[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

Ofcourse on Evans post on FB all the ford retards are already comparing that number to official zl1 times hailing it as an official gt500 time ignoring motortrends 11.2.

After many attemps Motortrend got 11.2 on a prepped surface at an awesome 130 mph.. they got 11.5 in a zle a10 on an unprepped surface, albeit at a much slower 124mph. The gt500 is faster for sure, it has 110 more hp and a dct, it should be faster.

Dude, you should know better than this. I expect comments like this from Blaq, but you have better objective thinking ability than him. MT wasn't provided a car to test, MT had access to a base GT500 at the press event just as every other journalist did. Cars that were being hot lapped all day, and they got 2-3 runs, not "many" attempts, on minimally a prepped track.

Additionally, the 11.5 ZL1 times are corrected. The 11.2 time the MT journalist achieved at the Vegas press event is not corrected. We don't know the DA at the time of the run but it's safe to say it was at least 2000' which would reduce the e.t. and increase the trap speed. Also, according to those there, the track "prep" was minimal, and otherwise like street racing unless you were one of the first few to go after the rare event of a track prep throughout the day.

Evan ran a 10.89 @ 130 mph at the Vegas event (at 4,100' DA), with another guy running 10.85 @ 131 mph, both obviously uncorrected.

Blaq liked to pretend he knew they were running the CFTP GT500 and therefore try to claim a $100k Mustang runs 10s, but in reality, the base GT500 at $74k is capable of running mid 10s on a drag strip on PS4S factory tires, at 133 mph.

The biggest takeaway besides the CFTP version's track capabilities blowing everyone's minds, is the trap speed in Evan's Florida run of 10.61 @ 133 mph (DA = 975'). 133 mph is hauling no matter which way you slice it. Faster than a 911 Turbo S, and just 2 mph shy of the ZR1's corrected 135 mph in mag tests. Evan's 11.87 run with the GT* produced a trap speed of 119 and change, and C&D's trap speed was 120 mph, so we could expect C&D and MT to achieve similar trap speeds to the 133 mph run done in Florida, even if the e.t. is a few tenths slower.

[Mountain]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/10/29/...0-first-drive/

LOL, these guys crack me up. The performance "bargain of the year"...that most can't afford and that the few who can afford have to be on a limited list and then pay a markup for it. HAHA! Let's say I had $110K in hand to buy a car right now. What are my chances of buying a GT500 and what are my chances of buying a C8 Z51? What are my chances of seeing one of these performance bargain of the year vehicles, sitting in one, and driving one without having to buy it first? And then this quote "And around a racetrack, the Corvette wouldn’t have a chance. Not in speeds, laptimes, or handling behavior. I know, I've driven one". Yet offers no lap times or info on which track he's talking about. LOL!! These guys are a joke. I can't even take them serious anymore.

I can see where they can come up with this, being that a lot of C8 Stingrays will likely be $70k-$80k. But, I think the C8 is still the bargain, when it comes down to it.

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

Ofcourse on Evans post on FB all the ford retards are already comparing that number to official zl1 times hailing it as an official gt500 time ignoring motortrends 11.2.

After many attemps Motortrend got 11.2 on a prepped surface at an awesome 130 mph.. they got 11.5 in a zle a10 on an unprepped surface, albeit at a much slower 124mph. The gt500 is faster for sure, it has 110 more hp and a dct, it should be faster.

Yeah, but there were a number of none-regular car media personnel that were able to get right-at and below 11.0 seconds.

But, yeah, let's try to stay as close to apples to apples as we can.

It seems the GT500 vs ZL1 drag race will probably go to GT500, but not in a decimate way.

Originally Posted by Baldilocks01SS

Chevrolet, more than likely, won't even respond to the GT500. The Camaro is not on their priority list -- pleasing shareholders is. All of GM's focus is on the C8 Corvette and all of its upcoming variants.

Besides, making 760 crank HP in the ZL1 really doesn't take much effort and it's already more than capable on the track.

I wonder what a ZL1 1LE+A10+LT5 would do as far as improvement over the LT4 fitting?

Interested to see how this GT500 stacks up to the C7 ZR1...

Happy to hear Ford did some great things with this GT500.

[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Dude, you should know better than this. I expect comments like this from Blaq, but you have better objective thinking ability than him. MT wasn't provided a car to test, MT had access to a base GT500 at the press event just as every other journalist did. Cars that were being hot lapped all day, and they got 2-3 runs, not "many" attempts, on minimally a prepped track.

