Fueling Component Limit Question

tireslayer0331 · 03-26-2018, 10:47 AM

I currently have a D1SC pushing 10lbs of boost making 591whp and my only fueling upgrade is the LT4 HPFP, I have LT4 injectors ready to install but didn't need them yet. I don't want to push more boost until I build my motor and add a cam in the very distant future, however I am interested in running full e85 if possible. Does anyone know how much power the LT4 HPFP and LT4 injectors can push on a stock LT1 cam and e85? I was thinking of running an aux pump from the rear(lowside wouldnt be an issue) and installing a flex fuel sensor, I feel like the HPFP and stock cam lobe would be the limiting factor in this setup. If anyone has any experience with this setup I'd love to hear how it went. I hope my question makes sense.

Less text version: What is the limit on e85 before running out of fuel people have seen with
-LT4 HPFP
-LT4 Injectors
-Stock Cam
-Low pressure Fuel System upgraded

boostednut · 03-26-2018, 01:31 PM

The zl1 guys are mid 600whp range on stock lt4 pump/injectors on e85, but I'm not sure how many of them are doing that on stock fuel pump lobe. I'd be willing to bet though that you could hit "600whp" on a dynojet on stock lt4 stuff without the lobe. This is a good question to ask your tuner.

Another thing to remember is that you get most of your benefits from ethanol running like 50% ethanol. So that can tremendously extend the hp of your fuel system. Another thing to keep in mind is that you can also add pure meth ontop if you really need to extend power a bit further/give a bit fatter mixture for safety.

JFM-jr · 03-26-2018, 01:56 PM

Do not rely soley on LT4 number to compare. The LT4 camshaft has a slightly larger fuel lobe than the LT1 (5.7 vs 6.0) so even an LT4 high side pump on an LT1 will not be driven by the cam as hard. Not sure how much of a difference is makes but there is a difference.

boostednut · 03-26-2018, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JFM-jr

Do not rely soley on LT4 number to compare. The LT4 camshaft has a slightly larger fuel lobe than the LT1 (5.7 vs 6.0) so even an LT4 high side pump on an LT1 will not be driven by the cam as hard. Not sure how much of a difference is makes but there is a difference.

Great info definitely.

If you look at the car pray tuned, made 680 on pump, seems like the 30% extra fuel draw of e85 would put that lt4 pump setup on lt1 quite a bit lower.

That being said, again, e50~ should get you the benefits of e85 you'd be looking for (cooling timing), and would free up a lot of bsfc

JFM-jr · 03-26-2018, 04:16 PM

Jannetty has a Hellion car it is currently doing some testing on. It has a full LT4 fuel system with a JMS voltage booster. They made an E50 pull last week and ran out of fuel at at 4500 RPM 700trq so he aborted the run. He was going to try pulls on E50 with less boost it seems like if anyone is going to have a good idea of what this fuel setup he is running is worth its gonna be on this car. We need to remember its a turbo build so simikar rear wheel numbers on a blower car woukd need more fuel due to parasitic losses vs these turbos. Im currently on the fence waiting to see if this LT4 system with a voltage booster will get me in the 575-600 territory on say E70ish.

Epx998 · 03-26-2018, 05:50 PM

I am getting the LT4 fuel upgrades (and flex sensor) so I can run e85 on my Magnuson install. If no one replies, i'll post my numbers when I get them in a couple weeks.

tireslayer0331 · 03-26-2018, 06:46 PM

Thanks for the responses guys. Maybe I'll check some c7 vette forums and see how far people pushed their z06 HPFPs on e85 before they ran out. I just want to know how far this stock cam can go for fueling. Ted probably would know, if I don't get a response here I may as on his Q and A thread.

tireslayer0331 · 03-26-2018, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Epx998

I am getting the LT4 fuel upgrades (and flex sensor) so I can run e85 on my Magnuson install. If no one replies, i'll post my numbers when I get them in a couple weeks.

