[Want1]

Originally Posted by WEAPON-X

Here is the proof that you all desire in the power of the chiller system. As you saw above, it's capable of 30* water temps and that thermostat is actually on the outlet of the expansion tank, not measuring the temp of the water inside, so realistically it's sub freezing and requires a coolant mix

Here is Intimidator's:
baseline 2.5" upper pulley (stock), our intake, and the NX lid resulting in 619hp/568tq

vs.

2.175" aka 15% pulley resulting in 623hp/638tq
Gain: 4hp/70tq
Note: Usually when you see the Torque number higher than the HP on a PD supercharged setup it is telling you that your setup isn't as efficient as it should be - having either air restrictions or heat issues)

vs.

2.175" aka 15% pulley and Boost Freeze Chiller resulting in 684hp/674tq!!!!
Gain: 61hp/36tq
Note: These numbers make sense from a thermodynamics stand point as well because these pulley setups don't heat soak as much down low where the torque numbers are the highest on a PD blower. The heat gets into them throughout the pulley and they suffer up top in the RPM range. The split is lower at the bottom and keeps increasing at the top! Usually, you are only down in the lower RPM range off the line, so the torque is great to get you out of the hole, but your car spends the rest of it's LIFE in the upper RPM range when you're drag, track, or roll racing.

So, the chiller adding 36 lb-ft of torque down low with the extra 4* of timing and carrying that out to net 61 whp in the upper RPM range is a VERY impressive thing. This is not adding power, but giving you the power in a perfect world and making that repeatable when making pulls over and over on a hot day.

As for the cost, a heads/cam kit installed is over $6,000 and will net you approx 60whp on an 860whp Whipple car (which is about a 7% HP increase) as we have tested this with a max effort Whipple on a stock LT4 engine vs. our heads cam package. This is getting you about 60whp on a 690whp car for half the price and a 9% HP gain, lowered temps, lowered boost, is safer on the engine. Now consider this, if we had done the lower pulley instead of the upper, we could've replaced that 2psi of boost with a ring swap and gone to our stage 4 pulley, which is a 23% increase and shown 100whp gains I would venture to bet.

AWESOME results! Can't argue with gain Vs money spent.

Thanks for another great write up, Ben!

[Want1]

Originally Posted by WEAPON-X

Here is the proof that you all desire in the power of the chiller system. As you saw above, it's capable of 30* water temps and that thermostat is actually on the outlet of the expansion tank, not measuring the temp of the water inside, so realistically it's sub freezing and requires a coolant mix

Here is Intimidator's:
baseline 2.5" upper pulley (stock), our intake, and the NX lid resulting in 619hp/568tq

vs.

2.175" aka 15% pulley resulting in 623hp/638tq
Gain: 4hp/70tq
Note: Usually when you see the Torque number higher than the HP on a PD supercharged setup it is telling you that your setup isn't as efficient as it should be - having either air restrictions or heat issues)

vs.

2.175" aka 15% pulley and Boost Freeze Chiller resulting in 684hp/674tq!!!!
Gain: 61hp/36tq
Note: These numbers make sense from a thermodynamics stand point as well because these pulley setups don't heat soak as much down low where the torque numbers are the highest on a PD blower. The heat gets into them throughout the pulley and they suffer up top in the RPM range. The split is lower at the bottom and keeps increasing at the top! Usually, you are only down in the lower RPM range off the line, so the torque is great to get you out of the hole, but your car spends the rest of it's LIFE in the upper RPM range when you're drag, track, or roll racing.

So, the chiller adding 36 lb-ft of torque down low with the extra 4* of timing and carrying that out to net 61 whp in the upper RPM range is a VERY impressive thing. This is not adding power, but giving you the power in a perfect world and making that repeatable when making pulls over and over on a hot day.

As for the cost, a heads/cam kit installed is over $6,000 and will net you approx 60whp on an 860whp Whipple car (which is about a 7% HP increase) as we have tested this with a max effort Whipple on a stock LT4 engine vs. our heads cam package. This is getting you about 60whp on a 690whp car for half the price and a 9% HP gain, lowered temps, lowered boost, is safer on the engine. Now consider this, if we had done the lower pulley instead of the upper, we could've replaced that 2psi of boost with a ring swap and gone to our stage 4 pulley, which is a 23% increase and shown 100whp gains I would venture to bet.

Also, would this set up (chiller) work on a '17 SS 1LE, with a Whipple, LT4 pump and injectors and a JMS fuel pump voltage regulator? Or would it be overkill, or just NOT necessary, since with this set up (with stock cam, heads and pistons), I would/should be (theoretically) at its limits at about 600 whp (plus)?

Thanks in advance!