Additionally, the 11.5 ZL1 times are corrected. The 11.2 time the MT journalist achieved at the Vegas press event is not corrected. We don't know the DA at the time of the run but it's safe to say it was at least 2000' which would reduce the e.t. and increase the trap speed. Also, according to those there, the track "prep" was minimal, and otherwise like street racing unless you were one of the first few to go after the rare event of a track prep throughout the day.

Evan ran a 10.89 @ 130 mph at the Vegas event, with another guy running 10.85 @ 131 mph, both obviously uncorrected.

Blaq liked to pretend he knew they were running the CFTP GT500 and therefore try to claim a $100k Mustang runs 10s, but in reality, the base GT500 at $74k is capable of running mid 10s on a drag strip on PS4S factory tires, at 133 mph.

The biggest takeaway besides the CFTP version's track capabilities blowing everyone's minds, is the trap speed in Evan's Florida run of 10.61 @ 133 mph. 133 mph is hauling no matter which way you slice it. Faster than a 911 Turbo S, and just 2 mph shy of the ZR1's corrected 135 mph in mag tests. Evan's 11.87 run with the GT* produced a trap speed of 119 and change, and C&D's trap speed was 120 mph, so we could expect C&D and MT to achieve similar trap speeds to the 133 mph run done in Florida, even if the e.t. is a few tenths slower.

You read the article didn't you, they provided the base car for the strip at the event because ford deemed it the better car for the strip and the mpsc2s wouldn't have provided a grip advantage according them per MT & Evan, and it wasn't just one base car at the event. The many runs was in reference to the 14 or so of "them" running the car without any of them going sub 11 they mention in the drag strip portion of the article. Again, its in the article. While Blaq says it took a 100k mustang to run 10s, and he's wrong, because the base did, it very well could be that a 100k mustang can't run 10s since ford didn't bring it to the strip being that they thought the base was the better drag car. I'm sure it can in perfect conditions but it hasn't happened.

Dude you're pretending a corrected time (a time you dont know the actual recorded time for) on an unprepared surface is somehow more advantageous than times achieved on a prepped surface with people running multiple cars trying to achieve the best time possible, it's not. Whether you say it was weakly prepped or not it was prepped. As well as your guesses oin DA, sure it probably wasn't the best but you're just guessing.

You can try to play a corrected vs uncorrected gane and trying to figure out what one cars corrected time will be based on another cars corrections all you want but you're not comparing apples to apples. Uncorrected on the fast list zl1s have gone 10.9s at 128 and 129mph, zr1s have gone 10.3s, 10.4s, 10.5s from 133 to 134.5 mph uncorrected. Evans run is a fast list type run, it shows what the car is capable of just like the best runs on the fast list. That 133 Evan got is very impressive but it's not the 133 vs 124 gt500 vs zl1 ford fans want to try to say it is. Which if you look at the FB groups is what's going on, they're comparing Evans run to publication runs by the zl1. That's probably why ford does this, this very reaction from their fan base.

You're usually a good debate, especially when provided with proof of whatever we're debating about. I think you're fan boying extra hard a little today. It's understandable, we finally have info on the gt500 and it's awesome. You get a pass today lol I think it's pretty badass too and a great time for American muscle.

[Laststandard]

Kudos to Ford! Wish I had the money to afford all these amazing cars we have available now.

[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by Mountain

I can see where they can come up with this, being that a lot of C8 Stingrays will likely be $70k-$80k. But, I think the C8 is still the bargain, when it comes down to it.


Yeah, but there were a number of none-regular car media personnel that were able to get right-at and below 11.0 seconds.

But, yeah, let's try to stay as close to apples to apples as we can.

It seems the GT500 vs ZL1 drag race will probably go to GT500, but not in a decimate way.


I wonder what a ZL1 1LE+A10+LT5 would do as far as improvement over the LT4 fitting?

Interested to see how this GT500 stacks up to the C7 ZR1...

Happy to hear Ford did some great things with this GT500.

Seems to be between the zr1 and zl1 performance according to the numbers we have so far. Though it doesn't decimate the zl1 in a drag race it clearly wins. So far it hasn't done what the zr1 has but that's to be expected with similar power and more weight. That dct probably does a lot to make up for the weight imo quicker harder shifts with less drive train loss.

Zl1s and most cars have also done better in the hands of better drivers than the car rag guys were able to produce.

