To the left, always to the left... - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

rjsmith1973 · 04-07-2014, 10:51 PM

This is probably a n00b question, but after having all kinds of suspension reinforcement/bushings mods done to stabilize the rear, why does it still step out to the left when punched from a standing start (or whenever else it loses traction)? Doesn't matter the surface, or conditions.

What needs to be done to keep things in-line?

GFORCE1320 · 04-08-2014, 07:43 AM

Have you had a good alignment done after all the bushings were installed?

*The_Blur* · 04-08-2014, 07:49 AM

Your driveshaft rotates, transferring the energy of your engine to the driveline. When you slam the gas, there will always be a tendency to turn due to torque being transferred. In aircraft, it's called P-factor due to the left-turning tendency of propellers.

There's a much more involved explanation, and this is oversimplified, but you wouldn't want to read it.

rjsmith1973 · 04-08-2014, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Blur

Your driveshaft rotates, transferring the energy of your engine to the driveline. When you slam the gas, there will always be a tendency to turn due to torque being transferred. In aircraft, it's called P-factor due to the left-turning tendency of propellers.

There's a much more involved explanation, and this is oversimplified, but you wouldn't want to read it.

At least not on a message board. Been a while since college... Is there anything that can be done to more equally distribute the torque transfer? Aside from a helicopter style rear propeller...

P.S. The car is properly aligned.

*The_Blur* · 04-08-2014, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjsmith1973

At least not on a message board. Been a while since college... Is there anything that can be done to more equally distribute the torque transfer? Aside from a helicopter style rear propeller...

P.S. The car is properly aligned.

It is transferring properly. It's a matter of design. Unless you can figure out a better way to get power to the tires, you're going to have some sort of lateral force.

By nature, torque will go 90 degrees from the initial mechanical force, so I guess you could try installing your engine sideways.

Check out some YouTube videos of drag racers. There's always lateral movement off the line.

MikeOD · 04-08-2014, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjsmith1973

At least not on a message board. Been a while since college... Is there anything that can be done to more equally distribute the torque transfer? Aside from a helicopter style rear propeller...

P.S. The car is properly aligned.

Turn the engine block 90 degrees and make it a front wheel drive car. You can't change physics.

Steve@SNL/Monster Clutch · 04-08-2014, 02:58 PM

Put some better tires on to keep from spinning

DSX_Camaro · 04-08-2014, 04:00 PM

Does the rear end go to the left? I'm clearly misunderstanding something because the front should head left and the rear should head right, all else equal and (for simplicities sake) not moving forward.

Bo White · 04-08-2014, 04:28 PM

This is why airplanes and boats with 2 or more props have them spinning in opposite directions.

2SSCAMARO · 04-08-2014, 05:39 PM

Have you gone on a dry road and laid down some rubber to see if both wheels are spinning equally? If you have a stock differential and has excessive wear, you could be experiencing "one wheel peel".

*The_Blur* · 04-08-2014, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bo White

This is why airplanes and boats with 2 or more props have them spinning in opposite directions.

That's not always true. It depends on the amount of induced drag that would produce. Having propellers go against one another may cause turbulence, but it would depend on the aerodynamics of the aircraft.

Bo White · 04-08-2014, 07:59 PM

That's just the in general reason. It was explained to me by someone you may know that's going to return to Pensacola area in June.

Mean Green Z28 · 04-08-2014, 08:11 PM

What do your alignment specs look like? Im guessing your rear wheels are a bit toe'd out on the left than on the right.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

rjsmith1973 · 04-08-2014, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DSX_Camaro

Does the rear end go to the left? I'm clearly misunderstanding something because the front should head left and the rear should head right, all else equal and (for simplicities sake) not moving forward.

Rear end goes left. The only good (?) news is that it is predictable.

I'll find a safe place to lay down some rubber and see whether only one wheel is spinning.

I recall seeing a photo a while back that seemed to show our axle shafts were different diameters, could this contribute to the imbalance as if one were smaller than the other, it should start spinning slightly sooner due to less inertia...

04-07-2014, 10:51 PM	#1
rjsmith1973 Drives: Aqua Blue 2SS/RS Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Saratoga Springs, UT Posts: 119	To the left, always to the left... This is probably a n00b question, but after having all kinds of suspension reinforcement/bushings mods done to stabilize the rear, why does it still step out to the left when punched from a standing start (or whenever else it loses traction)? Doesn't matter the surface, or conditions. What needs to be done to keep things in-line?

