[DaveC113]

I did 4 BMW AutoX events this year, the SS 1LE and M2C are both in BS as far as SCCA rules. As a non-BMW I'm in open class, but I can get in the top 3 of BMW BS out of about 20 entries, and within ~1/2 sec of a M2C that won in the last race... and that's with stock tires and the M2C on RE71s, so I feel the SLE can beat the M2C with similar wheels/tires and driver skill in AutoX, and the difference will just get bigger the larger the track.

The Beamers all look like really nice cars, but they're not as single-minded about performance compared to the SS 1LE. They're definitely more luxurious and practical... and a lot more expensive... just depends on what you want. The previous gen V8 M3s are awesome and stupid-fast, that's what I'd look at for a BMW.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Zl1+911

https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...storical-data/

5 sec difference between the M2C and SS1LE on VIR

There ya go - matches my own RL experience

[ShaunG]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

I did 4 BMW AutoX events this year, the SS 1LE and M2C are both in BS as far as SCCA rules. As a non-BMW I'm in open class, but I can get in the top 3 of BMW BS out of about 20 entries, and within ~1/2 sec of a M2C that won in the last race... and that's with stock tires and the M2C on RE71s, so I feel the SLE can beat the M2C with similar wheels/tires and driver skill in AutoX, and the difference will just get bigger the larger the track.

The Beamers all look like really nice cars, but they're not as single-minded about performance compared to the SS 1LE. They're definitely more luxurious and practical... and a lot more expensive... just depends on what you want. The previous gen V8 M3s are awesome and stupid-fast, that's what I'd look at for a BMW.

I had a E92 M3 (had the V8). It can be a fast track car but takes much larger tires to get the most out of it and the TC is very restrictive so it HAS to completely turned off.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by ShaunG

I had a E92 M3 (had the V8). It can be a fast track car but takes much larger tires to get the most out of it and the TC is very restrictive so it HAS to completely turned off.

That's what is great about the SS 1LE: PTM Race provides for race calibrated TC. Very effective in limiting unnecessary wheel spin. But, if one tries too hard ya can still lose the rear, if there is enough momentum involved.
So the driver still needs to be involved.

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

There ya go - matches my own RL experience

Uhhh, the M2 Comp was 5 seconds faster than the SS 1LE. And it is certainly the faster car for autocross use, where power doesn't come into play very much. This is pretty hard to debate, especially if you know Mike's (Apexit's) resume. As further proof, SCCA is seriously considering moving the "track ponies" like the SS 1LE out of BS and back to FS. The M2C is roughly 200lbs lighter and seems to have a little better weight distribution. Finally, although it's the more powerful CS with extra suspension fanciness, an M2 CS just ran within 1s of the Cayman GT4 at Hockenheim. Although different than the M2 Comp, it shows how much potential that chassis has. However, on a track that emphasizes power the M2 Comp may be a lot closer to the 1LE, since the Camaro is a tick faster in acceleration.

I also think that in the real world, the price difference is likely to be a lot more than the $15k being discussed here. Usually you can't find a BMW with just the Comp package and no other option, and like Porsche the options add up very quickly and they aren't having to give discounts off sticker price to sell them. OTOH, I got a huge discount off sticker on my 2020 1LE in February without even trying very hard, and there's no way in hell I could have bought a new M2C for only $15k more. And as noted, the 1LE has a real warranty to cover track usage (good luck with the BMW!). So the value aspect swings really hard in the Chevy's direction. They are unbelievably capable cars for how little they really cost.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Msquared

Uhhh, the M2 Comp was 5 seconds faster than the SS 1LE. And it is certainly the faster car for autocross use, where power doesn't come into play very much. This is pretty hard to debate, especially if you know Mike's (Apexit's) resume. As further proof, SCCA is seriously considering moving the "track ponies" like the SS 1LE out of BS and back to FS. The M2C is roughly 200lbs lighter and seems to have a little better weight distribution. Finally, although it's the more powerful CS with extra suspension fanciness, an M2 CS just ran within 1s of the Cayman GT4 at Hockenheim. Although different than the M2 Comp, it shows how much potential that chassis has. However, on a track that emphasizes power the M2 Comp may be a lot closer to the 1LE, since the Camaro is a tick faster in acceleration.

I also think that in the real world, the price difference is likely to be a lot more than the $15k being discussed here. Usually you can't find a BMW with just the Comp package and no other option, and like Porsche the options add up very quickly and they aren't having to give discounts off sticker price to sell them. OTOH, I got a huge discount off sticker on my 2020 1LE in February without even trying very hard, and there's no way in hell I could have bought a new M2C for only $15k more. And as noted, the 1LE has a real warranty to cover track usage (good luck with the BMW!). So the value aspect swings really hard in the Chevy's direction. They are unbelievably capable cars for how little they really cost.

You dont say?

2017 SS 1LE #53 on the list 2:54.8
2019 M2 Competition #85 on the list 2:59.7

Lower laptime means faster car in my book

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

You dont say?

2017 SS 1LE #53 on the list 2:54.8
2019 M2 Competition #85 on the list 2:59.7

Lower laptime means faster car in my book

Shit, my mistake. I somehow read "2:49.7" for the BMW.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Msquared

Shit, my mistake. I somehow read "2:49.7" for the BMW.

Well, shit happens to the best of us

[Dabjbr]

I guess I should chime in here...