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

You read the article didn't you, they provided the base car for the strip at the event because ford deemed it the better car for the strip and the mpsc2s wouldn't have provided a grip advantage according them per MT & Evan, and it wasn't just one base car at the event. The many runs was in reference to the 14 or so of "them" running the car without any of them going sub 11 they mention in the drag strip portion of the article. Again, its in the article. While Blaq says it took a 100k mustang to run 10s, and he's wrong, because the base did, it very well could be that a 100k mustang can't run 10s since ford didn't bring it to the strip being that they thought the base was the better drag car. I'm sure it can in perfect conditions but it hasn't happened.

Dude you're pretending a corrected time (a time you dont know the actual recorded time for) on an unprepared surface is somehow more advantageous than times achieved on a prepped surface with people running multiple cars trying to achieve the best time possible, it's not. Whether you say it was weakly prepped or not it was prepped. As well as your guesses oin DA, sure it probably wasn't the best but you're just guessing.

You can try to play a corrected vs uncorrected gane and trying to figure out what one cars corrected time will be based on another cars corrections all you want but you're not comparing apples to apples. Uncorrected on the fast list zl1s have gone 10.9s at 128 and 129mph, zr1s have gone 10.3s, 10.4s, 10.5s from 133 to 134.5 mph uncorrected. Evans run is a fast list type run, it shows what the car is capable of just like the best runs on the fast list. That 133 Evan got is very impressive but it's not the 133 vs 124 gt500 vs zl1 ford fans want to try to say it is. Which if you look at the FB groups is what's going on, they're comparing Evans run to publication runs by the zl1. That's probably why ford does this, this very reaction from their fan base.

You're usually a good debate, especially when provided with proof of whatever we're debating about. I think you're fan boying extra hard a little today. It's understandable, we finally have info on the gt500 and it's awesome. You get a pass today lol I think it's pretty badass too and a great time for American muscle.

Yeah, maybe so, I'm more than a little excited in the glowing reviews thus far! I did edit my post with the actual DAs. The 10.89 @ 130 mph was 4,100' DA according to Evan, and the 10.61 @ 133 mph was 975' DA, also according to Evan. I inherently trust a magazine or online publication time over a fast list - magazines and online publications like hotrod have a reputation to uphold. When they say a car is stock, I'm more likely to believe it over a stock fast list. How easy is it to change tire or add a CAI or something to a car and claim it is stock? Who verifies the fast list times?

Anyway, I realize you can't compare corrected directly to uncorrected times or strip times directly to magazine's published times which are on unprepped surfaces. It's mostly just points of information. However, if Evan's GT* run is any indication, as I previously pointed out, the GT500 could trap 133 with the magazines, given he trapped 119 and change, and C&D's (corrected) mph is 120 mph for the GT*. If the GT500 traps 133 mph then that can be compared to the C&D and MT ZL1 trap speeds of 125 mph. That is yet to be seen. It would likely be same drivers and track, corrected, to account for the different conditions.

Frankly, I'm very impressed with the 133 mph trap speed - you know me - I love me some good trap speeds, I expected 130 but dang, man, 133 mph is moving. I'd rather be 11.0 @ 133 mph than 10.9 @ 127 mph. To me that 10.9 is an indicator of better traction, while the 133 mph is a better indicator of massive power and acceleration at speed.

But you're right, what we're hearing so far on the GT500 is awesome. Both the drag strip and on the track. I can't believe that both C&D and MT have compared the GT500 CFTP to the 911 GT2 RS. That can't be coincidence, as Billy Johnson did say they tested many cars during the development. I can't wait to see some track times.

[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Yeah, maybe so, I'm more than a little excited in the glowing reviews thus far! I did edit my post with the actual DAs. The 10.89 @ 130 mph was 4,100' DA according to Evan, and the 10.61 @ 133 mph was 975' DA, also according to Evan. I inherently trust a magazine or online publication time over a fast list - magazines and online publications like hotrod have a reputation to uphold. When they say a car is stock, I'm more likely to believe it over a stock fast list. How easy is it to change tire or add a CAI or something to a car and claim it is stock? Who verifies the fast list times?

Anyway, I realize you can't compare corrected directly to uncorrected times or strip times directly to magazine's published times which are on unprepped surfaces. It's mostly just points of information. However, if Evan's GT* run is any indication, as I previously pointed out, the GT500 could trap 133 with the magazines, given he trapped 119 and change, and C&D's (corrected) mph is 120 mph for the GT*. If the GT500 traps 133 mph then that can be compared to the C&D and MT ZL1 trap speeds of 125 mph. That is yet to be seen. It would likely be same drivers and track, corrected, to account for the different conditions.

