magenride, all the cooling. It just won't have cup 2 tires and different aero. You are acting like the handling package is what is going to define the Mach 1.

So why don't you just answer the question then? Why is it bad to offer an option to make something better? Would you be mad if Chevy had a option package that made the 1LE better? If they offered say the ZLE aero option on 1LE that would be bad according to you

Ford can call it Mach 1. It just won't have the performance attributes of the "real" Mach 1. Its a Ford thing

I answer your question the best I can. The SS has all the cooling and power of the SS 1LE. It is not an SS 1LE

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by hotlap

Ford can call it Mach 1. It just won't have the performance attributes of the "real" Mach 1. Its a Ford thing

I answer your question the best I can. The SS has all the cooling and power of the SS 1LE. It is not an SS 1LE

EDIT: lets just agree to disagree sir, no need for you and me to keep cluttering this thread repeating the same things at each other

[joe944]

This honestly seems like a great move from Ford. If they can keep the price down, they should have a clear winner on their hands.

[oldman]

Originally Posted by shaffe

( lets be honest a good amount of people buy those trims because it looks great/is the best of what fits their budget with no track intent ever people do it with 1LE, PP GT350, hellcat whatever) why shoe horn every buyer into aggressive tires that aren't great on the street? I think offering that in a package is a smart move.

I agree here with the overall statement (except that is one ugly car).

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by joe944

This honestly seems like a great move from Ford. If they can keep the price down, they should have a clear winner on their hands.

How’s is starting at $50,000 for a Base mach1 keeping the price down? You will need to get Recaros, handling package, and I’m sure the entertainment package that will have certain items that everyone wants, but will need to buy. This option out on what come stock on a 1le will be near $60,000

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by hotlap

Ford can call it Mach 1. It just won't have the performance attributes of the "real" Mach 1. Its a Ford thing

I answer your question the best I can. The SS has all the cooling and power of the SS 1LE. It is not an SS 1LE

It sounds like a closer analogy is an SS 1LE on PS4S(same 285 front and 305 rear) and without the front lip, rear spoiler, etc., but you still get MRC and eLSD standard.

Tires are whatever, and in fact, not a lot of people will run Cup 2 on streets.

Or am I missing something here and the handling package includes other stuff?

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by hotlap

Ford can call it Mach 1. It just won't have the performance attributes of the "real" Mach 1. Its a Ford thing

I answer your question the best I can. The SS has all the cooling and power of the SS 1LE. It is not an SS 1LE

Is the SS 1LE not just an SS with optional upgrades? The SS 1LE is an SS. Sort of like the Mustang GT PP2 is a Mustang GT, but with optional upgraded suspension.

What you're not understanding about the Mach 1 is that the power and suspension are the same for all Mach 1s. All Mach 1s have the same springs, sway bars, etc. They all have the GT350 front and rear sub frames, and a few other chassis parts and aero bits from the GT500 and GT350. They all have MagneRide. They all have the Tremec (unless optioned with the A10). They all have the much longer front underbelly pan.

The handling package adds a more aggressive front splitter, wider wheels, Cup 2 tires, adjustable front strut top mounts, and a wing w/ Gurney flap. All essentially to improve downforce and grip. Yes, this will be faster around a track, obviously. But time around a track doesn't define a Mach 1.

Chevy does the exact same thing with the options on the Z06. Is the base Z06 not a "real" Z06 because it doesn't have the same track capabilities of the Z07 package?

What you're implying is also like saying the base GT500 isn't a "real" GT500 since it doesn't have the CFTP option. That doesn't make sense and is just plain silly to say the base Mach 1 isn't a real Mach 1.

FWIW the handling package option for the GT500 is only $1,500, but it doesn't include the Cup 2 tires or upgraded wheels.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Is the SS 1LE not just an SS with optional upgrades? The SS 1LE is an SS. Sort of like the Mustang GT PP2 is a Mustang GT, but with optional upgraded suspension.

What you're not understanding about the Mach 1 is that the power and suspension are the same for all Mach 1s. All Mach 1s have the same springs, sway bars, etc. They all have the GT350 front and rear sub frames, and a few other chassis parts and aero bits from the GT500 and GT350. They all have MagneRide. They all have the Tremec (unless optioned with the A10). They all have the much longer front underbelly pan.

The handling package adds a more aggressive front splitter, wider wheels, Cup 2 tires, adjustable front strut top mounts, and a wing w/ Gurney flap. All essentially to improve downforce and grip. Yes, this will be faster around a track, obviously. But time around a track doesn't define a Mach 1.

Chevy does the exact same thing with the options on the Z06. Is the base Z06 not a "real" Z06 because it doesn't have the same track capabilities of the Z07 package?

What you're implying is also like saying the base GT500 isn't a "real" GT500 since it doesn't have the CFTP option. That doesn't make sense and is just plain silly to say the base Mach 1 isn't a real Mach 1.

FWIW the handling package option for the GT500 is only $1,500, but it doesn't include the Cup 2 tires or upgraded wheels.

You make a good point with the Z07 comparison.

It always strikes me as off to have a track car with a track package. Camaro doesn’t have any of that.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by hotlap

You make a good point with the Z07 comparison.

It always strikes me as off to have a track car with a track package. Camaro doesn’t have any of that.

ZL1 with a 1LE package?