04-08-2014, 07:49 AM	#3
The_Blur Moderator Drives: 2018 Harley-Davidson Street Bob Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: San Diego Posts: 14,769	Your driveshaft rotates, transferring the energy of your engine to the driveline. When you slam the gas, there will always be a tendency to turn due to torque being transferred. In aircraft, it's called P-factor due to the left-turning tendency of propellers. There's a much more involved explanation, and this is oversimplified, but you wouldn't want to read it. __________________ RDP Motorsport//GEN5DIY//Cultrag Performance//JPSS//Rodgets Chevrolet// Operation Demon//Buy at Invoice//RACECARWEAR RESPECT ALL CARS. LOVE YOUR OWN. warn 145:159 ban

04-08-2014, 04:00 PM	#8
DSX_Camaro Drives: 2013 SW 2LT/RS LFX/AY6 Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 1,741	Does the rear end go to the left? I'm clearly misunderstanding something because the front should head left and the rear should head right, all else equal and (for simplicities sake) not moving forward. __________________ K&N CAI, 1LE Strut Tower Brace, Elite Engineering Catch Can and Clean Side Separator, Apex Scoop w/ Washer Relocation Kit, CTS Front Calipers and Rotors, JacFab Ported Intake Manifold, JacFab Intake Manifold Spacer, 80mm Overkill Throttle Body, SS Brake Lines, Ideal Garage Master Cylinder, Monster Twin Disc Clutch, NPP Retrofit w/ Magnaflow Resonated X, ARH Catless Downpipes, JRE Built 3.45 Diff, 1LE Axles, 1LE Hubs, Overkill Tuned, BMR Anti Wheel-hop Kit Stage I, ACS TL1 Hood Insert, ZL1 Spoiler

04-08-2014, 04:28 PM	#9
Bo White Drives: 2015 Summit White 2SS 1LE Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Vance Alabama Posts: 8,021	This is why airplanes and boats with 2 or more props have them spinning in opposite directions. __________________ Retired wanna be cylinder head porter 2015 2SS 1LE Clutch reservoir, Vararam DRX, ported TB, TSP 2" headers, MGW shifter Totalled: 2010 1SS Wilkes Performance/Eagle 416 shortblock, TSP custom valvetrain, PRC 260 heads, Edelbrock Pro Flo 102, th400 swap, 8" PTC 5500 stall= 535/435 at the wheels tuned Gen 3 Performance and Dyno 10.97 @ 124 full weight in 3100 DA CamaroFest X

04-08-2014, 05:39 PM	#10
2SSCAMARO Drives: 2010 Camaro Auto Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Fl Posts: 1,164	Have you gone on a dry road and laid down some rubber to see if both wheels are spinning equally? If you have a stock differential and has excessive wear, you could be experiencing "one wheel peel". __________________ Just livin' life

04-08-2014, 07:43 AM	#2
GFORCE1320 Drives: 05 GTO Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Wichita, KS Posts: 1,243	Have you had a good alignment done after all the bushings were installed?

04-08-2014, 02:58 PM	#7
Steve@SNL/Monster Clutch Account Suspended Drives: 2014 SS Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Haslet, TX Posts: 744	Put some better tires on to keep from spinning

04-08-2014, 07:59 PM	#12
Bo White Drives: 2015 Summit White 2SS 1LE Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Vance Alabama Posts: 8,021	That's just the in general reason. It was explained to me by someone you may know that's going to return to Pensacola area in June. __________________ Retired wanna be cylinder head porter 2015 2SS 1LE Clutch reservoir, Vararam DRX, ported TB, TSP 2" headers, MGW shifter Totalled: 2010 1SS Wilkes Performance/Eagle 416 shortblock, TSP custom valvetrain, PRC 260 heads, Edelbrock Pro Flo 102, th400 swap, 8" PTC 5500 stall= 535/435 at the wheels tuned Gen 3 Performance and Dyno 10.97 @ 124 full weight in 3100 DA CamaroFest X

04-08-2014, 08:11 PM	#13
Mean Green Z28 Drives: 2010 2SS Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Annapolis, MD Posts: 941 View My Garage	What do your alignment specs look like? Im guessing your rear wheels are a bit toe'd out on the left than on the right. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk __________________ 2010 2SS - CAI Intake, ADM Scoop, RotoFab Washer relo. LT Headers and off-road pipes, X-pipe, Muffler Deletes, ZL1 Spoiler, Technostalgia Tail-lights '98 T/A (Sold) - Forged 6.0ltr, MS3, P&P'd Heads/Valves, 90MM FAST/TB, Headers, 3" Y-pipe, 4" Mufflex Catback. Koni Adjustables w/GC coilovers (550/175), Strano Sway Bars '94 Z28 (Sold) ... LS1 swap (basically same setup as the T/A), TH350/3500 stall ... swapped it all into the T/A -- >> Some of my Projects My Fquick Page