Frankly, I'm very impressed with the 133 mph trap speed - you know me - I love me some good trap speeds, I expected 130 but dang, man, 133 mph is moving. I'd rather be 11.0 @ 133 mph than 10.9 @ 127 mph. To me that 10.9 is an indicator of better traction, while the 133 mph is a better indicator of massive power and acceleration at speed.

But you're right, what we're hearing so far on the GT500 is awesome. Both the drag strip and on the track. I can't believe that both C&D and MT have compared the GT500 CFTP to the 911 GT2 RS. That can't be coincidence, as Billy Johnson did say they tested many cars during the development. I can't wait to see some track times.

I get what you're saying, obviously the car is capable of 130 plus mph but we'll just have to wait and see what the published speeds are to compare apples to apples. Very impressive and if a good zl1 driver has a close drag race in a quarter mile with a gt500 I guarantee it'll get killed in the half mile though.

I get the scrutiny of the fast list but being that Evan is essentially a hired gun to get the best times for ford I don't really consider him an unbiased independent source so to me he's a fast list type time, personally. I know some people on the fast list lie but I also know people who have gotten fast list times without lying so they're possible but also get your skepticism towards it as a source.

As far as the corrected time possibility compared to the a10 gt corrected time, that's a solid thought process, I guess we'll have to wait and see again. Different cars and setups so hard to say how that will translate. I do hope they test the gt500 in an unprepped with corrected numbers so we can have apples to apples numbers vs the zl1 and to some degree the zr1. Obviously it's faster than the zl1 but by how much.

Hopefully they do a gt2 vs gt500 article like they did with the zr1 or at least get it in the best drivers car next year to see it go head to head with the best of the best. Plus to get some sweet Randy Pobst times at Laguna secs and ofcourse the inevitable showdown with the zl1 1le on a track.

I think the gt500 is everything it's supposed to be and totally badass. It's a shame it didn't come in manual. The dct is the best auto choice by far imo but still the big front engine muscle car should have had the option of a stick even if it was slower (duhh). Other than that I think the car is great and hit the mark.

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

I get what you're saying, obviously the car is capable of 130 plus mph but we'll just have to wait and see what the published speeds are to compare apples to apples. Very impressive and if a good zl1 driver has a close drag race in a quarter mile with a gt500 I guarantee it'll get killed in the half mile though.

I get the scrutiny of the fast list but being that Evan is essentially a hired gun to get the best times for ford I don't really consider him an unbiased independent source so to me he's a fast list type time, personally. I know some people on the fast list lie but I also know people who have gotten fast list times without lying so they're possible but also get your skepticism towards it as a source.

As far as the corrected time possibility compared to the a10 gt corrected time, that's a solid thought process, I guess we'll have to wait and see again. Different cars and setups so hard to say how that will translate. I do hope they test the gt500 in an unprepped with corrected numbers so we can have apples to apples numbers vs the zl1 and to some degree the zr1. Obviously it's faster than the zl1 but by how much.

Hopefully they do a gt2 vs gt500 article like they did with the zr1 or at least get it in the best drivers car next year to see it go head to head with the best of the best. Plus to get some sweet Randy Pobst times at Laguna secs and ofcourse the inevitable showdown with the zl1 1le on a track.

I think the gt500 is everything it's supposed to be and totally badass. It's a shame it didn't come in manual. The dct is the best auto choice by far imo but still the big front engine muscle car should have had the option of a stick even if it was slower (duhh). Other than that I think the car is great and hit the mark.

Good points. I think all the magazines will do their calibrated tests once they get their hands on one outside of the press event. I also think next year it'll run at LL and Pobst will drive one as well.

I admit before today I was solidly in the C8 camp, but after hearing the initial impressions from drivers and seeing the trap speed, I'm wavering a bit and wondering if a base GT500 is in my future...after all I do still need back seats for a long time.

One interesting tidbit I read from one of the reviews (can't remember the source but maybe C&D?) is Ford moved the pulley and gearing down in the supercharger, lowering the s/c center of gravity by a few inches. Pretty cool.

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Good points. I think all the magazines will do their calibrated tests once they get their hands on one outside of the press event. I also think next year it'll run at LL and Pobst will drive one as well.

I admit before today I was solidly in the C8 camp, but after hearing the initial impressions from drivers and seeing the trap speed, I'm wavering a bit and wondering if a base GT500 is in my future...after all I do still need back seats for a long time.

