[Eldi Z]

I know it has been discussed many times, however, I feel I need further reassurance (towards plans to upgrade to a PD unit) from the experienced professionals, since I am new to GM engines and especially V8s (I have been working with VAG 4 Cyl. Turbo motors for the past 20 years).

If someone were not to steadily beat on the motor, using it as a DD and only pushing it occasionally, would the stock RA with stock C/R be expected to hold boosted power ~ 8-9 PSI max (I.E. reaching 550-580 WHP on 93) for about the same life of the stock motor?
Fueling would also be upgraded to LT4 parts.
Average ambient temperatures and humidity levels similar to Florida.

[Drsagacity]

Originally Posted by Eldi Z

I know it has been discussed many times, however, I feel I need further reassurance (towards plans to upgrade to a PD unit) from the experienced professionals, since I am new to GM engines and especially V8s (I have been working with VAG 4 Cyl. Turbo motors for the past 20 years).

If someone were not to steadily beat on the motor, using it as a DD and only pushing it occasionally, would the stock RA with stock C/R be expected to hold boosted power ~ 8-9 PSI max (I.E. reaching 550-580 WHP on 93) for about the same life of the stock motor?
Fueling would also be upgraded to LT4 parts.
Average ambient temperatures and humidity levels similar to Florida.

For the Magnuson, you will be in the 550-600whp on 93 octane running 7psi and you wouldn't even need to upgrade anything else. If you wanted to be extra safe, you could run 530-540whp on 5psi.

If I were going to stay below 600whp now, I would run the Maggie, rotofab and add the JMS voltage booster for good measure. That also puts you in a good place if you should eventually want to push further. That's when you can upgrade the fuel system and add a cam.

[ramairroughneck]

You could easily achieve your stated goal with a factory LT4 blower and no other modifications whatsoever. The LT4 installed and tuned price is cheaper than the Maggie or Whipple kit without the install. Many have done it safely on the stock motor

[Drsagacity]

Originally Posted by ramairroughneck

You could easily achieve your stated goal with a factory LT4 blower and no other modifications whatsoever. The LT4 installed and tuned price is cheaper than the Maggie or Whipple kit without the install. Many have done it safely on the stock motor

That is true. You will also have more heat problems and have limited options to grow after the initial installation. There are reasons people remove the LT4 blower from cars and upgrade to the other options you mentioned.

However, you are correct, the LT4 blower is probably the cheapest option to get decent numbers to begin with.

[ramairroughneck]

Heat problems at stock boost levels? I haven’t heard that from the ZL1 guys

[Drsagacity]

Originally Posted by ramairroughneck

Heat problems at stock boost levels?

Are you talking about stock boost levels on a zl1 or an SS? The motors have different compression ratios. What happens when you run the same pulley on the higher compression motor? When you take the stock zl1 pulley and put it on an SS for instance.

It looks like the Lt4 blown cars, zl1’s, Trap slower and run slower times, in general. There aren’t any lt4 blown cars on the LT1 fast list, so I can’t judge what’s happening. I would defer to someone who has tracked their LT4 blown LT1 to let them tell the story. However, I was agreeing with you, you can definitely get an LT4 blower cheaper, but there are clear downsides. That’s why people take the LT4 blower off their cars.

[ramairroughneck]

It’s pretty safe to say a LT4 blower on a SS at close to the same boost as a ZL1 is gonna get this guy the 550-580 horsepower range without over heating the car. I’m no engineer so Ill have to speculate that the compression difference won’t make the car overheat in this range. Sure spinning it to the moon would be the downfall. I was just commenting at this level as that’s what he mentioned. It sounds like he wants to keep the factory pistons. Here he can achieve his goal pretty cheap. I don’t doubt the ability of a magnacharger to run cooler when tasked to make a lot more power than the OP is inquiring about

[Drsagacity]

Originally Posted by ramairroughneck

It’s pretty safe to say a LT4 blower on a SS at close to the same boost as a ZL1 is gonna get this guy the 550-580 horsepower range without over heating the car. I’m no engineer so Ill have to speculate that the compression difference won’t make the car overheat in this range. Sure spinning it to the moon would be the downfall. I was just commenting at this level as that’s what he mentioned. It sounds like he wants to keep the factory pistons. Here he can achieve his goal pretty cheap. I don’t doubt the ability of a magnacharger to run cooler when tasked to make a lot more power than the OP is inquiring about

Yep. I am talking about overheating the car. I don’t believe I ever said that. If you are interested in a dyno number that means nothing that is one thing. If you are interested in the performance of a 600whp car, that is another. Take the 600whp car with the LT4 blower and go run the quarter mile. You will not achieve the same performance as another 600whp car with a different option because IaT’s Will be higher with the LT4 blower. On paper, the LT4 blower will show a similar torque curve, similar boost, and similar power numbers. Almost identical when you only pull in 5th gear for 5 seconds. I am also saying that is deceptive.

I am not saying the car will overheat. By heat problems, I am suggesting the LT4 blower will result in increased IaTs that will not allow for performance you would expect from a 600whp car. If you are only interested in a dyno number for bragging rights and you are never going to expect performance to match that number, then the cheapest way to get there is the LT4 blower. Sorry, I am not saying anything controversial here. Just pointing out that spinning a blower harder creates more heat and results in higher iat’s. The guys on this forum who have posted good dyno results with the LT4 blower have generally been running close to 10psi on the LT1. You will see on many of the threads when they post the results, I have specifically asked what boost level they were seeing.

