[SpeedIsLife]

I just spent the last hour lurking over on Mustang6G and I'm not seeing where people there or on SVTPerformance ever expected the PP1 to beat the 1LE, or were saying it was going to dominate the Camaro.

Furthermore I don't see where the Mustang trolls here were saying that.

Frankly it looks more like it was false accusations of Camaro fans here to needlessly tarnish the Mustang folks..which they do enough already themselves.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Legitimate question here. If the Ford guys and the Mustang enthusiasts never expected the PP1 to beat the SS, why do they all get soo worked up about it losing? LOL! I swear, they get pissed off but then they keep saying it isn't a direct or fair comparison. It's like they tell themselves that bullshit but deep down they really were hoping for a GT win...and got super disappointed when it lost.

Personally, using myself as an example, I fully expect the ZL1 to lose to the GT500. I don't even hope it will win because there is no way it should. So when it loses, I won't be sore about it at all. The PP2 vs the SS 1LE, I think that could go either way with the advantage going to the SS. It will be interesting. But I would not be surprised if the GT PP2 wins. Nor will I be disappointed. But these GT guys all claim that they never expected a win but they actually did. It is funny really.

See below

Originally Posted by newmoon

Why bother I think we know the 18 PP1 will not run with the 1LE on a track, maybe straight line. Wait for the PP2 then run them off.

Originally Posted by SS 1LE

Yeah odd, a PP1 would have been a good car to put up with a regular SS.

I just hope they do M6 to M6 tests...

After that this thread quickly derailed into 1/4 times GT350 and PP2 talk. I really don't think anyone in here ever thought the PP1 was going to hang with the 1LE.

Here is some of the first posts on 6G when the head to head was about to drop.

Originally Posted by steph93lx

Against the 1le they should have wait for the PP2.

Originally Posted by nastang87xx

Well to be fair, the 1LE is the only performance level upgrade from the base V8 car that actually explicitly spells that out. The GT Performance Pack is single level up from the V8 base car. They kinda do meet right face to face.

MSRC, MagneRide
Brake upgrade, Brake upgrade
Tire upgrade, Tire upgrade

I still think the 1LE will have the edge though. The Alpha is just a better chassis...sorry.

Originally Posted by Mazman

I think the 1LE will have no problem at all beating the GT on the track.

No one expected the PP1 to beat the 1LE. Blaq you seem to to be the only one who keeps saying Mustang boys thought it was going to be close or better than the 1LE. Now I am sure some expected it to be better than it was, and might be dissappointed in that, but I don't think there is anyone that thought the PP1 had a chance. I think your just looking to argue lol

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

I just spent the last hour lurking over on Mustang6G and I'm not seeing where people there or on SVTPerformance ever expected the PP1 to beat the 1LE, or were saying it was going to dominate the Camaro.

Furthermore I don't see where the Mustang trolls here were saying that.

Frankly it looks more like it was false accusations of Camaro fans here to needlessly tarnish the Mustang folks..which they do enough already themselves.

Hell this site and 6G are the only forums I frequent that are even talking about this test.

[kttxz06]

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

I just spent the last hour lurking over on Mustang6G and I'm not seeing where people there or on SVTPerformance ever expected the PP1 to beat the 1LE, or were saying it was going to dominate the Camaro.

Furthermore I don't see where the Mustang trolls here were saying that.

Frankly it looks more like it was false accusations of Camaro fans here to needlessly tarnish the Mustang folks..which they do enough already themselves.

Been on YouTube lately? I'd start there. And it's prob cus the mods cleaned it up. But the hate is real over there in Mustang land. When they started saying a '18 GT with tune, tire, and fuel will mash a Zl1, I think that was what put them over the top. Obviously, they've been shut up on that front, but it still goes on over there. Alot actually. They take one super hero run and think the GT is a 11 sec out the box car.

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by whiteboyblues2001

The question I have about those times is: was that 1/4 mile done on the dry lake bed, or on asphalt? I doubt they could get 4.1 and 4.4 0-60 on dirt, so I am guessing it was done on asphalt.