[WEAPON-X]

Originally Posted by Want1

Also, would this set up (chiller) work on a '17 SS 1LE, with a Whipple, LT4 pump and injectors and a JMS fuel pump voltage regulator? Or would it be overkill, or just NOT necessary, since with this set up (with stock cam, heads and pistons), I would/should be (theoretically) at its limits at about 600 whp (plus)?

Thanks in advance!

Oh it would absolutely work. We did all of our testing on the Whipple LT4s first and that is what those thermal pics are, the coolant cross over tube, which feels so cold that it almost is a dull numbness on your hand when you put it on there expecting it to be hot haha.

I would certainly tell you to take a look at it with your fuel mods as you're not at the limit of anything yet as we have made 700whp reliably from the LT1s with the LT4 fuel system and the 17s have the ZL1 tank pumps as well. You need to be mindful of the PCV system as the LT1 is more prominent to push seals without proper evac, and be less agressive on timing vs. the LT4 because the piston rings and rods are weaker.

But regardless, the same principles apply, less boost, more timing, more repeatable power, and most importantly it is safer for the engine as you are cooling the boosted charge which results in less heat being pushed into the engine!

[Want1]

Originally Posted by WEAPON-X

Oh it would absolutely work. We did all of our testing on the Whipple LT4s first and that is what those thermal pics are, the coolant cross over tube, which feels so cold that it almost is a dull numbness on your hand when you put it on there expecting it to be hot haha.

I would certainly tell you to take a look at it with your fuel mods as you're not at the limit of anything yet as we have made 700whp reliably from the LT1s with the LT4 fuel system and the 17s have the ZL1 tank pumps as well. You need to be mindful of the PCV system as the LT1 is more prominent to push seals without proper evac, and be less agressive on timing vs. the LT4 because the piston rings and rods are weaker.

But regardless, the same principles apply, less boost, more timing, more repeatable power, and most importantly it is safer for the engine as you are cooling the boosted charge which results in less heat being pushed into the engine!

Sounds like I might have to spend some more money - Dang it!! LOL

I'll give your shop a call a little later, Today.

[Intimidator]

Originally Posted by WEAPON-X

But regardless, the same principles apply, less boost, more timing, more repeatable power, and most importantly it is safer for the engine as you are cooling the boosted charge which results in less heat being pushed into the engine![/B]

Want1
I may not be an engineer and I can't explain the system in thermodynamic terms...but being an old school Hot Rodder, this meant more to me than anything....and that is why this system is on my car!

[WEAPON-X]

Originally Posted by Want1

Sounds like I might have to spend some more money - Dang it!! LOL

I'll give your shop a call a little later, Today.

PM me your contact info

[WEAPON-X]

Nick's Camaro SS is down from the Cleveland, OH area for the Chiller install before the Norwalk Outlaw races in 2 weeks! Follow along here:

https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showt...0#post10316260

[Intimidator]

Well I decided to get my car back in to Weapon-X today to get a lower pulley done and add more boost!
With Ben getting more data, you guys can really decide on the Chiller.

[WEAPON-X]

Originally Posted by Intimidator

Well I decided to get my car back in to Weapon-X today to get a lower pulley done and add more boost!
With Ben getting more data, you guys can really decide on the Chiller.

Looking forward to it! I bet we will see 720whp on the stock long block with 93 octane!

[Intimidator]

Really looking forward to it also!!!

[GunMetalGrey]

Originally Posted by WEAPON-X

Now I want you guys to see just HOW HOT the temps get and stay!!! Here are 5 dyno pulls, all with the same combo approx 33 minutes apart start to finish, around 8-10m between each pull and while it's not a legit comparison to a car on the track with heat entering on the straights and coming out of the turns and cooling off between with the fans on blast.

Intimidator's 2.3 aka 9% Upper Pulley:
On this ZL1 looking at logs, you will see. With the 2.3 upper pulley making nearly 13 PSI of boost, the MAT on a hot day normally start over 130* and STAY over 130*, but since it's been tuned, we removed the IAT spark pull from the 133* column, so the next threshold is 154*.

Dyno Pul #1 at 2:20PM
Car starts with:
Engine coolant 126*
IAT1 82*
IAT2 84*
MAT 112*

By the time we get the car up to gear 6 (shorter pulls for tuning so it's nto as long and the car doesn't get as hot):
Engine coolant 171*
IAT1 84*
IAT2 93*
MAT 122*

Top of gear 7:
Engine coolant 174*
IAT1 91*
IAT2 91*
MAT 125* - Not bad right? Well unless you're pushing your car up to the starting line, you're not going to see this in the real world, read on

Look below:
The RED boxed highlighted air temps are the values referenced above.
The PINK box around the Manifold Air Temp (MAT) which is what the IAT Spark Table references.
The YELLOW Bubble shows the knock aka KR on the modified calibration.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dyno Pul #2 at 2:29PM - the car sat on the dyno with the fans on it and the entire system was heat soaked in 9 minutes shut off and the MAT was already NOT happy, despite the Engine coolant, IAT1, and IAT2 being reasonable, and remember MAT is what our power is based on.

