[JK001]

New H2H has a teaser at the very end showing a future H2H between what appears to be the new mustang GT and a SS 1LE
https://youtu.be/mtsmVu2ufVY

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

On dirt...



All that money went to the trans and engine upgrades...which sucks for those who bought the manual trans. But see, now those twerps over there know why the SS was more expensive. Performance costs money no matter how you slice it. The GT was cheap as shit because it offered shit performance. And like I said before, people who couldn't afford a better car were able to scrape money together for a base GT which Ford was throwing away at people. Now they're paying SS prices but not getting SS performance which should make abundantly clear that the price of the SS was justified all along.

Agreed, but in my eyes Chevy still does it better and offers more for the $.

I think this is possible due in part to the alpha. I am not sure why some Mustang guys refuse to admit how superior the alpha is to the S550. JUST to get possible 1LE performance numbers, you have to all but compromise the street-able nature of the car by throwing 305 Cup 2's on it. The PP2 will NOT be DD friendly like the 1LE is, and it will NOT be faster on the track. Hell, it wont even be as track friendly as it has NO COOLERS!

But, surely it is cheaper due to these obvious short comings right? Nope, same freackin price!!!

You have to be looking through tinted glasses to defend the S550 at this price point. The 15-17 was cheaper and better looking. '18 at a higher price is a fail in my eyes as they have failed to fix the issues, based on the reviews we have gotten so far anyway. Slopping steering feel, no thanks. Not acceptable at this stage in the game! It's 2018!

This is nothing new either. I remember when I would drive my brothers 94 GT back in the day, it was like driving a Lincoln Continental. Guess, they like that numbness. They were buying them as fast as they could make them in 15-17.

[Chadicus]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

On dirt...



All that money went to the trans and engine upgrades...which sucks for those who bought the manual trans. But see, now those twerps over there know why the SS was more expensive. Performance costs money no matter how you slice it. The GT was cheap as shit because it offered shit performance. And like I said before, people who couldn't afford a better car were able to scrape money together for a base GT which Ford was throwing away at people. Now they're paying SS prices but not getting SS performance which should make abundantly clear that the price of the SS was justified all along.

There are two things that come to my mind when seeing the results of this H2H. One, we knew what the outcome would be before they started. There was no way a PP1 could compete with a 1LE around a track. The PP1 still can't equal an SS around the track so we knew this would happen.

Secondly the 1/4 and 0-60 performance for the PP1 is underwhelming. It did not match the 1LE and it did not match the SS previously tested. Three times the 18 GT has been found slower than the Camaro at everything. The dirt 1 mile race is funny because the Mustang crossed right at it's limiter. 157. LOL so after the 1 mile dirt race the SS and SS 1LE are still faster.

What I would find more concerning than the numbers is the comments they made about the steering being a mess and sitting on phone books on a waterbed and the rear end of that thing jumping around like grandpa does after a night of bad Thai food. If I owned one I could fix the lower acceleration numbers. I could fix the bad handling and the twitchy rear-end. But not sure I could fix the "mess" that is the steering. And for the price of my SS I don't want to have to do Ford's job and fix any of these problems much less fix them all.

That is the real issue with the 18 MY GT. Camaro price but not Camaro performance. The Mustang sold well because it was cheap and easy to mod. Now it isn't cheap and while still easy to mod it just isn't cost effective anymore.

For the record, I don't think the Bullitt will fare much better. It might MIGHT match the SS M6 in a 1/4. Maybe. (at a Corvette Stingray price of course)

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

So if, IF, the GT PeePee #2 (see what I did there?) beats the SS, then that is a shallow as hell victory seeing as how the SS has been unchanged since 2016 while the GT has been tweaked, retweaked, and re-re-tweaked. Considering that the S550 is almost done I mean it took them all this time to beat the SS?? LOL! How many refreshes and upgrades and changes does it take for a GT to beat a SS? .

If you want to be technical its 1 refresh, which included all the upgrades lol. Now we must wait and see how the PP2 fairs.

[MrImSoFly]

Watched the head to head and honestly I am surprised at how large a margin of victory the Camaro got. Ford had several years to improve the mustang, and after countless upgrades (including a hefty price tag) it still lacks in the performance the 1LE brings. If they do another H2H and mustang wins with PP2 it will only show that you would have to spend 50k+ just to compete with the camaro.

