All driver modes have mushy throttle! - Page 2

MR-02 · 07-17-2017, 01:41 PM

Yes a tune is good, I had one on my Gen5, but Can any tuner brave up to offer at least half of the powertrain warranty that GM is giving us? Someone needs to create a needs a mild/safe tune that is undetectable like the VTC. Maybe a "Throttle response tune only" ---no crazy HP adjustments needed for some of us daily drivers.

Childs Play · 07-18-2017, 06:53 AM

Why not this..?

http://www.vitesse-motorsports.com/t...016+camaro.htm

Worked great in the 5th gen. Haven't seen one yet in the 6th but I was impressed with it previously.

Also, not related to the controller above, doesn't the track mode setting have a slightly less sensitive throttle than the sport mode? I remember reading that somewhere for the ZL1. Not sure if it's the same for the SS as well.

Marty McFlew · 07-18-2017, 02:32 PM

Mine is not mushy at all. My 2011 I had was mushy but my 17 feels like a cable.

guapo · 12-19-2018, 02:31 PM

Ok first observation with my 50th V6, seems like stepping on the gas is like using a brick,, I have to mash it very hard. I came from a 2013 LT2 V6 worlds apart.. Any suggestions or is there setting that change it. Picked up the car with only 3172 miles on it yesterday.

Any thoughts.....

PnCRedJwl2SS · 01-03-2019, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guapo

Ok first observation with my 50th V6, seems like stepping on the gas is like using a brick,, I have to mash it very hard. I came from a 2013 LT2 V6 worlds apart.. Any suggestions or is there setting that change it. Picked up the car with only 3172 miles on it yesterday.

Any thoughts.....

I definitely recommend trying the Vitesse Throttle Controller. The range of settings lets you select a more responsive throttle. I have a 2SS A8 and it really makes a difference. I suspect it will make a greater difference in the V6 or 2.0T.

If you decide to go that route, it would be great if you can post back here. Always interesting to hear about the experience of others.

Cheers!

guapo · 01-16-2019, 05:24 PM

It was in the shop recently and they said the pedal was fine. But have to go back on Monday and will see if I can check another camaro on the lot and see if matches..

avalonandl · 01-20-2019, 08:45 AM

Tony Mamo ported TB solves this is what I have read. Have not verified this. But I may try it.

Marko · 03-31-2019, 04:21 PM

My 18 SS throttle lags off and on. No big deal. Sometimes feels like bad gas. At WOT, it runs Awesome. Thank god. I’m very happy with it.

I also just bought a 19 Charger Scat pack. And the light throttle response is awesome on it. I always chirp the tires easily.

475 HP I think. And That 392 Hemi is terrible on gas though. The Camaro gets a lot better mpg’s

arpad_m · 03-31-2019, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marko

My 18 SS throttle lags off and on. No big deal. Sometimes feels like bad gas. At WOT, it runs Awesome. Thank god. I’m very happy with it.

I also just bought a 19 Charger Scat pack. And the light throttle response is awesome on it. I always chirp the tires easily.

475 HP I think. And That 392 Hemi is terrible on gas though. The Camaro gets a lot better mpg’s

I started seeing the same strange lag right after the last fillup, literally as I was pulling out of the gas station. Can't wait to go through this tank and get some good summer gas again to see if that fixes it. Otherwise I'll either try the ported TB or reach out to my tuner for an adjustment. Or both

man0steel · 04-02-2019, 11:12 AM

This

https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=494122

protovack · 04-02-2019, 02:30 PM

It is useful to be specific about language here.

- Throttle map: the variability in the relationship between how much you press the pedal, and how much fuel gets delivered to the engine, over the course of the RPM range.
- Throttle response: the subjective feeling of how well your input is transmitted to the rear wheels. Can be good, or bad, depending on your sensation of mechanical and electrical delay between your pedal input and the rear wheels turning.

The gas pedal sends an electric signal to the fuel system that can vary in intensity. The more voltage, the more fuel is sprayed. Roughly.
Throttle controllers such as Vitesse simply boost the voltage sent, more fuel is injected, and RPMs come up faster. As far as I know, and correct me if I'm wrong, aftermarket throttle controllers have nothing to do with throttle mapping. All they do is boost voltage and hence, you will get the OEM throttle map for whatever drive mode you are in, just "boosted" to higher voltage and thus the engine will respond more to a given pedal press. Thus, they don't write in the ECU and don't void your warranty.

I've never used one, personally, so I don't know exactly what they feel like. One of the questions I have is, does it eliminate that "dead space" to very quick pedal presses? Like if you just mash the throttle and let off, typically the signal never gets to the engine. I believe that is intentional in the design and not necessarily a bad thing. Power application should always be smooth and gradual to maintain chassis balance.

Track mode has the most linear, 1:1 throttle mapping of any mode. You press 20%, you get 20% throttle, you press 60% you get 60% throttle. Which is far better for track driving, and really, any driving where you need to modulate the throttle with a high degree of detail. Invariably, though, some will assume there is "dead space", but it's not. That's just what pressing through 5, 10, 20, 30% throttle feels like.

