[h018871]

I’m making this a factual evaluation of the Weapon-X ‘Triple-X’ Heat Exchangers, without emotion or rant. I did not install the kit on my car, more on that later.

The kit is comprised of 2 auxiliary heat exchangers, 1 main supercharger intercooler and a flex hose that will allow burping the main intercooler once installed in the vehicle.

My plan was to only install only the 2 aux exchangers and not the main intercooler to avoid adding heat to the main engine radiator from the main intercooler.

They are manufactured by De Witts, a well-respected long time manufacturer of radiators for automotive use. The construction and packaging is top notch.

The main intercooler: OE is approximately 5/8” thick, Weapon X is 2 ¼” thick. This equates to increased heat exchange-ability do to the surface area increase from the thickness. Their webpage states 207% increase in cooler volume.

Auxiliary heat exchangers, one for SC and one for engine coolant. OE is 1 3/8” thick with 23 cooling tubes. Weapon X is 1 ½” thick with 23 cooling tubes. An increase of 1/8” in heat exchanging capability or ~ 10% increase in area. Webpage states 83% increase in cooler volume.

The majority cooling benefit of the kit comes from the main intercooler due to its’ increased depth. Unfortunately for me that heat gets passed on to the AC condenser (if on) and the main engine radiator. That is why I did not plan to install it.
Increasing fluid volume translates to a slower rise in fluid temp for a given engine run time. But once it reaches full temp, it stays there. However since the main intercooler has increased cooling area, it will keep the SC cooler overall. Yeah, that’s a messy way to say ‘it’s fantastic for drag racing where the vehicle doesn’t run long and that the main intercooler does a better job keeping and delaying heat soak for the SC = more power for short engine run periods.

That doesn’t work for HPDE/TT events where the vehicle runs for 20-30 minutes at high RPM. Running all three exchangers makes more power, but adds heat to the engine coolant which then goes into the trans fluid, engine oil and diff fluid. If running only the 2 aux coolers I suspect that the gain would be minimal. I’ve asked Weapon X for data to show that the aux HE are more efficient than the OE version.

OVERALL, I think this is a great upgrade to a drag car or a roll racer because most of the time the engine is not being flogged until you “go”. It is not well suited to HPDE/TT because the added heat to the main cooling stack and minimal benefit from the aux coolers.

Pictures
1). Packaging
2). OE Main intercooler thickness, really poor picture with it installed because I wasn’t interested in swapping it out.
3). Weapon X Main intercooler thickness
4). Aux both OE and Weapon X side by side
5). OE aux thickness
6). Weapon X aux thickness
7). Front view of both aux showing rows

[h018871]

Now for the emotional part, skip if you’re not interested.

I contacted Weapon X on the phone and through their “contact us” link on their website to discuss their product and my desires. The phone salesperson stated I couldn’t buy the aux coolers without the main one. I stated what my goals were, HPDE/TT with 20-30 run times and to lower my engine coolant temps, lower SC temps would be an added benefit. I had no intention of installing the main SC intercooler. After I placed the order for the full kit, I received an email stating that I could indeed order only the aux coolers……..really? Anyway, I was ok with having to buy the full kit and wrote it off to someone new or a misunderstanding.

After I noticed that the OE and Weapon X aux coolers were essentially the same, 10% increase in fin area, I decided I’d not install them and request a refund expecting some sort of restocking charge. When I contacted Weapon X with my observations on size of the aux coolers they said “That is correct we measure by fluid, which is accurate.” That was all they sent. One line. Wow.
The increased cooling capacity of the aux coolers comes from the larger tanks at each end of the actual heat exchanger. Not suited for HPDE/TT events at all. They measure fluid volume, not heat exchange capacity.

I’m still talking with them. Well, mostly at them since they are no longer responding. I admit, it got a little pissy on both sides, but I’m trying to tone it down and be fair with them. So far it’s not working.

[20Bluezl1]

Great observation a month ago I was about to order the same kit but started to do research and keep up with the same thing. The additional cooling capacity is only going to delay the heating for a short time. I was thinking in a Forced Inductions Interchiller which from my research it works great in cooling and it really doesn't rob that much power when the compressor is on. Not sure how good it would work for HPDE in which that is my goal as well.