[whiteboyblues2001]

What I don't understand is with how well the GT350 is set up in terms of suspension and handling, how can Ford mess this refresh up so bad? There really is no excuse for it to be that much of a bucking bronco going down a windy road or on the track. They can't use the excuse that they want more of a grand tourer and therefore want the suspension soft anymore. They can make the Mustang handle better and have more communicative steering without being too harsh. Many cars already do that. AND THEN, if you add the fact that they are using Magnetic Ride control... Come on!

I guess I expected too much, but with the lessons learned from building a GT350 and being able to use MRC, I thought it would turn out to make huge improvements in handling so it would be close to the Camaro. But this isn't anywhere near close. It's a fail (the handling that is, other things about the car are great).

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by whiteboyblues2001

What I don't understand is with how well the GT350 is set up in terms of suspension and handling, how can Ford mess this refresh up so bad? There really is no excuse for it to be that much of a bucking bronco going down a windy road or on the track. They can't use the excuse that they want more of a grand tourer and therefore want the suspension soft anymore. They can make the Mustang handle better and have more communicative steering without being too harsh. Many cars already do that. AND THEN, if you add the fact that they are using Magnetic Ride control... Come on!

I guess I expected too much, but with the lessons learned from building a GT350 and being able to use MRC, I thought it would turn out to make huge improvements in handling so it would be close to the Camaro. But this isn't anywhere near close. It's a fail (the handling that is, other things about the car are great).

I haven't seen the video but from the comments here that is disappointing to say the least. People praised how the 350, how could the F it up this bad seemingly on the GT.

[FastCarFanBoy]

I'm curious about the steering issue. The S197 never had steering issues that I'm aware of. Iirc it got praise for excellent turn in and feel. Seems odd that it would have gotten worse at this point.

[Chadicus]

Originally Posted by FastCarFanBoy

I'm curious about the steering issue. The S197 never had steering issues that I'm aware of. Iirc it got praise for excellent turn in and feel. Seems odd that it would have gotten worse at this point.

Seems odd the entire car got worse but it did. I almost immediately wanted my S197 back after getting the 15 S550. Ford has something wrong in that chassis somewhere. Makes no sense that the steering has been an issue for 4 years now.

[Spartan268]

Originally Posted by whiteboyblues2001

What I don't understand is with how well the GT350 is set up in terms of suspension and handling, how can Ford mess this refresh up so bad? There really is no excuse for it to be that much of a bucking bronco going down a windy road or on the track. They can't use the excuse that they want more of a grand tourer and therefore want the suspension soft anymore. They can make the Mustang handle better and have more communicative steering without being too harsh. Many cars already do that. AND THEN, if you add the fact that they are using Magnetic Ride control... Come on!

I guess I expected too much, but with the lessons learned from building a GT350 and being able to use MRC, I thought it would turn out to make huge improvements in handling so it would be close to the Camaro. But this isn't anywhere near close. It's a fail (the handling that is, other things about the car are great).

GT350 is supposed to be the track halo car for the Ford camp. If the regular GT knocks it off it's pedestal or even match it there will be a lot of backlash.

[drew peacock]

so the camaro wipes the floor with that pos s550 lol..awesome news

[R.C. Collins]

Originally Posted by shaffe

If you want to be technical its 1 refresh, which included all the upgrades lol. Now we must wait and see how the PP2 fairs.

We don't even have to wait. 90 miles from where my 1LE is parked is Galpin Ford. According to M6G they have a PP2 optioned Mustang GT on the lot. Apparently a few dealer-ordered cars have made the journey.



Someone go buy it, and i'll pony up my 1LE for a H2H this weekend!

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by R.C. Collins

We don't even have to wait. 90 miles from where my 1LE is parked is Galpin Ford. According to M6G they have a PP2 optioned Mustang GT on the lot. Apparently a few dealer-ordered cars have made the journey.



Someone go buy it, and i'll pony up my 1LE for a H2H this weekend!

LOL, $50K for a non-GT350 Mustang? Hell no!

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by ST1LE

LOL, $50K for a non-GT350 Mustang? Hell no!

A 2SS 1LE will be right in the same ball park

That PP2 looks damn good IMO.