One interesting tidbit I read from one of the reviews (can't remember the source but maybe C&D?) is Ford moved the pulley and gearing down in the supercharger, lowering the s/c center of gravity by a few inches. Pretty cool.

If I were cool with a DCT, I would look hard at a GT500(if they are ever available at MSRP). IMO $74K is still a LOT for a 4200+ pound car, but Ford showed what they could do with the GT350, so grossly overweight or not it may not be felt too much. Certainly warrants a serious look, but not at a dime over MSRPm which may never really be much of an option.

I think a manual may be available soon, nothing wrong with releasing a 'slower' optioned version once the DCT has clearly set the bar for what it can do hahaha.

I have only heard the idle video so far, and it's wonderful. I can only imagine how exciting this car will be to drive.

[NW-99SS]

The video shows the 100K CF TP GT500 at the drag strip...

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

I wouldn't expect a C8 Stingray to compete with a GT500 CFTP on a road course. That's not its role. Stingray is the "street" Corvette. The high volume base car. The Z51 gives it much better handling and makes it track capable,not track king. C8 has to wait until the Grand Sport and/or Z06 show up before it can expect to seriously challenge a CFTP on the track. I'm super impressed by the Stingray's 0-60 and quarter mile achievements. Both numbers are better than I thought thy would be and the price of entry is much lower than I thought it would be. That makes the car a winner. The fact that it can perform on the track better than I can drive on the track is gravy.

I say run em and let's see what happens. The Z51 is what we have available in C8 trim right now. So to be fair, the ZL1 was pitted against the GT350R, so I think we should see the Z51 against the GT500. And I bet the Vette will do surprisingly well.

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

Ofcourse on Evans post on FB all the ford retards are already comparing that number to official zl1 times hailing it as an official gt500 time ignoring motortrends 11.2.

After many attemps Motortrend got 11.2 on a prepped surface at an awesome 130 mph.. they got 11.5 in a zle a10 on an unprepped surface, albeit at a much slower 124mph. The gt500 is faster for sure, it has 110 more hp and a dct, it should be faster.

Exactly.

Originally Posted by shaffe

I still wouldn't call it a bargain though, I would still spend my money on a C8 vs any of the high po pony cars

Originally Posted by Mountain

I can see where they can come up with this, being that a lot of C8 Stingrays will likely be $70k-$80k. But, I think the C8 is still the bargain, when it comes down to it.

I think they got soo enamored with the quarter mile time that they're losing their minds. The GT500, is the worst bargain. A bargain would mean that I can buy the car at a decent price and get a great value. In that respect the GT500 will be the absolute worst bargain. It is going to carry heavy markups. Not only that but even if you're willing to pay those markups your chances of getting one is still next to nonexistent. On the contrary you can go and order a C8 right this minute. And so far it has run an 11.1. And you won't pay a markup. And the minimum you will pay for that performance is $65K. So in all sense of reality, how they could come to their conclusion without considering all aspects of acquiring a GT500 is beyond me.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

I say run em and let's see what happens. The Z51 is what we have available in C8 trim right now. So to be fair, the ZL1 was pitted against the GT350R, so I think we should see the Z51 against the GT500. And I bet the Vette will do surprisingly well.

Exactly.


I think they got soo enamored with the quarter mile time that they're losing their minds. The GT500, is the worst bargain. A bargain would mean that I can buy the car at a decent price and get a great value. In that respect the GT500 will be the absolute worst bargain. It is going to carry heavy markups. Not only that but even if you're willing to pay those markups your chances of getting one is still next to nonexistent. On the contrary you can go and order a C8 right this minute. And so far it has run an 11.1. And you won't pay a markup. And the minimum you will pay for that performance is $65K. So in all sense of reality, how they could come to their conclusion without considering all aspects of acquiring a GT500 is beyond me.

Because they report on the MSRP - rarely have they ventured into talking about ADMs.

You just seem upset that all the reviews seem very glowing lol - all in good fun

[triggerjerk]

I bet dodge will do something to steal the limelight back.
GM, instead of dropping the LT5 in the ZL1, will launch a new series of "real people" ads featuring urbanites loading potting soil into a Blazer outside of a hip coffee shop.

[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by triggerjerk

I bet dodge will do something to steal the limelight back.
GM, instead of dropping the LT5 in the ZL1, will launch a new series of "real people" ads featuring urbanites loading potting soil into a Blazer outside of a hip coffee shop.

Gm will come out with news on how they have invested further into their EV future.