JBL p660c tweeter bad

[rotwiler]

Installed the JBL p660c about 2 weeks ago, sounded excellent, then a few days ago the drivers side tweeter started making a crunching sound at certain freq, I isolated it to just the drivers tweeter grrrr. I had the Kenwood components in for over 5 years and my amp gains were twice as high as now and never a issue. Could be just manufacturing issue, but contacting seller to see about replacement. If can't replace, will prob do another brand of tweeter. Lucky the door tweeters are super easy to replace, this is first time I ever had a tweeter go bad in 32+ years of installing car audio in my cars.

[Aaron0731]

What are re you pushing them with?

[rotwiler]

Kenwood XR4S, 150 watts RMS at 2 ohm x4 at 14v so should be around 120-130 at 12v,

[Snoman]

Originally Posted by rotwiler

Kenwood XR4S, 150 watts RMS at 2 ohm x4 at 14v so should be around 120-130 at 12v,

Even with an amp gain on 75%, you're over the 90wrms rating @ 12V power supply and the 5th gen typically runs ~13V.

Voice coils are fried.

P660C Manual

[rotwiler]

My gains are turned way down, to the point it takes 8 on volume just to get sound. Even at max volume listening doesn't get uncomfortable. Before I installed the jbls, the Kenwoods rated at same rms, the amp gains were almost max(is way previous owner had it set). Then it would get really loud and couldn't be listened to for very long up past 3/4 volume. I do like the mid bass from the jbls. I dont mind going with a higher power handling tweeter that matches the JBL crossover. Weird part, the separate JBL tweeter, same as one that comes with the p660c set specs when buying separate, says only 60 watts RMS.

[Aaron0731]

Originally Posted by rotwiler

My gains are turned way down, to the point it takes 8 on volume just to get sound. Even at max volume listening doesn't get uncomfortable. Before I installed the jbls, the Kenwoods rated at same rms, the amp gains were almost max(is way previous owner had it set). Then it would get really loud and couldn't be listened to for very long up past 3/4 volume. I do like the mid bass from the jbls. I dont mind going with a higher power handling tweeter that matches the JBL crossover. Weird part, the separate JBL tweeter, same as one that comes with the p660c set specs when buying separate, says only 60 watts RMS.

http://mobile.dudasite.com/site/thec..._id%3D329#2894

That is a good article on understanding what gain actually is and how to set it.

[rotwiler]

I turned down my gains down to limit power output, there is no way I am at max power at full volume. I did have amp set at 5v at first to match the hu 5v, but at max volume, was not loud enough for normal listening. My Durango infinity system with just a pioneer hu actually was louder. After I turned up gain some its better, but still at full volume, it isn't so loud I can't listen for extended periods of time and I am 50, so I don't listen really loud like when younger. I have read others with the p660c experience the same crunch sound at certain frequency, rare, but turned out being tweeter went out. Certain songs I dont hear the odd sound, is only on certain songs.

[jeffa]

Originally Posted by rotwiler

I turned down my gains down to limit power output, there is no way I am at max power at full volume. I did have amp set at 5v at first to match the hu 5v, but at max volume, was not loud enough for normal listening. My Durango infinity system with just a pioneer hu actually was louder. After I turned up gain some its better, but still at full volume, it isn't so loud I can't listen for extended periods of time and I am 50, so I don't listen really loud like when younger. I have read others with the p660c experience the same crunch sound at certain frequency, rare, but turned out being tweeter went out. Certain songs I dont hear the odd sound, is only on certain songs.

Amplifier gain controls do not limit the power output of the amp. They are designed to have the amplifier's input section match the output from the source unit. Gain controls are NOT volume controls. When the amp gain is set too high, clipping of the output signal will result, which usually will destroy speaker voice coils.

[beak81champ]

This^^^. I think Crutchfield also has a video or write up on this as well.

