[13vertss]

Originally Posted by GossipSquirrelJelena

Your absolutely right. And 99% of those people dont have any idea what the car they own will do. With them behind the wheel. Just easier to say. My car runs 11s because one dude on the forum claimed he did. Or Car & Driver. Lapped Virginia international in under 3 minutes in a car just like mine. What Randy Posbt does. And what I would do on a road course. Would be wildly different.

And that’s bad in what way? Most don’t have time or money to mod and spend time at tracks, but when there on the road, they want to feel they have the best car for there money and feel good behind the wheel. And if magazines says it does a certain thing, it makes them feel better.

[GossipSquirrelJelena]

Originally Posted by 13vertss

And that’s bad in what way? Most don’t have time or money to mod and spend time at tracks, but when there on the road, they want to feel they have the best car for there money and feel good behind the wheel. And if magazines says it does a certain thing, it makes them feel better.

Don't recall saying it was bad? Just not what myself or fraxum would relate to. If people need magazines to feel good about their purchases. And want to quote the magazines. Or some guy on the forums religiously. Who am I to judge? I just feel sorry for those guys. They spend 70 grand on a Hellcat or Corvette. Only to get juiced at a light. Buy a teenager in a 10 year old WRX. The magazine stats said they had that one in the bag.

[TheReaper]

This is a very good thread with a lot of interesting points being made.

[Bench racers]

Originally Posted by GossipSquirrelJelena

Don't recall saying it was bad? Just not what myself or fraxum would relate to. If people need magazines to feel good about their purchases. And want to quote the magazines. Or some guy on the forums religiously. Who am I to judge? I just feel sorry for those guys. They spend 70 grand on a Hellcat or Corvette. Only to get juiced at a light. Buy a teenager in a 10 year old WRX. The magazine stats said they had that one in the bag.

AMEN!!!

[oldman]

Originally Posted by GossipSquirrelJelena

[Who am I to judge? I just feel sorry for those guys. [/B]

Um you just made a judgement. Also your track times means NOTHING to a street fighter... just saying...

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by GossipSquirrelJelena

Don't recall saying it was bad? Just not what myself or fraxum would relate to. If people need magazines to feel good about their purchases. And want to quote the magazines. Or some guy on the forums religiously. Who am I to judge? I just feel sorry for those guys. They spend 70 grand on a Hellcat or Corvette. Only to get juiced at a light. Buy a teenager in a 10 year old WRX. The magazine stats said they had that one in the bag.

In a WRX? LOL!! That thing better have some serious work done to it. But most of us just laugh at those kids anyway. They aren't even worth the waste of gas money to blow their doors off. I just wave them off and ignore them. Once you start spending money on more expensive cars the less likely you are to do stupid shit like racing some teenager at a light. If I wanna race, I'll buy a cheap used base model GT and throw some used parts at it. If it blows, ok, $3K on a used engine and do it all over again. Run it into the ground and then get rid of it, lol!! No way in hell am I doing that in a $70+ car. But trust me, most guys in a Corvette won't even acknowledge your existence if you come at them in a WRX. It could be modded to the moon and back or bone stock and they won't even look your way, haha!!!

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by GossipSquirrelJelena

Don't recall saying it was bad? Just not what myself or fraxum would relate to. If people need magazines to feel good about their purchases. And want to quote the magazines. Or some guy on the forums religiously. Who am I to judge? I just feel sorry for those guys. They spend 70 grand on a Hellcat or Corvette. Only to get juiced at a light. Buy a teenager in a 10 year old WRX. The magazine stats said they had that one in the bag.

You are judging. You come on as if you don’t take your 70000 car to the track, you should not of bought it. I don’t need time slips to justify my driving experience.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by 13vertss

But, there are probably 100 times more people who keep there cars stock, then do what you do.

Stock has gotten so good that the negatives of modifying make it unattractive. Many of us have had experience with changing one aspect only to end up with a negative impact in another. In the end the drivability and enjoyment are gone

The OEs in our segment are now delivering 455-485 HP base cars and 650-797 HP premium. Nice baseline for a street car with a warranty so most won’t screw with it IMO.

Magazine review show us how well the manufacturers integrate the entire package. Chevy offers a well intergrated car emphasizing power and handling that is the class of the segment. Dodge is brute force and comfort. Mustang is a series of compromises made to appeal broadly to a non performance oriented buyers.

Anyway... I think it takes a lot more skill to drive a stock car fast than competing with cubic dollars spent while destroying the overall usefulness of the car.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by 13vertss

You are judging. You come on as if you don’t take your 70000 car to the track, you should not of bought it. I don’t need time slips to justify my driving experience.

He's justifying having bought the poorer car (15 GT). Fix the straight line deficit and then dismiss others as inferior to his God like reaction time while overlooking that he races at the fastest track in America.

[Chadicus]

Originally Posted by GossipSquirrelJelena

Don't recall saying it was bad? Just not what myself or fraxum would relate to. If people need magazines to feel good about their purchases. And want to quote the magazines. Or some guy on the forums religiously. Who am I to judge? I just feel sorry for those guys. They spend 70 grand on a Hellcat or Corvette. Only to get juiced at a light. Buy a teenager in a 10 year old WRX. The magazine stats said they had that one in the bag.

People still street race? Lol. Most of us quit doing that at 18 or so.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by hotlap

Stock has gotten so good that the negatives of modifying make it unattractive. Many of us have had experience with changing one aspect only to end up with a negative impact in another. In the end the drivability and enjoyment are gone

The OEs in our segment are now delivering 455-485 HP base cars and 650-797 HP premium. Nice baseline for a street car with a warranty so most won’t screw with it IMO.