My background consists of still owning a 2007 bmw 335 e92, FBO + meth, LSD, and m3 suspension upgrades. (Probably should’ve bought the m3 to begin with but it was fun building the 335 up and in many ways, it was faster than the comparable m counterpart (although less reliable). I have 260k mikes on it, used as commuter car but also have many HPDE events. I retired it from track after a meth spill that burned the main wiring harness. Now it’s just a weekend play car that sticks around solely because my 16 yr son wants it.

Anyway, my point is I have a lot of bmw experience. In car and under the hood, which was a shit ton considering how many times I had to replace thermostats, fuel pumps, etc. I remain a bmw fan because the way the car handles but damn did I grow tired of wrenching it and praying it could handle a 20 minute track session without going into limp mode.

Fast forward to today. In my search for a fun car wih relatively low track cost (meaning not a lot of modifications to be track ready), I considered a nd2 miata, mustang but at the end was focused on the m2c.

I was set on buying it but struggled finding a mt. While searching, i test drove a 1le (blame all the YouTube comparison videos) on the same day I test drove the m2c.

Well, I’ll admit, the bmw interior is more upscale, airy, roomier despite smaller exterior dimensions, and felt good.

But then I drove the 1le... and shit, I was surprised. I enjoyed the handling way more. It felt flatter around corners and the transmission is a true sweetheart. Then add on top of that PDR and the visceral engine/exhaust sound. I mean come on, the thing sounds incredible. Even with a 3k aftermarket exhaust, the m2c doesn’t compare.

The icing on the cake is the significant cost savings on the 1le. That savings only grows when accounting for mods, repairs, or maintenance.

In the end, I have now converted. I never saw it coming. Never thought I’d like a Camaro over an M but here I am. And every drive continues to put a stupid smile on my face that reinforces my decision.

I highly recommend the 1le over the m2c. And I still find it hard to believe that all you need to prepare for the track is an alignment and brake fluid!

[JKM]

I narrowed down my track/summer car choices between the 1LE and M2 Comp. Ended up with the 1LE due to the cost difference (at least up here in Canada), track warranty and the fact it should be quicker around the tracks I frequent. Plus little things like not being able to adjust much camber on a stock M2C because I wanted to keep whatever I bought as stock as possible.

Other than a track alignment and higher temp brake fluid, it's fully stock and I've had zero issues with about 15 track days. So far the consumables have been a set of front pads and a couple sets of tires.

[stealthmr]

Originally Posted by JKM

I narrowed down my track/summer car choices between the 1LE and M2 Comp. Ended up with the 1LE due to the cost difference (at least up here in Canada), track warranty and the fact it should be quicker around the tracks I frequent. Plus little things like not being able to adjust much camber on a stock M2C because I wanted to keep whatever I bought as stock as possible.

Other than a track alignment and higher temp brake fluid, it's fully stock and I've had zero issues with about 15 track days. So far the consumables have been a set of front pads and a couple sets of tires.

I was in the same boat. It was between 1LE and M2C. 1LE is faster, less expensive and V8 sounds better! It was a no brainer.

Just curious, have you only replaced with OEM tires or have you tried other brands?

[JKM]

Originally Posted by stealthmr

I was in the same boat. It was between 1LE and M2C. 1LE is faster, less expensive and V8 sounds better! It was a no brainer.

Just curious, have you only replaced with OEM tires or have you tried other brands?

So far I've stuck with the OEM Goodyears because (at least to me), they're fantastic track tires and cheaper than other comparable options. I'm debating on buying dedicated rims next year for a square setup, so would try other brands if I did that. Still undecided because so far my wear front to rear has been about equal, so not sure if it's worth it.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by JKM

So far I've stuck with the OEM Goodyears because (at least to me), they're fantastic track tires and cheaper than other comparable options. I'm debating on buying dedicated rims next year for a square setup, so would try other brands if I did that. Still undecided because so far my wear front to rear has been about equal, so not sure if it's worth it.

That's been my experience as well and i am on my 2nd 1LE now. Have tried RE71R on stock rims (295/30/20) square, liked them, but more money and the rear was a bit twitchy at T2 at Mosport. No faster vs stockers in my hands anyway. They last the same as stockers.
Then tried Cup2s in stock sizes, no faster but tons more money and the LF chunked on day 5.

I think G3R is a reliable tire for going faster and it does come in out stock sizes. Well priced, but F last less than half the time. So the budget would need to go up
I think that for those tires, running 19 square rims to rotate F with R would make most sense to increase longevity. This seems the best bang for the buck as they come close to R7 pace (or so it seems). Then again, there are some drivers, who virtually equal Hoosier pace on stock G3, so...

I may try G3R on stock rims just for a heck of it, but dont really intend to start spending more $ on the hobby as i already spend enough. Frankly I'd rather increase duration of fun in the car vs pace at this stage.

Beyond that, is getting a trailer. Something i dont plan on going back to Cheers!

[stealthmr]

I have 3 trackdays on OEM Goodyears and wear has been great so far. I agree they are fantastic tire.

I was also debating about going square stance with 305/30/19 on dedicated rims.

Another option is to go square 295/30/20 on OEM rims. Theoretically that should reduce understeer and give the option of swapping tires off rims. But if fronts are wearing at same rate as rears, then there is no point.