[TXCSSU]

Originally Posted by GreenZLE

IMO, that doesnt really pan out because vette people buy vettes and camaro people buy camaros for the most part. Sure, there's a bit of crossover but not in a way that makes vette owners camaro owners in droves.



They didnt really build many 2019 ZR1's and they could have made a limited amount of LT5 camaros. Its not without precedent. Under 1000 LT5 ZL1's wouldnt have made much if any impact on corvette sales. In fact, it would have pushed me to buy a new camaro instead of keeping what I have.

I'm not saying that a potential Corvette owner is going to buy a Camaro instead, I'm saying that it might keep them from buying a Corvette, which is different. It would be you going out to buy something that you think is the best, but seeing a "lesser product" perform better. When you spend premium money, you want the illusion of superiority. Hell, I considered the Ct5-V BW for all of a week. But, given that I could get 325/334ths of the powertrain at almost 40% off, and didn't have to wait a year, or pay $10k over MSRP I figured it was a no brainer. The beauty of us "settling" for the Camaro's LT4 over the CT5-V BW is that it isn't going to cost us that much to get 18 HP.

[EDFHOBBIES]

Originally Posted by Corbs09

For a while you could buy a LT5 blower and PI setup through Crawford. Doesn't look like they sell it anymore.

It's because the oem prices are to high and he's having trouble getting the parts to run the electronic bypass vs vacuum bypass

[EDFHOBBIES]

[VT-1LE]

Originally Posted by TXCSSU

But GM still has a history of protecting the Corvette name. Hell, the GNX from the 80s was rated at lower HP than a Corvette from the same year, even though it was a well known fact that the GNX was sandbagging its HP numbers to keep the "status quo". It's a shame that GM is more concerned with its shareholders these days and not its customers, as I'd love to see more GNX, GTOs and other specialty vehicles produced. Granted, that seems to be the case for a lot of companies these days. I always kept hoping that GM was going to let Buick create a newer version of the GNX as a way of justifying keeping Buick around.

Agreed. Unfortunately now Buick only makes crossovers and suvs. Funny how they only dipped their toe in the High Performance pond a couple times I know of (GSX Stage one and GN/GNX) and dominated in their respective time realms from what I read on both.

[hawk02]

I love how everyone says GM should just slapped the LT5 into the ZL1 for its swan song. But let's look at it realistically.

First off, The cost and time to re-certify the LT5 in the Alpha chassis would be enormous. No doubt the engine compartment would need modification, the suspension retuned to handle the additional horsepower, and the transmission beefed up just to mention a few. This would require hours of testing and re-engineering.

Secondly, how many people realistically would be willing to pay $100K for a Camaro? Only 3,434 ZL1s were manufactured in 2019 before the pandemic. If we assume GM averaged 3000 ZL1s a year over the six model years that's roughly 18,000 ZL1 owners out there. You all say you'd trade in your current ZL1 for an LT5 ZL1 in a heart beat but would you really? I bet it would be less than 10%.

GM produced less than 3000 C7 ZR1s. I'm betting Camaro ZL1 LT5 sales wouldn't even come close to that.

GM is in the business to make money for its shareholders. GM knows its market very well. And the market just isn't there to justify the cost to put the LT5 in the Camaro ZL1 even though our heart says we'd love to see it.

[cariboocreek]

I own both. Different cars for different purposes. A Vette is not a two seat Camaro and the Camaro isn't a four seat Vette. They drive different, they operate differently. Love them both, but not the same. Slapping a bigger motor in one still doesn't change the original purpose or market the car was designed for. The demographic is also likely significantly different between the two models. I will say that I do end up in the Camaro more than the Vette. Have never really considered why.

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by hawk02

I love how everyone says GM should just slapped the LT5 into the ZL1 for its swan song. But let's look at it realistically.

First off, The cost and time to re-certify the LT5 in the Alpha chassis would be enormous. No doubt the engine compartment would need modification, the suspension retuned to handle the additional horsepower, and the transmission beefed up just to mention a few. This would require hours of testing and re-engineering.

Secondly, how many people realistically would be willing to pay $100K for a Camaro? Only 3,434 ZL1s were manufactured in 2019 before the pandemic. If we assume GM averaged 3000 ZL1s a year over the six model years that's roughly 18,000 ZL1 owners out there. You all say you'd trade in your current ZL1 for an LT5 ZL1 in a heart beat but would you really? I bet it would be less than 10%.

GM produced less than 3000 C7 ZR1s. I'm betting Camaro ZL1 LT5 sales wouldn't even come close to that.

GM is in the business to make money for its shareholders. GM knows its market very well. And the market just isn't there to justify the cost to put the LT5 in the Camaro ZL1 even though our heart says we'd love to see it.

I love the LT4, but I'd sell my LT4 ZL1 for an LT5 ZL1. That's a ~133 mph car in the 1/4 mile - with a full warranty. And I don't think the car itself would require that much reengineering. The trans is already the 10L90, beefed up, so it probably wouldn't need much. The suspension would just need to be retuned, I don't think it would need to be redesigned. And the hood would require a bigger more muscular bulge, which if it was the same style as the OEM CF insert, but 2" higher, would look awesome.

If they went as far as putting the LT5 in the ZL1, I'd say they should distinguish it from the LT4 with a slightly more aggressive rear diffuser, special exhaust tips (black chrome, maybe?), black mirror caps, exposed CF roof, 1" wider unique wheels with 305 front and 335 rear, and special dark color badging (in addition to the larger hood bulge). It would look absolutely sinister.