[Smokin19]

I have been looking at those Weapon X aux exchangers. I was wondering if the coking issue would be less on them. Are the fines further spaced than OE. Any chance of a pic showing that.

I do see your point about using their Aux Exchangers for your application and seems reasonable. They would seem better for those at the strip. Maybe, less heat soak.

[h018871]

Smokin, if you're asking about the aux cooler, in the last picture the weapon x is on the left and OE is on the right. Is that what you meant?

I agree, this is drag strip product. Not well suited for HPDE/TT
I wish I would have figured it out before I purchased it. Oh well, hopefully my mistake/learning experience will save others.

[radz28]

Thanks for the info. All of that is interesting. Sometimes the OEMs take it right to the limit and there's just not much low-hanging fruit left. It's too bad for guys wanting to run harder...

Please keep us posted. You aren't the only one looking for a solution.

[gcrusco]

Hey guys, So I have all three weapon x heat exchangers, and I am not seeing an improvement at all in my temps. At an HPDE at COTA last weekend im seeing coolant temps of 230 and oil temps of 290.

I am seeing a loss of 10mph on the back straight and curious if the weapon x coolers are actually hurting my temps during long period.

[vic_ZL1]

I have only the center heat exchanger installed in my 2017 A10 zl1. It work well with no compromises. I thought at the beginning that it would reduce the ac efficiency, but it didn't.

[EDFHOBBIES]

I guess there is a reason why ADM and PLM went with the OEM thickness and better material. ADM used Ron Davis to design a better well known company. PLM sells oem thickness and weapon X thickness's. ADM is around 550 and PLM is around 350 for oem 5/8s thickness. I saw ADM's website then called Andy and asked the thickness and maker he said 5/8s and ron davis I made the mistake and said wow that's not very thick he then said Ron has been doing this for years if that's what he designed there a reason but his wording wasn't that polite lol

I wish I had some data on the stock unit but I noticed similar results In Houston with 100 degrees and high humidity with a thicker unit. There just no way to cool the car once its at temp. I haven't seen any different oil or water temps yet. Once the humidity falls and we get into the 60s 70s I bet you will have better results. I ran 120s intake manifold temps in 70s in the summer they are in the 140s and that was just normal driving after about 45 min or 1 hour.

I did tried to space the heat exchanger further from the ac condenser but no luck i had a similar problem with the race intercooler from AGP on a 5th gen it actually made the car overheat with the AC on in stop n go traffic. The condenser gets so hot and the AC fans couldn't pull enough air through that close to 4 inch thick core. AGP said increase the space between it and the condenser. I would of had to lose my lower mesh in my zl1 fascia I had already cut a lot out to fit it the intercooler wasn't about to cut a large gap in to it.

I had this idea floating in my head of removing the backseat or laying it down placing the heat exchanger in the hole between the cabin and trunk with puller fans and shroud mounted on the trunks side.. with cabin ac on should be able to pull 70 degree air across the fins with the extra lines you should also increase about 2 gallons of fluid and the stuart pump should help to. I drew up 2 pics pumps inline pumps in series..

like the interchillers that work off the AC system you remove the front exchanger. Would the front exchanger lower the temps some and the rear exchanger handles less heat or would running the front exchanger just raise the temp back to ambient like it does to the chiller setups.

I went ahead and purchased the FI chiller Im going to install it in a few weeks. I think its robbery that places like Cordes and prospeed sell 2 gall or so tanks for 650 plus Im going to get PLM to make us some front mount tanks in the 3 to 400 range just like I did for the exchanger.

HO you might try to install a larger reservoir in the trunk after each session you could maybe ice the water down.