[laynlo15]

The Lt4 is a good blower but if you want to further mod the engine after the install the Maggie will be much more receptive to higher horse power and cooler intake temps. The Lt4 just won't move as much air as the 2300. There is a reason why there are so many for sale off the Zl1's, yes the kits are cheaper and if you just want to have a blower just to say you have one that's fine, but they will have higher intake temps on equal amounts of boost and your definitely limited on higher hp/torque then the Maggie.

[KingLT1]

Originally Posted by Drsagacity

Are you talking about stock boost levels on a zl1 or an SS? The motors have different compression ratios. What happens when you run the same pulley on the higher compression motor? When you take the stock zl1 pulley and put it on an SS for instance.

It looks like the Lt4 blown cars, zl1’s, Trap slower and run slower times, in general. There aren’t any lt4 blown cars on the LT1 fast list, so I can’t judge what’s happening. I would defer to someone who has tracked their LT4 blown LT1 to let them tell the story. However, I was agreeing with you, you can definitely get an LT4 blower cheaper, but there are clear downsides. That’s why people take the LT4 blower off their cars.

Originally Posted by Drsagacity

Yep. I am talking about overheating the car. I don’t believe I ever said that. If you are interested in a dyno number that means nothing that is one thing. If you are interested in the performance of a 600whp car, that is another. Take the 600whp car with the LT4 blower and go run the quarter mile. You will not achieve the same performance as another 600whp car with a different option because IaT’s Will be higher with the LT4 blower. On paper, the LT4 blower will show a similar torque curve, similar boost, and similar power numbers. Almost identical when you only pull in 5th gear for 5 seconds. I am also saying that is deceptive.

I am not saying the car will overheat. By heat problems, I am suggesting the LT4 blower will result in increased IaTs that will not allow for performance you would expect from a 600whp car. If you are only interested in a dyno number for bragging rights and you are never going to expect performance to match that number, then the cheapest way to get there is the LT4 blower. Sorry, I am not saying anything controversial here. Just pointing out that spinning a blower harder creates more heat and results in higher iat’s. The guys on this forum who have posted good dyno results with the LT4 blower have generally been running close to 10psi on the LT1. You will see on many of the threads when they post the results, I have specifically asked what boost level they were seeing.

Actually the SS runs cooler because you can under drive the LT4 blower and make the same power as a ZL1 due to the increased compression of the LT1. Boost creates far more heat then compression. ADM made 600whp with only 6psi using E85. Then ADM made 680whp with E85 on a completely stock 1LE SS at the factory LT4's 9psi using the LT4 injectors and LPE big bore. Its actually a very effective blower for setups under 10psi. The reason why ZL1 cars remove them is simply because they have a engine capable of 1k hp out of the gate and the 1.7 blower is tapped out long before then.

FYI, There was a guy on Facebook running 10.50's @ 135 with a LT4 setup on a SS. Many 6gen owners do not post on this forum.

The Maggie definitely is the way to go if you plan on making more power down the road...can't argue that at all.

[laynlo15]

Well said King.

[Eldi Z]

Thanks so much everyone for posting such useful information. Gotta' love this forum!

My goal is to stay below 7 PSI for running it as safe as I can, considering the high C/R and problematic ring-lands.
Even if I forgo 20-30 WHP, it is not the end of the world for me, mainly because I do not intend to drag the car, only want it to be faster on the street than the stock NA setup.
If I can make 530 WHP on 93 straight (no E85) at under 7 PSI (the lower the better), upgrading to the LT4 injectors and HPFP as well, I am going to be happy

[oneredry]

Originally Posted by Eldi Z

Thanks so much everyone for posting such useful information. Gotta' love this forum!

My goal is to stay below 7 PSI for running it as safe as I can, considering the high C/R and problematic ring-lands.
Even if I forgo 20-30 WHP, it is not the end of the world for me, mainly because I do not intend to drag the car, only want it to be faster on the street than the stock NA setup.
If I can make 530 WHP on 93 straight (no E85) at under 7 PSI (the lower the better), upgrading to the LT4 injectors and HPFP as well, I am going to be happy

yeah I said the same thing. a smaller pulley later and a few re-tunes. lol

[DatBrotato]

Originally Posted by Eldi Z

Thanks so much everyone for posting such useful information. Gotta' love this forum!

My goal is to stay below 7 PSI for running it as safe as I can, considering the high C/R and problematic ring-lands.
Even if I forgo 20-30 WHP, it is not the end of the world for me, mainly because I do not intend to drag the car, only want it to be faster on the street than the stock NA setup.
If I can make 530 WHP on 93 straight (no E85) at under 7 PSI (the lower the better), upgrading to the LT4 injectors and HPFP as well, I am going to be happy

you could easily achieve these numbers with full bolt-ons and a cam, keep the reliability of a N/A motor, and never worry about IATs or going lean for whatever reason.
Port the heads & go E85 and you'll have 550+
Just throwing that out there..