Given the amount of 1/4 mile racing these two cars have done in their heritage, I think I would have liked to see them elaborate a bit on how the cars did in the 1/4 (even though I am not a 1/4 mile kind of guy). They kind of just glossed over that part.

non prepped tracks and stock psi. is why times are slower.

[SpeedIsLife]

Originally Posted by kttxz06

Been on YouTube lately? I'd start there. And it's prob cus the mods cleaned it up. But the hate is real over there in Mustang land. When they started saying a '18 GT with tune, tire, and fuel will mash a Zl1, I think that was what put them over the top. Obviously, they've been shut up on that front, but it still goes on over there. Alot actually. They take one super hero run and think the GT is a 11 sec out the box car.

I don't pay attention to youtube in any capacity, it's nowhere near what I would consider an automotive enthusiasts website.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by newmoon

I for one thought that the GT would have done better in the 1/4 because I thought the SS sporting 450+hp and a lower chassis weight wasn't very impressive with 12:50-12:60 times. Turns out the manual GT is even a bigger dog in the 1/4 mile than the SS is.

Correction, the SS has done a 12.4 in testing...and I think it even did a 12.3 in another test.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by shaffe

See below





After that this thread quickly derailed into 1/4 times GT350 and PP2 talk. I really don't think anyone in here ever thought the PP1 was going to hang with the 1LE.

Here is some of the first posts on 6G when the head to head was about to drop.







No one expected the PP1 to beat the 1LE. Blaq you seem to to be the only one who keeps saying Mustang boys thought it was going to be close or better than the 1LE. Now I am sure some expected it to be better than it was, and might be dissappointed in that, but I don't think there is anyone that thought the PP1 had a chance. I think your just looking to argue lol



Hell this site and 6G are the only forums I frequent that are even talking about this test.

There were plenty people on YT videos and FB pages/groups making some pretty dramatic claims. I lumped them all in the same pot because a lot of them came from M6G and other forums. Heck we had SSFriendly making bold claims that a GT with a tire and tune would beat ZL1s. Plus, like kttxz06 said, a lot of threads here got shut down, a lot of posts got erased/deleted by mods, a lot of trolls edited their posts, etc. I'm betting the same thing happened over on their forums. You picked a handful of people who were rational and said the GT PP1 would not beat the SS. But there are tons more who said it would.

Plus the point of my post was that even among those who said the GT PP1 would not win, there certainly was a sense of hope that it would win. They took that loss very deeply. If it didn't matter and if they expected it to lose then they would have had no problem with the loss. A lot of those guys sat here and argued with me up and down when I predicted what the GT would run. They honestly thought it was going to do high 11s to low 12s. The videos by Lund and Evans and everyone else did nothing but fuel their stupidity. They came over here in groups...like, 1 new member a day damn near, all just to announce that the GT was going to beat the SS. Remember all those accounts that got suspended?

You can certainly say that this is all something I made up. It doesn't matter to me. But even if they expected it to lose I doubt they expected it to get slaughtered in such a fantastic fashion. The loss was soo evident that the PP2 will have to make some serious strides above the PP1.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

There were plenty people on YT videos and FB pages/groups making some pretty dramatic claims. I lumped them all in the same pot because a lot of them came from M6G and other forums. Heck we had SSFriendly making bold claims that a GT with a tire and tune would beat ZL1s. Plus, like kttxz06 said, a lot of threads here got shut down, a lot of posts got erased/deleted by mods, a lot of trolls edited their posts, etc. I'm betting the same thing happened over on their forums. You picked a handful of people who were rational and said the GT PP1 would not beat the SS. But there are tons more who said it would.

Plus the point of my post was that even among those who said the GT PP1 would not win, there certainly was a sense of hope that it would win. They took that loss very deeply. If it didn't matter and if they expected it to lose then they would have had no problem with the loss. A lot of those guys sat here and argued with me up and down when I predicted what the GT would run. They honestly thought it was going to do high 11s to low 12s. The videos by Lund and Evans and everyone else did nothing but fuel their stupidity. They came over here in groups...like, 1 new member a day damn near, all just to announce that the GT was going to beat the SS. Remember all those accounts that got suspended?

