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Old 10-10-2021, 06:27 AM   #1
Smokin19

 
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Transmission tuning

With the off season coming for many of us the thought of engine builds begins. I am also contemplating my build and I am interested in hearing thoughts on who has tuned their tranny after their engine build(auto only of course). I realize not all mods depending on attained h.p. will not require a trans tune. But most mods are going to have an engine tune that may increase the redline. Just putting on headers will require a tune. With a redline increase shouldn't the shift point in the trans also be retuned? GM I am sure has a very conservative tune on the shift points and most cars would see an improvement even without an engine build. What do you say?
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Old 10-10-2021, 08:48 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smokin19 View Post
With the off season coming for many of us the thought of engine builds begins. I am also contemplating my build and I am interested in hearing thoughts on who has tuned their tranny after their engine build(auto only of course). I realize not all mods depending on attained h.p. will not require a trans tune. But most mods are going to have an engine tune that may increase the redline. Just putting on headers will require a tune. With a redline increase shouldn't the shift point in the trans also be retuned? GM I am sure has a very conservative tune on the shift points and most cars would see an improvement even without an engine build. What do you say?
We're going to put mine back together next week at which time TCM tuning can start. However, since the strips close this month, whatever tuning takes place would have to be on the highway and I'm uncertain what edits can be made there.
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'20 ZL1 1LE A10
OEM forged LT4 376 cid short block,
Custom long block,
Edelbrock 2650, snout/inlet ported by KONG,
All bolt-ons,
DynoJet - 100 oct:
965whp/870trq, NW 103mm, 3"/9.18" pullies,
981whp/967trq, NW 112mm, 2.75"/9.18" pullies,
DynoJet - 104 oct: Dyno pending,
?whp/?trq, NW 112mm, 2.75"/9.18" pullies,
Nitto N05 275/19, TOYO R888R 325/19,
Denver 60 ft./1/4 mile/mph/DA (March 2023).
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Old 10-10-2021, 07:21 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSH View Post
We're going to put mine back together next week at which time TCM tuning can start. However, since the strips close this month, whatever tuning takes place would have to be on the highway and I'm uncertain what edits can be made there.
The TCM can be tuned right on the dyno and cleaned up on the street if needed.
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LME 377 LT4 Short Block | Magnuson 2650 80mm upper w/13% lower (9.06) | DSX Lid & Valve Covers | CSP Custom Cam w/32% fuel lobe | CID Heads | NW 103mm TB | Roto Fab Big Gulp | CSP 2" Headers w/Green GESI Gen 2 Cats | Borla 3" Full Cat Back w/ S-Type| Mighty Mouse Wild Catch Can| Custom Holley Low side Fuel system| TooHigh PSI Port Injection w/Holley Controller | Forced Inductions Interchiller w/2 gallon fender tank | TK Performance built 10L90
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Old 10-10-2021, 08:49 PM   #4
KILLA BEE
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Houston horsepower sells unlocked tcm give them a call look at there Ig. 800.00
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Old 10-10-2021, 09:33 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camaro1973 View Post
The TCM can be tuned right on the dyno and cleaned up on the street if needed.
Dynos and streets don't produce great 60 ft times.
__________________
'20 ZL1 1LE A10
OEM forged LT4 376 cid short block,
Custom long block,
Edelbrock 2650, snout/inlet ported by KONG,
All bolt-ons,
DynoJet - 100 oct:
965whp/870trq, NW 103mm, 3"/9.18" pullies,
981whp/967trq, NW 112mm, 2.75"/9.18" pullies,
DynoJet - 104 oct: Dyno pending,
?whp/?trq, NW 112mm, 2.75"/9.18" pullies,
Nitto N05 275/19, TOYO R888R 325/19,
Denver 60 ft./1/4 mile/mph/DA (March 2023).
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Old 10-10-2021, 09:52 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSH View Post
Dynos and streets don't produce great 60 ft times.

JSH.... Any tuner with knowledge knows what they need to adjust in the TCM bud. You don't need to be at the track to tune the TCM. You make adjustments when needed at the track, and you just said 60 ft times... 1st gear.


I thought you were smarter then this? The amount of disinformation in all your threads and responses is simply astonishing.
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928rwhp - 93 | 1040rwhp/898rwrq - E65 SAE

LME 377 LT4 Short Block | Magnuson 2650 80mm upper w/13% lower (9.06) | DSX Lid & Valve Covers | CSP Custom Cam w/32% fuel lobe | CID Heads | NW 103mm TB | Roto Fab Big Gulp | CSP 2" Headers w/Green GESI Gen 2 Cats | Borla 3" Full Cat Back w/ S-Type| Mighty Mouse Wild Catch Can| Custom Holley Low side Fuel system| TooHigh PSI Port Injection w/Holley Controller | Forced Inductions Interchiller w/2 gallon fender tank | TK Performance built 10L90
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Old 10-11-2021, 07:45 AM   #7
radz28
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Some gears are short-shifted before redline in some gears. 1st, and 3rd (if I recall) are also limiting torque. That will likely result in the throttle not opening all the way, or perhaps, some timing being pulled, all in order to keep torque below GM's thresholds. Optimizing these settings (and more) can net probably most cars good gains, because even stock cars seem to benefit from, at least, the torque reduction regimes.