Sport and Tour mode are artificially boosted in the beginning of the pedal travel--you press 5%, you get 20% throttle. This is to make the car feel "zippier" around town and also just to make it so you don't have to press the throttle 20-30% every time you pull away from a stop (reduces foot fatigue for daily drivers). People are very accustomed to these non-linear throttle maps. It's a trick almost all auto manufacturers use to make their vehicles feel faster. My last subaru forester was a bad offender. It jumped off the line at the slightest throttle input. They did this to hide the fact that the engine was completely anemic and under-powered for the platform. It feels really fast on the test drive, but a month later when you load it up with the family and gear and get out on the highway, you discover how slow it really is.

Throttle mapping is different from poor throttle response, which is often caused by a combination of electronic and mechanical delay between you pressing the pedal to the transmission actually turning the drive shaft. It's much worse with the A8 due to the torque converter, and the TCM having to decide how to downshift before it goes. Getting a throttle controller really won't change that at all. It may give the illusion that its helping, though, because the increased voltage will get the engine going a bit quicker.

Observe that M6 owners don't seem to report this problem very often, and the major difference is that they don't have a torque converter and a TCM. My LTG M6 has very good, near instant throttle response. It is, however, very artificially boosted in the beginning of pedal travel, just like the A8 cars in tour and sport mode. If there's one thing I wish I had, it is the 1LEs track mode throttle map, which is modifiable via tuning.

man0steel · 04-02-2019, 04:27 PM

"track mode" throttle mapping is what all of us LT 2.0 owners would enjoy, but that's just me.

protovack · 04-02-2019, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by man0steel

"track mode" throttle mapping is what all of us LT 2.0 owners would enjoy, but that's just me.

For sure. I would keep tour as it is, and then assign a 1LE track style throttle map to the sport mode.

RyanR623 · 04-03-2019, 07:07 AM

I wonder if the vitesse throttle controller voids the warranty in any way.

For the SS, sport has the best throttle response. Weird to me but its been proven based on torque delivery maps and data blah blah. I think the thing for me that sometimes makes the throttle response feel sluggish is the way the damn transmission shifts. If you are just putting along at 45mph it's in 8th gear. Unless you make it downshift, it's going to feel sluggish when you give it light throttle. Running it in manual mode fixes it.

07-18-2017, 06:53 AM	#16
Childs Play Pizza & Wings Only $12.99 Drives: 2017 Camaro SS Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Houston, TX. Posts: 628	Why not this..? http://www.vitesse-motorsports.com/t...016+camaro.htm Worked great in the 5th gen. Haven't seen one yet in the 6th but I was impressed with it previously. Also, not related to the controller above, doesn't the track mode setting have a slightly less sensitive throttle than the sport mode? I remember reading that somewhere for the ZL1. Not sure if it's the same for the SS as well. __________________ H-Town Camaro Club Past Rides: 2012 Camaro 2SS/RS M6 2012 Camaro ZL1 A6 2017 Camaro 2SS M6

12-19-2018, 02:31 PM	#18
guapo Emerald Coast Camaros Drives: 2017 50th Camaro LT2/RS Join Date: May 2011 Location: Cview Posts: 1,009	Ok first observation with my 50th V6, seems like stepping on the gas is like using a brick,, I have to mash it very hard. I came from a 2013 LT2 V6 worlds apart.. Any suggestions or is there setting that change it. Picked up the car with only 3172 miles on it yesterday. Any thoughts..... __________________ 2017 LT2/RS, 50th addition. Airaid CAI, Solo Performance Axle back, sunroof, Smoked Led Markers

01-16-2019, 05:24 PM	#20
guapo Emerald Coast Camaros Drives: 2017 50th Camaro LT2/RS Join Date: May 2011 Location: Cview Posts: 1,009	It was in the shop recently and they said the pedal was fine. But have to go back on Monday and will see if I can check another camaro on the lot and see if matches.. __________________ 2017 LT2/RS, 50th addition. Airaid CAI, Solo Performance Axle back, sunroof, Smoked Led Markers

01-20-2019, 08:45 AM	#21
avalonandl Drives: 2019 ZL-1 Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Troy, MI & Naples, FL Posts: 2,019	Tony Mamo ported TB solves this is what I have read. Have not verified this. But I may try it. __________________ 2019 ZL-1 Acquired 4/23/21 at 6300 miles. Riverside Blue, A10, PDR. Traded in 2017 2SS with 6M and 32k miles. Continental Extreme Contact Sports. Now has 10,000 miles... 2012 Yukon XL Denali w/ 6.2 AWD