You can certainly say that this is all something I made up. It doesn't matter to me. But even if they expected it to lose I doubt they expected it to get slaughtered in such a fantastic fashion. The loss was soo evident that the PP2 will have to make some serious strides above the PP1.

LOL Youtube comments and FB comments are the same people that believe a K&N Filter will get them 25HP. From what I have seen on the forums, I don't think anyone expected the PP1 to beat the 1LE. I posted examples, you say there are tons lets see'em. Here are a few more

Originally Posted by fkscreennames

The 1LE is a ****ing monster. Not shocked at all it beat the shit out of the PP1 Mustang.

Originally Posted by morgande

The Camaro won every performance test. Its recorded better figure 8, better 0-60, better 1/4 mile time. It 'walked' the GT at Streets of Willow...Better than 3 seconds. The Camaro 1LE is as good as always was. As a performance metric this should come as no surprise...the Alpha Chasis was made to do exactly what this Camaro did. Sport car performance period.

While I still say the GT is the more comfortable and livable of the two, and they hinted as such...the Camaro is better performer. It won and it should have won because it has the numbers. Too much 'GT' in the GT.

Originally Posted by thill444

The 1LE has more areo and larger/heavier wheel/tire combo. I suspect this will impact the 1 mile run. A GT with PP2 will likely be slower in a 1 mile run to the PP1 for similar reasons.

I was not surprised by any of this. The Camaro 1LE is a more track focused car. I am sure the PP2 will fare better but for the majority of people choosing between these cars you are splitting hairs in terms of straightline speed and if you don't track the car much it comes down to the other intagibles.

I don't own a Mustang or Camaro but I think the Mustang is a far better looking car and a more functional daily driver. It's unfortunate that with that chasis GM did not change the styling more for the 6th gen and improve the poor visibility and claustraphobic cabin.

These are all from Mustang land, where we all have seen some really out there "reasons" they have come up with. Where people get bashed for praising Camaro, Still haven't seen 1 person that expected the PP1 to beat the 1LE.




Yes some of the 1/4 claims you nailed some people got quite excited about those and some were downright silly.

[DevilsReject97]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

There were plenty people on YT videos and FB pages/groups making some pretty dramatic claims. I lumped them all in the same pot because a lot of them came from M6G and other forums. Heck we had SSFriendly making bold claims that a GT with a tire and tune would beat ZL1s. Plus, like kttxz06 said, a lot of threads here got shut down, a lot of posts got erased/deleted by mods, a lot of trolls edited their posts, etc. I'm betting the same thing happened over on their forums. You picked a handful of people who were rational and said the GT PP1 would not beat the SS. But there are tons more who said it would.

Plus the point of my post was that even among those who said the GT PP1 would not win, there certainly was a sense of hope that it would win. They took that loss very deeply. If it didn't matter and if they expected it to lose then they would have had no problem with the loss. A lot of those guys sat here and argued with me up and down when I predicted what the GT would run. They honestly thought it was going to do high 11s to low 12s. The videos by Lund and Evans and everyone else did nothing but fuel their stupidity. They came over here in groups...like, 1 new member a day damn near, all just to announce that the GT was going to beat the SS. Remember all those accounts that got suspended?

You can certainly say that this is all something I made up. It doesn't matter to me. But even if they expected it to lose I doubt they expected it to get slaughtered in such a fantastic fashion. The loss was soo evident that the PP2 will have to make some serious strides above the PP1.

Just in the last month, I know of two threads that were essentially closed over the Camaro vs. Mustang bit....and several posts/new users have been tossed. Additionally, there were tons of people who piped up with like 2-10 posts, all about Mustangs....or accounts that had been dormant for 3-4 years all of a sudden posting about Mustang, Mustang, Mustang...