[rotwiler]

I read articles on gain control and seen where it says that gain doesn't increase volume, but where the volume comes in. But, if I set my gains on amp to 5v setting, the system is no louder than a stock oem system turned all the way up. Amp says ces 150watts x4 at 14.4v, so no way at full volume it should be so low volume. For sure amp never gets to max watts when gains are down. When I had the Kenwood components in they got really loud, to point was ear shattering, so I purposely set gains to keep best sq and at max volume just at my highest listening level that I can deal with for extended periods of time. I totally understand that gain sets the amp and hu to be at similar levels, but my hu is 5v if I set amp at 5v, sound is low at max volume(50), at 4v is better but still doesn't bother me at level 50 on volume. There is no way I am overpowering the speakers, I went total sq over loudness. The old Kenwoods, the gains were max, was crazy loud, but I didn't care for the mid bass much(just not enough punch). I have a 06 Dodge Durango with the 9 speaker infinity system, all I did is replace the navigation stock hu with a pioneer 3800bhs and it gets as loud as the SS the way I had the amps gains at first. So I can't be overpowering the p660c, I honestly think just one tweeter was defective, doesn't sound bad all the time, only at certain high freq and last few days been reading a few posts on different forums that had same issue. I know it doesn't mean they didn't blow speaker, but I was very cautious on how high i turned them up, for sure no clipping, and not even using amp to full potential. I only play my stereo when I am in car, at 50, I can't crank it up like the old days and rattle my brain, esp with highs. I also read could be channel going bad on amp, can test that this week. At same gain level, the Kenwood excelon 6x9s in rear deck have had zero issues since 2011. Even when gains were much higher. I talked to Amazon, seller I bought comps from used Amazon prime, so is not up to seller to fix any issues. Amazon, will refund me if I send back comps, or pay for repair, or refund me 35% of cost of set, so I chose the 35% refund. The money I get back, haven't decided, but may get Image Dynamics tweeters or CDT. Both are same price as refund or a few $ more. Found some TW-25 CDT for $49.95, no harware just tweeters which is fine. ID XS-28 or CTX-25 both under $80.

[Snoman]

Respectfully, the fact it previously worked only indicates you got lucky.

Voice coil wiring is extremely temperamental and while it is true you most likely were only powering the speakers less than 50wrms, there are peaks and short power bursts in all music at all frequency. A 15khz note for a 1/10th of a second peaking at 100 watts will, without question, fry any speaker not able to handle that length of a note. As the amperage flows through the wire, it heats up, the heat is unable to dissipate fast enough and the VC begins to break down (soften/melt), at this point the VC is far more susceptible to distortion and suddenly without any warning, the VC is fried.

100wpc rms is a massive amount of power for any tweeter and while many exist, most are not main stream manufactures, low quality or extremely expensive. One question I did not ask if if you put this speaker set on active amplification and powered all 4 speakers with 150w each, using the amplifier crossover? If so, there is a high risk of instantly frying the tweeter if crossed over below 3.5khz @ 12/db.

[rotwiler]

No, I didn't do active. I saw many claiming 100 watts RMS and no issues. Then I seen one say 20 watts RMS blew one. Trying to find another tweeter is near impossible since the p660c is old stock. Maybe those Kenwood comps and 6x9s weren't as bad as I thought, they handled huge power, but I do like the jbl mids better and sound deadening doors probably made them even better sounding. I looked at specs of the p660c's, the mid is 2 ohm, i used the supplied crossover, and the tweeter specs say 6ohm so what would that make overall impedance. I kept crossover set at 0db, other option was -6. If I could find a single p660 tweeter I would buy one, but no luck. So if jbl won't replace it, I will do ID or CDT tweeters. I am kind of lost at what to do if I did overpower them, was being so careful. I was even ready to turn up the gains some since max volume wasn't quite there. I do like the sound of the jbl tweeters, I used to feel irritated with with old kappa 62.7i's in my old 02 z28. These silk tweeters sound so much better to me. I am still listening to them, just can't listen to certain music, when hits that certain freq, can hear sound like rattle in dash, kind of hard to explain.

[rotwiler]

I ended up finding some old school vifa D26NC-05-06 for $20 new a set, so far I really like the sound quality, nice smooth sound and tweeters are heavier, these vifas used to be pretty expensive, maybe I should get a back up set.