[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by Memphis SS

Also, you're kind of basing your times off the guy in the manual always making good shifts and never missing a gear. Humm I've been to the track that not always the case. But I understand guys in manuals have good races

At this point, fewer people are picking the manual which comes back to why GM is moving away from that platform in the C8.

Here is the question of the day:

If less than say 1000 people complain about the manual going away and you're selling your complete allocation of the C8 Corvette after adding a second shift and still can't meet demand. Why would you add the manual?

This is the current status on the C8.

Yeah, I dont think a manual C8 will happen for two reasons. The performance hit will be too large, and the difficulty in making it work in this platform is too high. The demand will not make up for either of those issues.

[oldman]

Originally Posted by Dixie ZL1

First point.... don’t care about the drag strip, but yes, the A10 is quicker there but the C8 corvette isn’t a drag car

Second...... HP is a calculated value and only torque under the curve counts. Don’t know when you last attended a road race track day, but for me it’s all about building skill driving my M6 ZL1. I’ll pull 3500 - 6500 all day long in 2nd or 3rd gear while the A10 driver is trying to figure out what his car took an extra upshift blew his entrance to the next straight.

Spend time at road track events and you’ll see.

Um simple automotive physics says anything under the curve (which is plotted in RPM as a vector) adds the dimension needed to calculate power . Torque alone is a meaningless value PERIOD. Hence Power is the unit of work which uses RPM...

Comparing your drive's skill to somebody else is meaningless. You are using your skill to apply HP (the unit of power) to the ground.

I don't need to go anywhere to understand that power is what moves a car.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by Memphis SS

Also, you're kind of basing your times off the guy in the manual always making good shifts and never missing a gear. Humm I've been to the track that not always the case.

True. Though when you're trying to assess performance differences, you're actually comparing differences in performance potential where everything is assumed to go pretty close to right for the one lap, one run, one time trial, or one road-race that is the basis for that comparison.

Just for clarity, I really wasn't talking about drag racing, where a single too-slow or otherwise botched shift has immediate competitive consequences.

HPDE is more relaxed than any form of competition - whether that be autocross, time trialing, wheel-to-wheel, or side-by-side racing. So you're far less likely to screw up a shift out of adrenalin-fueled haste.

At this point, fewer people are picking the manual which comes back to why GM is moving away from that platform in the C8.

It's been that way for decades already. In the C8's case, I guess it's at the point where if you can promise the numbers, nothing else about performance driving matters.

Here is the question of the day:

If less than say 1000 people complain about the manual going away and you're selling your complete allocation of the C8 Corvette after adding a second shift and still can't meet demand. Why would you add the manual?

I'd probably have to make the same cold business decision to turn MT fitment down, but it sure wouldn't be because I felt that it no longer had merit.

Just the thought of having to make decisions like that makes me glad I never wanted to get into management.

Next round's on me. Cheers!


Norm

[SecondZ28]

Originally Posted by Memphis SS

I wish I could remember what years in the C5 Corvette GM charged for manuals but they did do that for a few years.. no difference in HP.

They charged for the manual trans in every year of C5.

It was a $815 option in 1997-2002 and $915 in 2003-04

[Artos]

I struggled over two items when I ordered my ZL1...color & transmission. I'll be 50 soon & always swore I would never get an auto for my real first sports car & yeah I had to eat some crow. Reading up on the A10 / technology & all the chatter here helped me pick & tickled with my decision, but still old school & feels like a punch in the gut to see both the 500 & C8 sans manual option out of the gates. Heck, I'm not a player on either but it's gotta sting being a car guy & immediately be out because you enjoy using your left foot. I do hope they accommodate & demand is there. I like the new autos but feel there is room for both & reckon there is some griping going on.

[Dixie ZL1]

Two thirds of new 911.2 GT3’s are manuals for a reason.... customers demanded it. Porsche said the manual was dead only offered PDK for a few years.... That changed dramatically.

Good article.

https://medium.com/@jamesaevans/pors...k-a5c0e42c56ec

[Dixie ZL1]

This clutch by wire patent by GM is encouraging.....

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.roa...te-mid-engine/

[Aragorn]

Originally Posted by Dixie ZL1

Two thirds of new 911.2 GT3’s are manuals for a reason.... customers demanded it. Porsche said the manual was dead only offered PDK for a few years.... That changed dramatically.

Good article.

https://medium.com/@jamesaevans/pors...k-a5c0e42c56ec

Cool article, thank you.
Is it 1/3 or 2/3?

[Dixie ZL1]

Originally Posted by Aragorn

Cool article, thank you.
Is it 1/3 or 2/3?

Thank you..... 1/3

[oldman]

with a MSRP 2.5 the price of a C8, I can see guys wanting "engagement" vs performance.. You could have a C7 and a C8 and a HUGE bunch of mods, maybe toss in a Camaro

[Dixie ZL1]

Originally Posted by oldman

with a MSRP 2.5 the price of a C8, I can see guys wanting "engagement" vs performance.. You could have a C7 and a C8 and a HUGE bunch of mods, maybe toss in a Camaro

Every 911 model above the 911S has M7 standard.

Are you saying that only expensive exotics get manual transmissions now? That seems counter to the entire argument that GM shouldn’t offer an M7 in the C8.

The car will come with a manual trans.

[oldman]

I'm saying when you got that kind of cash, you buy anything you want and buy something else too. GM is marketing a mid engine supercar for the masses. Not a drive engagement car for the elite. Nothing wrong about being rich... it just ain't me. My "engagement" is a M6 Camaro. The c8 is significantly FASTER that the two cars in the article, a shame considering the price difference. I think most Vette owners will give up a little "engagement" to do some old fashion whooping....

[MrChrisLS3]

Originally Posted by Dixie ZL1

This clutch by wire patent by GM is encouraging.....

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.roa...te-mid-engine/

Yeah, but given the current design of the center console, I would think it would still be a paddle shift. Which would then make me wonder, if the sifting were all done electronically, why need a clutch pedal at all? Of course, this make it a sequential shift, like the C7R. Maybe not a bad thing.

[c4racer]

Based on this nice list of road course times I think mostly done by randy P one might argue the C7 ZR1 might even be faster than a base C8. Probably not the z06 version.
And I bet the price point for a few year old zr1 will be similar.
It’s not mid engine but it’s still a ZR1 and can’t argue with that motor.
Available with manual trans too !

https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...storical-data/