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by CW3SF

I have owned multiple Vettes. I went ZL1 instead this time because there are just too many Vettes everywhere I look. I like having cars that have at least a little bit of uniqueness. I hardly ever see ZL1s on the road.

Same here (uniqueness - I actually haven't owned any Corvettes - yet). I'd love to have a C7 Z06, and that car is the reason I am in a ZL1, but C7 Z06s are much more common around here than ZL1s. In the 13+ months I've had my ZL1, I can count on one hand how many other different 6th gen ZL1s I've seen. I can't even count on multiple hands how many C7 Z06s I've seen since then. Also, like some, I need/want back seats (3 kids!). And the A10 is far superior to the A8, so IF I had gone with a C7 Z06 it would have been an M7 for sure.

[LT4Greg]

Originally Posted by hawk02

I love how everyone says GM should just slapped the LT5 into the ZL1 for its swan song. But let's look at it realistically.

First off, The cost and time to re-certify the LT5 in the Alpha chassis would be enormous. No doubt the engine compartment would need modification, the suspension retuned to handle the additional horsepower, and the transmission beefed up just to mention a few. This would require hours of testing and re-engineering.

Secondly, how many people realistically would be willing to pay $100K for a Camaro? Only 3,434 ZL1s were manufactured in 2019 before the pandemic. If we assume GM averaged 3000 ZL1s a year over the six model years that's roughly 18,000 ZL1 owners out there. You all say you'd trade in your current ZL1 for an LT5 ZL1 in a heart beat but would you really? I bet it would be less than 10%.

GM produced less than 3000 C7 ZR1s. I'm betting Camaro ZL1 LT5 sales wouldn't even come close to that.

GM is in the business to make money for its shareholders. GM knows its market very well. And the market just isn't there to justify the cost to put the LT5 in the Camaro ZL1 even though our heart says we'd love to see it.

Agree totally with you hawk02!

[ZX-10R]

The market is there for an LT5 Camaro under $80k, it would sell like crazy - and I don't think the swap would be all that complicated - the A10 can handle the power. The real reason it won't happen is the EV transition

That's the blower these cars should have come with in the first place

[Blackdevil77]

If they just stuck an LT5 in the ZL1 in the first place, it probably would of sold a lot more, even if it was more expensive. Ford had no problem giving the GT500 more power than the Ford GT, and the GT500 is the most sought after of the 3 (Hellcat, ZL1 being the other two).

I know it’s not gonna happen, I know what it would or required to make it happen. I’m just saying I don’t agree with GMs decision to always try and keep the top tier Camaro in the top dog Corvettes shadow. But what do I know, I’m just some ass hole on a forum.

[6spdhyperblue]

I think it would be very nice to get the zr1 OS to work in a Camaro to run the oe dual injection.

I wonder if someone like Hhp could get this done

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by ZX-10R

The market is there for an LT5 Camaro under $80k, it would sell like crazy - and I don't think the swap would be all that complicated - the A10 can handle the power. The real reason it won't happen is the EV transition

That's the blower these cars should have come with in the first place

GM had specific goals for the LT4, and the small 1.74L, harder hitting, faster spinning blower met their OEM goals. They felt the LS9 in the C6 ZR1 didn't make enough low end torque, so they were able to fill in that low-end torque, lighten the engine, make the engine shorter in height, and make a few extra hp with the LT4 over the LS9. OEM goals met. I don't think they were that concerned about what the aftermarket could or couldn't do with the blower once it left the factory.

Originally Posted by Blackdevil77

If they just stuck an LT5 in the ZL1 in the first place, it probably would of sold a lot more, even if it was more expensive. Ford had no problem giving the GT500 more power than the Ford GT, and the GT500 is the most sought after of the 3 (Hellcat, ZL1 being the other two).

I know it’s not gonna happen, I know what it would or required to make it happen. I’m just saying I don’t agree with GMs decision to always try and keep the top tier Camaro in the top dog Corvettes shadow. But what do I know, I’m just some ass hole on a forum.

They couldn't have stuck the LT5 in the ZL1 "in the first place" because the LT5 didn't debut in the ZR1 until after the 6th gen ZL1 had been in production for a couple of years. Plus, they weren't going to put the halo of all halo GM engines (LT5) in a Camaro in 2017 and not the Z06. I don't blame them for saving room for a ZR1. There is a pecking order and the ZR1 is on top. Camaro has an advantage in that the good stuff from the Corvette trickles down. e.g. LT1, LT4, etc., which I'm thankful for. There's also the economy of scales also with sharing the engine blocks with the V8 trucks.

The ZL1 and top dog at the time C7 Z06 co-existed for a couple of years with the same power ratings, so they didn't really sand bag it alongside the Z06. And the ZL1 is currently the most powerful Chevy product (until the C8 Z06 comes out with an extra 20 hp), and tied for the 2nd most powerful of all time.

[zxspeedspec]

Originally Posted by Blackdevil77

Why not just learn from dodge and put that most powerful engine you have in literally everything. It’s a simple formula that works and sells. I’d get a Vette, but I’d like to be able to go places with my wife and son, so the Vette isn’t an option for me. It would be nice to have options

Because Dodge doesn't have a halo car anymore. When they had the Viper the only other car that got that motor was a truck because there was no way that truck was going to perform better than the Viper. And even then I think it was slightly detuned.

Dodge would never put a Viper motor from their ACR-E into a Challenger if they were produced at the same time. Just like how Ford will never drop the Ford GT motor into the top trim Mustang. The minute you do that, you ruin all sales of your halo car except to very niche collectors.

Why would I spend $400k for a Ford GT if I can get the same motor and same performance numbers in a $120k Mustang?