04-02-2019, 02:30 PM	#25
protovack Drives: 2019 2LT 2.0T M6 Riverside Blue Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: WA Posts: 847	It is useful to be specific about language here. - Throttle map: the variability in the relationship between how much you press the pedal, and how much fuel gets delivered to the engine, over the course of the RPM range. - Throttle response: the subjective feeling of how well your input is transmitted to the rear wheels. Can be good, or bad, depending on your sensation of mechanical and electrical delay between your pedal input and the rear wheels turning. The gas pedal sends an electric signal to the fuel system that can vary in intensity. The more voltage, the more fuel is sprayed. Roughly. Throttle controllers such as Vitesse simply boost the voltage sent, more fuel is injected, and RPMs come up faster. As far as I know, and correct me if I'm wrong, aftermarket throttle controllers have nothing to do with throttle mapping. All they do is boost voltage and hence, you will get the OEM throttle map for whatever drive mode you are in, just "boosted" to higher voltage and thus the engine will respond more to a given pedal press. Thus, they don't write in the ECU and don't void your warranty. I've never used one, personally, so I don't know exactly what they feel like. One of the questions I have is, does it eliminate that "dead space" to very quick pedal presses? Like if you just mash the throttle and let off, typically the signal never gets to the engine. I believe that is intentional in the design and not necessarily a bad thing. Power application should always be smooth and gradual to maintain chassis balance. Track mode has the most linear, 1:1 throttle mapping of any mode. You press 20%, you get 20% throttle, you press 60% you get 60% throttle. Which is far better for track driving, and really, any driving where you need to modulate the throttle with a high degree of detail. Invariably, though, some will assume there is "dead space", but it's not. That's just what pressing through 5, 10, 20, 30% throttle feels like. Sport and Tour mode are artificially boosted in the beginning of the pedal travel--you press 5%, you get 20% throttle. This is to make the car feel "zippier" around town and also just to make it so you don't have to press the throttle 20-30% every time you pull away from a stop (reduces foot fatigue for daily drivers). People are very accustomed to these non-linear throttle maps. It's a trick almost all auto manufacturers use to make their vehicles feel faster. My last subaru forester was a bad offender. It jumped off the line at the slightest throttle input. They did this to hide the fact that the engine was completely anemic and under-powered for the platform. It feels really fast on the test drive, but a month later when you load it up with the family and gear and get out on the highway, you discover how slow it really is. Throttle mapping is different from poor throttle response, which is often caused by a combination of electronic and mechanical delay between you pressing the pedal to the transmission actually turning the drive shaft. It's much worse with the A8 due to the torque converter, and the TCM having to decide how to downshift before it goes. Getting a throttle controller really won't change that at all. It may give the illusion that its helping, though, because the increased voltage will get the engine going a bit quicker. Observe that M6 owners don't seem to report this problem very often, and the major difference is that they don't have a torque converter and a TCM. My LTG M6 has very good, near instant throttle response. It is, however, very artificially boosted in the beginning of pedal travel, just like the A8 cars in tour and sport mode. If there's one thing I wish I had, it is the 1LEs track mode throttle map, which is modifiable via tuning. Last edited by protovack; 04-02-2019 at 04:41 PM.

07-17-2017, 01:41 PM	#15
MR-02 Drives: 2016 2SS M6 Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: ONT Posts: 185	Yes a tune is good, I had one on my Gen5, but Can any tuner brave up to offer at least half of the powertrain warranty that GM is giving us? Someone needs to create a needs a mild/safe tune that is undetectable like the VTC. Maybe a "Throttle response tune only" ---no crazy HP adjustments needed for some of us daily drivers.

07-18-2017, 02:32 PM	#17
Marty McFlew Banned Drives: 17 SuperSport Camaro 6 on the Flo' Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: USA Posts: 1,507	Mine is not mushy at all. My 2011 I had was mushy but my 17 feels like a cable.

03-31-2019, 04:21 PM	#22
Marko Drives: Camaro Join Date: May 2016 Location: USA Posts: 139	My 18 SS throttle lags off and on. No big deal. Sometimes feels like bad gas. At WOT, it runs Awesome. Thank god. I’m very happy with it. I also just bought a 19 Charger Scat pack. And the light throttle response is awesome on it. I always chirp the tires easily. 475 HP I think. And That 392 Hemi is terrible on gas though. The Camaro gets a lot better mpg’s

04-02-2019, 11:12 AM	#24
man0steel Drives: 2016 2LT vert 2.0 R/S A8 Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: oklahoma Posts: 106	This https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=494122

04-02-2019, 04:27 PM	#26
man0steel Drives: 2016 2LT vert 2.0 R/S A8 Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: oklahoma Posts: 106	"track mode" throttle mapping is what all of us LT 2.0 owners would enjoy, but that's just me.

04-03-2019, 07:07 AM	#28
RyanR623 Drives: SS A8, NPP, Red Hot Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 583	I wonder if the vitesse throttle controller voids the warranty in any way. For the SS, sport has the best throttle response. Weird to me but its been proven based on torque delivery maps and data blah blah. I think the thing for me that sometimes makes the throttle response feel sluggish is the way the damn transmission shifts. If you are just putting along at 45mph it's in 8th gear. Unless you make it downshift, it's going to feel sluggish when you give it light throttle. Running it in manual mode fixes it.

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