Your '19 might come with a T87a, which you can get from HPTuners, unlock for about $250, and start tuning away. I know my '20 has the T93 (and all '20s), but have read some '19 ZLEs come with T93s, too. If that's the case for you, then you'll have to go to HHP and get one of their conversions. My tuning will start this week, after I receive mine tomorrow. I'll probably have some impressions this time next week. I'm not looking to change much though.

I have been told a couple times about how the tranny tune can come from the ECM. On another car I know, we've played with the VTT and VVE and can definitely tell the transmission shifts a little differently. There are spark changes that can be adjusted, too, that can help. Those are the ones I've been playing with, but I believe there are more. We've tried to only touch the least amount as possible on the other car to be safe.

I'd recommend getting a tune for the tranny, regardless of what some other say. There ARE calibrators magnitudes smarter and more experienced, but we've seen gains from relatively good testing, from only tranny tuning, so...
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Old 10-11-2021, 08:15 AM   #8
Smokin19

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radz28 View Post
Some gears are short-shifted before redline in some gears. 1st, and 3rd (if I recall) are also limiting torque. That will likely result in the throttle not opening all the way, or perhaps, some timing being pulled, all in order to keep torque below GM's thresholds. Optimizing these settings (and more) can net probably most cars good gains, because even stock cars seem to benefit from, at least, the torque reduction regimes.

Your '19 might come with a T87a, which you can get from HPTuners, unlock for about $250, and start tuning away. I know my '20 has the T93 (and all '20s), but have read some '19 ZLEs come with T93s, too. If that's the case for you, then you'll have to go to HHP and get one of their conversions. My tuning will start this week, after I receive mine tomorrow. I'll probably have some impressions this time next week. I'm not looking to change much though.

I have been told a couple times about have the tranny tune can come from the ECM. On another car I know, we've played with the VTT and VVE and can definitely tell the transmission shifts a little differently. There are spark changes that can be adjusted, too, that can help. Those are the ones I've been playing with, but I believe there are more. We've tried to only touch the least amount as possible on the other car to be safe.

I'd recommend getting a tune for the tranny, regardless of what some other say. There ARE calibrators magnitudes smarter and more experienced, but we've seen gains from relatively good testing, from only tranny tuning, so...
Thanks for the info, I don't track my car and only street use. Saying that, I do want to protect my trans from the added tq of my build. I didn't realize some parameters could be changed in the ECM to help the trans. I will talk to my builder about this. You can never learn enough about these cars.
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BTR Stg II cam w/ 38% fuel lobe, ARH 2" headers into 3" w/cats, AWE Touring, Kong X port, Weapon X triple ht exchangers, NW 103, Rotofab big gulp, DSX lowside, TCM tune, BMR Lockout, Mustang dyno 720 rwhp, 634 rwtq.
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Old 10-11-2021, 10:23 AM   #9
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The trans tune does not come from the ECM side. There are things that can be done on the ECM side to improve how the trans behaves. Nothing beats tuning both sides correctly.

My tuned A8 is on a different level then a stock TCM A10 car. Stock A8 tune is bush league compared to the stock A10 tune. Now I haven't driven a fully tuned A10 yet but I am sure it would be as good or better then the A8 is it is simply a better overall transmission. I adjusted some things on the ECU side on my brother's A10 ZL1 and it helped quite a bit. The biggest annoyance for me is the converter locking in each gear...it's annoying as hell on the A10. Most of you don't know any better because you haven't ridden in a car that doesn't do that. I can not fix that unless I have access to the TCM...so for that reason alone I would most definitely tune the TCM. But the thing is most tuners won't touch that. I do it for improved driveability even though you lose a touch of fuel mileage. I just want to feel the transmission shift, not shift then feel like it half shifts when it locks the converter. Always hated that from GM. I hate it on my Acadia...once warranty is up I'll tuning it out just like I have done on every GM vehicle I have owned clear back to my 2000 Yukon. There are other reasons to tune as well. I believe you could raise the shift points up and it would help. The stock tune has the A10 shifting early in some gears.