Magazine review show us how well the manufacturers integrate the entire package. Chevy offers a well intergrated car emphasizing power and handling that is the class of the segment. Dodge is brute force and comfort. Mustang is a series of compromises made to appeal broadly to a non performance oriented buyers.

Anyway... I think it takes a lot more skill to drive a stock car fast than competing with cubic dollars spent while destroying the overall usefulness of the car.

In my older cars I was less hesitant to do things like a tune etc. Companies figured out ways to hide tunes or make them non-detectable if you returned it to stock etc. And I figured even if I tune it and the warranty gets voided, well the engine is only about $5K used so I could just get another one. Nowadays these cars are coming with locked ECUs and $15K-$25K engines. And if you void your warranty then who's to say any dealership will take it in on trade or that someone will buy it from you? You'd have a tough time trying to get rid of it.

Also we're starting to see stock cars exceed average driver ability. People in 400 HP Mustangs are losing control and plowing into crowds, curbs, trees, hospitals, school buses, ice cream stands, and everything else. Now cars are coming with well over 600 HP and now we're getting into the high 700s and low 800s. Bone stock. Back 10 years ago if you had a modded 4th Gen F-Body on a built engine with boost making 500+ RWHP you'd be the man. Or a modded Termi pushing 630 RWHP that would be impressive. Cars are coming from the factory with high 600 RWHP. And they're fully optioned. These are levels that cars that were "highly modded" and "race only" cars were at. Not everyone has the discipline or even the ability to control them.

Originally Posted by hotlap

He's justifying having bought the poorer car (15 GT). Fix the straight line deficit and then dismiss others as inferior to his God like reaction time while overlooking that he races at the fastest track in America.

LOL, and that it can't turn to save his life. Put that thing on a track and see how well it stacks up. Oh wait, that doesn't matter. The only thing that matters to him is the one area where he claims his highly modded race car seems to do well. LOL!!

[GossipSquirrelJelena]

Originally Posted by hotlap

Stock has gotten so good that the negatives of modifying make it unattractive. Many of us have had experience with changing one aspect only to end up with a negative impact in another. In the end the drivability and enjoyment are gone

The OEs in our segment are now delivering 455-485 HP base cars and 650-797 HP premium. Nice baseline for a street car with a warranty so most won’t screw with it IMO.

Magazine review show us how well the manufacturers integrate the entire package. Chevy offers a well intergrated car emphasizing power and handling that is the class of the segment. Dodge is brute force and comfort. Mustang is a series of compromises made to appeal broadly to a non performance oriented buyers.

Anyway... I think it takes a lot more skill to drive a stock car fast than competing with cubic dollars spent while destroying the overall usefulness of the car.

I agree with your general assessment of each brands pony car.
But driving a stock Mustang or Camaro on the other hand. Is basically the easiest thing there is. Everything in a heavily modded car happens twice as fast as a stock car. Take the guy on here that likes to roll race. With 1000+ hp. He hits the loud peddle at 60. And four seconds later hes doing 160. You might hit 100 if your lucky in your hotwheels car.

[GossipSquirrelJelena]

Originally Posted by Chadicus

People still street race? Lol. Most of us quit doing that at 18 or so.

Try to keep up. The point was if you go by magazine times. Or some random guys forum times only. Like hotlap does. As your arguement for everything. You better stay on the side lines. And enjoy your car for what it is. Cause a guy like me in the inferior car. Will hurt your feelings. Talking silly on a forum is easy. Backing it up on the street or at the track. Not so much. Aint that right hoplap tell him about your 11 second SS..

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

In my older cars I was less hesitant to do things like a tune etc. Companies figured out ways to hide tunes or make them non-detectable if you returned it to stock etc. And I figured even if I tune it and the warranty gets voided, well the engine is only about $5K used so I could just get another one. Nowadays these cars are coming with locked ECUs and $15K-$25K engines. And if you void your warranty then who's to say any dealership will take it in on trade or that someone will buy it from you? You'd have a tough time trying to get rid of it.

Also we're starting to see stock cars exceed average driver ability. People in 400 HP Mustangs are losing control and plowing into crowds, curbs, trees, hospitals, school buses, ice cream stands, and everything else. Now cars are coming with well over 600 HP and now we're getting into the high 700s and low 800s. Bone stock. Back 10 years ago if you had a modded 4th Gen F-Body on a built engine with boost making 500+ RWHP you'd be the man. Or a modded Termi pushing 630 RWHP that would be impressive. Cars are coming from the factory with high 600 RWHP. And they're fully optioned. These are levels that cars that were "highly modded" and "race only" cars were at. Not everyone has the discipline or even the ability to control them.


LOL, and that it can't turn to save his life. Put that thing on a track and see how well it stacks up. Oh wait, that doesn't matter. The only thing that matters to him is the one area where he claims his highly modded race car seems to do well. LOL!!

It can't be....I am in agreement with (almost) everything you said (except the last paragraph). Cars nowadays are insanely powerful compared to any time in history. Back in the early 2000s I was street racing (while in college - I don't do it anymore) full bolt on LS1s that were running low 12s/high 11s with my modded LT1 '95 Trans Am (340 rwhp) and doing quite well on the street even against those cars. I would waste any non-heavily boosted Mustang - those GTs were slow back then. I raced a full bolt on '01 GT that might as well have been standing still. That driver later admitted she thought my car would be slow because it was an LT1. A buddy of mine had a heads/cam/full bolt on LS1 that put less power to the wheels than my stock '18 GT A10 likely does (haven't had mine dyno'd but based on the many dynos I've seen of stock '18 GTs). Regarding the last paragraph: Some (many) people don't care about tracking a car, and build cars for straight line drag racing only. It is a thing.