Thanks, I would love to know where that all puts you at on pump and if you could run full e85 or ran out of fuel ect.

DapperDan · 03-26-2018, 06:56 PM

Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING View Post
You can get to about 660 RWHP on E-60 with the LT-4 in tank, high pressure and injectors, about 750 on race gas.

With a cam the LT-4 stuff will carry you to 750 RWHP on E-60

And possibly 850 RWHP on Race gas.

Ted.

SLO-GOAT219 · 03-26-2018, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DapperDan

Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING View Post
You can get to about 660 RWHP on E-60 with the LT-4 in tank, high pressure and injectors, about 750 on race gas.

With a cam the LT-4 stuff will carry you to 750 RWHP on E-60

And possibly 850 RWHP on Race gas.

Ted.

What does RPM use to make 900-1000whp on there procharged lt4 cars with e50?

I've seen in there vids they install what looks like a new low pressure pump with new lines and filter going up front. My guess is they still use lt4 high press pump and injectors

Maybe they are using meth too? Not sure

tireslayer0331 · 03-26-2018, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DapperDan

Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING View Post
You can get to about 660 RWHP on E-60 with the LT-4 in tank, high pressure and injectors, about 750 on race gas.

With a cam the LT-4 stuff will carry you to 750 RWHP on E-60

And possibly 850 RWHP on Race gas.

Ted.

Thanks for finding that!

SSnakeEater · 03-26-2018, 07:33 PM

I am having a whipple installed along with a DSX aux pump and LT4 injectors this week. I will keep everyone posted with my dyno results along with the max ethanol % I can safely run.

tireslayer0331 · 03-26-2018, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLO-GOAT219

What does RPM use to make 900-1000whp on there procharged lt4 cars with e50?

I've seen in there vids they install what looks like a new low pressure pump with new lines and filter going up front. My guess is they still use lt4 high press pump and injectors

Maybe they are using meth too? Not sure

I know RPM does use meth. Their stage 5 package for their z06 uses it according to their site. Hope we are taking about the same RPM here!

https://race-proven-motorsports.mysh...tage-5-package

I wouldn't be opposed to having 2 maps loaded on my ngauge, one weekend blast/track map running more aggressive timing with meth and a pump gas map, does anyone here do that? I drive my car a lot(pretty much daily driven) so running meth all the time isn't appealing to me. The cooler IATs from meth would definitely make me happy.

tireslayer0331 · 03-26-2018, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSnakeEater

I am having a whipple installed along with a DSX aux pump and LT4 injectors this week. I will keep everyone posted with my dyno results along with the max ethanol % I can safely run.

Thanks! I'm excited to see everyone's results!

03-26-2018, 10:47 AM	#1
tireslayer0331 Drives: 2016 2SS Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: NYC/CT Posts: 85	Fueling Component Limit Question I currently have a D1SC pushing 10lbs of boost making 591whp and my only fueling upgrade is the LT4 HPFP, I have LT4 injectors ready to install but didn't need them yet. I don't want to push more boost until I build my motor and add a cam in the very distant future, however I am interested in running full e85 if possible. Does anyone know how much power the LT4 HPFP and LT4 injectors can push on a stock LT1 cam and e85? I was thinking of running an aux pump from the rear(lowside wouldnt be an issue) and installing a flex fuel sensor, I feel like the HPFP and stock cam lobe would be the limiting factor in this setup. If anyone has any experience with this setup I'd love to hear how it went. I hope my question makes sense. Less text version: What is the limit on e85 before running out of fuel people have seen with -LT4 HPFP -LT4 Injectors -Stock Cam -Low pressure Fuel System upgraded __________________ 2016 Camaro SS- , D1SC, 4.38" pulley, LT4 HPFP