All that being said, if you are not worried about the throttle not opening all the way in 1st gear and a couple early shifts, you can improve how the A10 behaves from the ECM side and get by just fine without tuning the TCM for a mild build.
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Old 10-11-2021, 10:56 AM   #10
radz28
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I said that poorly... I meant there's some influence from the ECM. Thanks for setting me straight, and making it clear, King'.
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Magnuson Magnum DI TVS2650R / HHP TCM / PLM Heat Exchanger / ZLE Cradle bushings / BMR Chassis-Suspension Stuff / aFe bars / 17" Drag Pack / Diode Dynamics LEDs / ACS Composites Guards / CF Dash / tint / other stuffs
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Old 10-11-2021, 11:22 AM   #11
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No worries!
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Old 10-11-2021, 12:47 PM   #12
JSH


 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camaro1973 View Post
JSH.... Any tuner with knowledge knows what they need to adjust in the TCM bud. You don't need to be at the track to tune the TCM. You make adjustments when needed at the track, and you just said 60 ft times... 1st gear.

I thought you were smarter then this? The amount of disinformation in all your threads and responses is simply astonishing.
Stop trolling me.

I said, "... whatever tuning takes place would have to be on the highway and I'm uncertain what edits can be made there."

You said, "... You make adjustments when needed at the track."

We said the same thing. Make some TCM edits on the dyno, some on the road, some at the track.

Stop with all your crap. Is there a way to block you?
__________________
'20 ZL1 1LE A10
OEM forged LT4 376 cid short block,
Custom long block,
Edelbrock 2650, snout/inlet ported by KONG,
All bolt-ons,
DynoJet - 100 oct:
965whp/870trq, NW 103mm, 3"/9.18" pullies,
981whp/967trq, NW 112mm, 2.75"/9.18" pullies,
DynoJet - 104 oct: Dyno pending,
?whp/?trq, NW 112mm, 2.75"/9.18" pullies,
Nitto N05 275/19, TOYO R888R 325/19,
Denver 60 ft./1/4 mile/mph/DA (March 2023).
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Old 10-11-2021, 02:32 PM   #13
Smokin19

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingLT1 View Post
The trans tune does not come from the ECM side. There are things that can be done on the ECM side to improve how the trans behaves. Nothing beats tuning both sides correctly.

My tuned A8 is on a different level then a stock TCM A10 car. Stock A8 tune is bush league compared to the stock A10 tune. Now I haven't driven a fully tuned A10 yet but I am sure it would be as good or better then the A8 is it is simply a better overall transmission. I adjusted some things on the ECU side on my brother's A10 ZL1 and it helped quite a bit. The biggest annoyance for me is the converter locking in each gear...it's annoying as hell on the A10. Most of you don't know any better because you haven't ridden in a car that doesn't do that. I can not fix that unless I have access to the TCM...so for that reason alone I would most definitely tune the TCM. But the thing is most tuners won't touch that. I do it for improved driveability even though you lose a touch of fuel mileage. I just want to feel the transmission shift, not shift then feel like it half shifts when it locks the converter. Always hated that from GM. I hate it on my Acadia...once warranty is up I'll tuning it out just like I have done on every GM vehicle I have owned clear back to my 2000 Yukon. There are other reasons to tune as well. I believe you could raise the shift points up and it would help. The stock tune has the A10 shifting early in some gears.

All that being said, if you are not worried about the throttle not opening all the way in 1st gear and a couple early shifts, you can improve how the A10 behaves from the ECM side and get by just fine without tuning the TCM for a mild build.
Thanks for the explanation. My build will be mild 700-750 with Kong X port, 38% fuel cam, low side pump, 103 NM, Kooks 2" w/cats to stock muffer, larger 3 front Hxc for cooling, MM cc, etc. I will talk to the Mustang tuner at the shop about his tune. I don't track the car, strictly street.
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BTR Stg II cam w/ 38% fuel lobe, ARH 2" headers into 3" w/cats, AWE Touring, Kong X port, Weapon X triple ht exchangers, NW 103, Rotofab big gulp, DSX lowside, TCM tune, BMR Lockout, Mustang dyno 720 rwhp, 634 rwtq.
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Old 10-11-2021, 02:41 PM   #14
Camaro1973

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smokin19 View Post
Thanks for the explanation. My build will be mild 700-750 with Kong X port, 38% fuel cam, low side pump, 103 NM, Kooks 2" w/cats to stock muffer, larger 3 front Hxc for cooling, MM cc, etc. I will talk to the Mustang tuner at the shop about his tune. I don't track the car, strictly street.
Definitely get the tcm tuned if your installing a cam.
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928rwhp - 93 | 1040rwhp/898rwrq - E65 SAE

LME 377 LT4 Short Block | Magnuson 2650 80mm upper w/13% lower (9.06) | DSX Lid & Valve Covers | CSP Custom Cam w/32% fuel lobe | CID Heads | NW 103mm TB | Roto Fab Big Gulp | CSP 2" Headers w/Green GESI Gen 2 Cats | Borla 3" Full Cat Back w/ S-Type| Mighty Mouse Wild Catch Can| Custom Holley Low side Fuel system| TooHigh PSI Port Injection w/Holley Controller | Forced Inductions Interchiller w/2 gallon fender tank | TK Performance built 10L90
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