Car starts with:
Engine coolant 180*
IAT1 88*
IAT2 106*
MAT 145* - HOT after sitting 9 min

By the time we get the car up to gear 6:
Engine coolant 171*
IAT1 88*
IAT2 106*
MAT 140*

Top of gear 6:
Engine coolant 174*
IAT1 86*
IAT2 99*
MAT 141* - pulling .2* of timing already despite the window being opened to 154* IAT spark pull

Look below:
The RED boxed highlighted air temps are the values referenced above.
The PINK box around the Manifold Air Temp (MAT) which is what the IAT Spark Table references.
The YELLOW Bubble shows the knock aka KR on the modified calibration.



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dyno Pul #3 at 2:39PM - the car sat on the dyno with the fans on it and the entire system was even MORE heat soaked in another 10 minutes after just a NINE SECOND PULL and the MAT was pissed off now LOL, despite the Engine coolant, IAT1, and IAT2 ALL still being reasonable, and don't forget again, the MAT aka Manifold Air Temp is what our power is based on.

Car starts with:
Engine coolant 171*
IAT1 91*
IAT2 104*
MAT 171* - REALLY HOT after sitting 10 min

By the time we get the car up to gear 6:
Engine coolant 172*
IAT1 88*
IAT2 104*
MAT 152*

Top of gear 6:
Engine coolant 174*
IAT1 88*
IAT2 102*
MAT 151* and up to 157* just 14 seconds later as the car is winding down on the rollers before the log stops. Just think of how hot the system gets when you're on and off the throttle on a real world road course.

As you can see the knock is back as high as 5* with just 18* of timing on a 9% pulley! I'd love to know if you road course guys are logging KR, especially if you're modded.

Look below:
The RED boxed highlighted air temps are the values referenced above.
The PINK box around the Manifold Air Temp (MAT) which is what the IAT Spark Table references.
The YELLOW Bubble shows the knock aka KR on the modified calibration.



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dyno Pul #4 at 2:47PM - the car sat on the dyno with the fans on it and the MAT seems to somewhat settle into this 17X* area as the previous pull was only 8 minutes previous and the temps are only a little hotter than run 3 starting out, but still a timing killer at that heat range, despite again the Engine coolant, IAT1, and IAT2 ALL still being reasonable, and don't forget again, the MAT aka Manifold Air Temp is what our power is based on.

Car starts with:
Engine coolant 181*
IAT1 95*
IAT2 104*
MAT 174* - REALLY HOT after sitting 8 min

By the time we get the car up to gear 6:
Engine coolant 172*
IAT1 88*
IAT2 104*
MAT 152*

Top of gear 6:
Engine coolant 174*
IAT1 88*
IAT2 102*
MAT 151*

Knock spike is still there at 5600 RPM at nearly 5* with just a 9% pulley with less than 19* of timing.

Look below:
The RED boxed highlighted air temps are the values referenced above.
The PINK box around the Manifold Air Temp (MAT) which is what the IAT Spark Table references.
The YELLOW Bubble shows the knock aka KR on the modified calibration.



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dyno Pul #5 at 2:53PM - the car sat on the dyno with the fans on it and the entire system was even MORE heat soaked in just 6 minutes after just a NINE SECOND PULL and the MAT was pissed off now LOL, despite the Engine coolant, IAT1, and IAT2 ALL still being reasonable, and don't forget again, the MAT aka Manifold Air Temp is what our power is based on.
Car starts with:
Engine coolant 189*
IAT1 93*
IAT2 104*
MAT 182* - and now it is REALLY REALLY HOT after sitting less at just 6 min

By the time we get the car up to gear 6:
Engine coolant 178*
IAT1 90*
IAT2 106*
MAT 164*

Top of gear 6:
Engine coolant 183*
IAT1 90*
IAT2 100*
MAT 163* - and as you can see, the knock is aggressive again with just 13 PSI and less than 18* of timing!


Look below:
The RED boxed highlighted air temps are the values referenced above.
The PINK box around the Manifold Air Temp (MAT) which is what the IAT Spark Table references.
The YELLOW Bubble shows the knock aka KR on the modified calibration.

I’m surprised there hasn’t been more comments and conversation about these tests and the resulting data...
The tests seem more comparable to drag racing situations than tracking to me... any thoughts on what the MATs and knock would look like tracking the car compared to these tests and if the Boost Chiller would be as useful in that situation?

[Markoz28]

Will methanol do the same thing as the chiller?

[gonabite]

Originally Posted by Markoz28

Will methanol do the same thing as the chiller?

Not even remotely close.

[Akura]

Hello,

When you recharge the A/C Freon, how much do you add to the 550gr stock?

Thank you.