[Z OH 6]

Originally Posted by EDFHOBBIES

I guess there is a reason why ADM and PLM went with the OEM thickness and better material. ADM used Ron Davis to design a better well known company. PLM sells oem thickness and weapon X thickness's. ADM is around 550 and PLM is around 350 for oem 5/8s thickness. I saw ADM's website then called Andy and asked the thickness and maker he said 5/8s and ron davis I made the mistake and said wow that's not very thick he then said Ron has been doing this for years if that's what he designed there a reason but his wording wasn't that polite lol

I wish I had some data on the stock unit but I noticed similar results In Houston with 100 degrees and high humidity with a thicker unit. There just no way to cool the car once its at temp. I haven't seen any different oil or water temps yet. Once the humidity falls and we get into the 60s 70s I bet you will have better results. I ran 120s intake manifold temps in 70s in the summer they are in the 140s and that was just normal driving after about 45 min or 1 hour.

I did tried to space the heat exchanger further from the ac condenser but no luck i had a similar problem with the race intercooler from AGP on a 5th gen it actually made the car overheat with the AC on in stop n go traffic. The condenser gets so hot and the AC fans couldn't pull enough air through that close to 4 inch thick core. AGP said increase the space between it and the condenser. I would of had to lose my lower mesh in my zl1 fascia I had already cut a lot out to fit it the intercooler wasn't about to cut a large gap in to it.

I had this idea floating in my head of removing the backseat or laying it down placing the heat exchanger in the hole between the cabin and trunk with puller fans and shroud mounted on the trunks side.. with cabin ac on should be able to pull 70 degree air across the fins with the extra lines you should also increase about 2 gallons of fluid and the stuart pump should help to. I drew up 2 pics pumps inline pumps in series..

like the interchillers that work off the AC system you remove the front exchanger. Would the front exchanger lower the temps some and the rear exchanger handles less heat or would running the front exchanger just raise the temp back to ambient like it does to the chiller setups.

I went ahead and purchased the FI chiller Im going to install it in a few weeks. I think its robbery that places like Cordes and prospeed sell 2 gall or so tanks for 650 plus Im going to get PLM to make us some front mount tanks in the 3 to 400 range just like I did for the exchanger.

HO you might try to install a larger reservoir in the trunk after each session you could maybe ice the water down.

Apples to oranges but both fruit, I had the FI Interchiller stage 1 kit on my Hellcat and it works incredibly well. On a 93F ambient day, a Hellcat with stock heat exchangers will typically see IATs around 130-140F. With the stage 1 FI Interchiller, and no additional reservoir in normal mode which has AC in the cabin, my IAT would drop to about 78F, in drag mode with no cabin AC, it would drop to about 64F. That's 15-30F below ambient temps. The IC temps would be much lower, typically around 42F with cabin AC, and as low as 35F in drag mode without cabin AC. This is on a 93F ambient day. Expect lower results in lower temps.

[h018871]

Well, the saga is finally over.

I don't get some businesses , they have a decent enough product/idea suited for purpose A but not purpose B and then have a super caustic business culture that makes them absolute H*LL to deal with. They took it so personal that the coolers did not work for HPDE/TT.

Anyway......... In the end, I got almost all of my money back, I paid shipping which is fair. I now have the knowledge and experience not to deal with them again. I'm headed down a path similar to what travislambert is running from C&R. He has a 2650, so it's a little different animal.

LSA started a thread on it here if you haven't seen it
https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=583742

[SFV1LE]

Originally Posted by h018871

Well, the saga is finally over.

I don't get some businesses , they have a decent enough product/idea suited for purpose A but not purpose B and then have a super caustic business culture that makes them absolute H*LL to deal with. They took it so personal that the coolers did not work for HPDE/TT.

Anyway......... In the end, I got almost all of my money back, I paid shipping which is fair. I now have the knowledge and experience not to deal with them again. I'm headed down a path similar to what travislambert is running from C&R. He has a 2650, so it's a little different animal.

LSA started a thread on it here if you haven't seen it
https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=583742

I'm glad you got this resolution, unfortunately I'm not surprised by your experience with them.

[h018871]

Originally Posted by SFV1LE

I'm glad you got this resolution.

Thx I am too, although I was surprised that it was so arduous to reach closure. I guess that I'm a bit innocent/naive/trusting in that I expect businesses to be 'decent' or at the least talk to the customer without their first response after ignoring calls and emails is to threaten legal action once payment is stopped. Oh well, that's behind me and I'm happy to move on.