We can all easily agree there are idiots in both crowds, but this particular release of the new A10 Mustang really stirred up a lot of people. I certainly do appreciate the more, calmer heads who love their vehicles, regardless of what it is. Some good-hearted ribbing, back n forth convos are always welcome....but some people just can't let it go...even when it's on our side too..

[DevilsReject97]

Originally Posted by shaffe

What is it with people and their whole "poor visibility/claustrophobic" cabin nonsense? I don't get it... I never will understand it.

I'm 6'2" and a half, and with my shoe size, I wind up sitting as a man would who is about 6'6". My seat is all the way back, all the way down for the most part. I have zero issues seeing or feeling claustrophobic. I've owned a 5th gen Camaro. I currently own a 6th Gen Camaro. I've test driven every major muscle car on the market save the Demon.... all of them have the same quirks in terms of visibility.

The Challenger is a much bigger car, even than the 5th gen Camaro. It still has bad blind spots. The Mustang is very similar to the Camaro. Yes, it has a slightly larger front windshield area and slightly taller cabin, but otherwise, it's the same feeling...but I'd also argue that the Mustang is more narrow inside imo...

The difference in vehicle height is roughly 1.5" of height. That's nothing....the vehicles are roughly the same width....the Mustang is 3" shorter in length...

[Zeke.Malvo]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

The main thing that influences your opinion of me is the negative things I've said about the Mustang. That is what burns you up. Even tho I also gave the Mustang more compliments than probably anyone else here. Look, you don't have to like me. I don't care if you do or don't. But don't sit here lying and acting like I said anything that wasn't true. I gave the Mustang credit where it was due. And I shitted on it where it sucked. Find me one post where I said anything about the performance of any of the Mustangs that was untrue. The problem is that you just can't take reading it the way I write it. It just burns you up.

Yea? Like you did here (see below)

You really proved me wrong there...

That was the only intelligent thing you've said here.

Not even close, quite the opposite actually. You are not good at posting convincing arguments, your posts crack me up! You're a clown! 🤡

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[zx9rmal]

Originally Posted by crankaholic

there's a huge difference in how a DCT feels compared to an auto, even a good ZF 8-speed implementation. The shifts are mechanical and you feel and hear it working... it's incredibly quick. I guess a good motorcycle transmission with a quickshifter is the closest thing.

Exactly my experience. My previous GTI's had the DSG (DCT) gearbox. It literally was a clutchless manual. Instantaneous shifts. I've had bikes with quickshifters, and, yes, it's like that.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by DevilsReject97

What is it with people and their whole "poor visibility/claustrophobic" cabin nonsense? I don't get it... I never will understand it.

.

First impressions can go a long way. That was my first impressions first time I got to sit in a 6th gen was damn it's tight in here and how the hell do you see out of it. I'll admit, I would probably need to drive one for a day or so to really give a 100% honest opinion but from just sitting in one my personal opinion as a 5'10 slightly round fellow, its small on the inside.

also

How's that saying go, "If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck quacks like a duck it must be a duck?" People on this forum admit the car has bad/poor visibility, most of the automotive forum community says it has bad visibility and every review mentions the visibility is bad. Hell AL O himself even acknowleged its bad, but when designing the car didn't want to sacrifice styling to improve it

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by shaffe

First impressions can go a long way. That was my first impressions first time I got to sit in a 6th gen was damn it's tight in here and how the hell do you see out of it. I'll admit, I would probably need to drive one for a day or so to really give a 100% honest opinion but from just sitting in one my personal opinion as a 5'10 slightly round fellow, its small on the inside.

also

How's that saying go, "If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck quacks like a duck it must be a duck?" People on this forum admit the car has bad/poor visibility, most of the automotive forum community says it has bad visibility and every review mentions the visibility is bad

Relative to other cars, it is bad. Nothing that a person that knows how to drive and how to set their mirrors will ever notice though. I am not talking about the cabin experience here, that is valid and each person has their own justifiable opinion.

Having a cramped feeling, and being dangerous are not the same though. When fanboys want to bash the Camaro, they say its visibility is a liability when in reality their driving habits are the liability if they struggle that much driving the car.