03-26-2018, 01:56 PM	#3
JFM-jr Drives: 2016 Camaro 2SS Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Suffolk Long Island Posts: 954	Do not rely soley on LT4 number to compare. The LT4 camshaft has a slightly larger fuel lobe than the LT1 (5.7 vs 6.0) so even an LT4 high side pump on an LT1 will not be driven by the cam as hard. Not sure how much of a difference is makes but there is a difference. __________________ 2016 Hyper Blue 2SS A8,NPP,Moonroof Pray ported factory intake manifold Ported TB Rotofab ARH 1 7/8 longtubes hi flow cats AFM deleted E85 11.0@124.9 11.65@118.8 pump gas,stock tune/exhaust New combo: Pray Performance Heads/cam MSD intake manifold and Circle D 3C 554/491 on E85 all work & tuning done by Pray

03-26-2018, 04:16 PM	#5
JFM-jr Drives: 2016 Camaro 2SS Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Suffolk Long Island Posts: 954	Jannetty has a Hellion car it is currently doing some testing on. It has a full LT4 fuel system with a JMS voltage booster. They made an E50 pull last week and ran out of fuel at at 4500 RPM 700trq so he aborted the run. He was going to try pulls on E50 with less boost it seems like if anyone is going to have a good idea of what this fuel setup he is running is worth its gonna be on this car. We need to remember its a turbo build so simikar rear wheel numbers on a blower car woukd need more fuel due to parasitic losses vs these turbos. Im currently on the fence waiting to see if this LT4 system with a voltage booster will get me in the 575-600 territory on say E70ish. __________________ 2016 Hyper Blue 2SS A8,NPP,Moonroof Pray ported factory intake manifold Ported TB Rotofab ARH 1 7/8 longtubes hi flow cats AFM deleted E85 11.0@124.9 11.65@118.8 pump gas,stock tune/exhaust New combo: Pray Performance Heads/cam MSD intake manifold and Circle D 3C 554/491 on E85 all work & tuning done by Pray

03-26-2018, 06:46 PM	#7
tireslayer0331 Drives: 2016 2SS Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: NYC/CT Posts: 85	Thanks for the responses guys. Maybe I'll check some c7 vette forums and see how far people pushed their z06 HPFPs on e85 before they ran out. I just want to know how far this stock cam can go for fueling. Ted probably would know, if I don't get a response here I may as on his Q and A thread. __________________ 2016 Camaro SS- , D1SC, 4.38" pulley, LT4 HPFP

03-26-2018, 06:56 PM	#9
DapperDan Drives: 2017 1SS A8 Nightfall Gray Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Maryland Posts: 333	Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING View Post You can get to about 660 RWHP on E-60 with the LT-4 in tank, high pressure and injectors, about 750 on race gas. With a cam the LT-4 stuff will carry you to 750 RWHP on E-60 And possibly 850 RWHP on Race gas. Ted. __________________

03-26-2018, 01:31 PM	#2
boostednut Drives: Nothing cool atm Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: California Posts: 138	The zl1 guys are mid 600whp range on stock lt4 pump/injectors on e85, but I'm not sure how many of them are doing that on stock fuel pump lobe. I'd be willing to bet though that you could hit "600whp" on a dynojet on stock lt4 stuff without the lobe. This is a good question to ask your tuner. Another thing to remember is that you get most of your benefits from ethanol running like 50% ethanol. So that can tremendously extend the hp of your fuel system. Another thing to keep in mind is that you can also add pure meth ontop if you really need to extend power a bit further/give a bit fatter mixture for safety.

03-26-2018, 05:50 PM	#6
Epx998 \|Engineer\| Drives: 2016 Camaro SS Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 402	I am getting the LT4 fuel upgrades (and flex sensor) so I can run e85 on my Magnuson install. If no one replies, i'll post my numbers when I get them in a couple weeks.

03-26-2018, 07:33 PM	#12
SSnakeEater Drives: 2016 Camaro 2SS Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Santa Clara CA Posts: 89	I am having a whipple installed along with a DSX aux pump and LT4 injectors this week. I will keep everyone posted with my dyno results along with the max ethanol % I can safely run.

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