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Old 12-09-2017, 10:16 PM   #1
KingLT1


 
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Jesel Pedastal rocker arms.

Looks like Jesel dropped a full roller that is a Pedastal mount in 1.8 & 1.9 ratio for the LT1 & 4.

http://www.lsxmag.com/features/pri-c...on-a-pedestal/

Discuss.
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Old 12-10-2017, 05:43 AM   #2
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Hmmm,

I wonder what the weight over the valve and push rod difference is vs. stock. I understand the reasoning for the adjustability over the pushrod in a race car with short travel lifters or a solid roller but to me it adds something not needed on your basic street car or H/C build. The point of the stock rocker is get the pushrod length correct and bolt it down.

These would have been helpful on a LS7 headed 454 I did a while ago. The lifters we used only had .020" plunger travel to work with. It was a huge PITA to get it all right.
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Old 12-10-2017, 07:59 AM   #3
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If you mill your heads, would these become more beneficial?
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Old 12-10-2017, 08:34 AM   #4
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Full Rollers will always have a benefit over a slider. Reduces side loading especially at higher lifts. Sure the stock units are fine in a stock application, or even some cam setups, but if you want a cam that is well over .600 lift, these seem like they would be a good option.

Heads being milled does not matter. You can handle that in a couple of ways.

1) Measure push rod length and buy shorter push rods. This would be much cheaper then buying adjustable rockers.

2) Switch to more costly adjustable rockers. The benefits are much more precise preload adjustment across all valves.

Stock lifters have a ton of plunger travel, so they can soak up some variances in lifter pre load. As pray say stated, valvetrain adjustability becomes much more critical with short travel and solid lifters where you have a narrow range of adjustment you need to be within.
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Old 12-10-2017, 09:59 AM   #5
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Side load is always an issue and the LT's I think are going to have that issue in the long run with the high rocker ratio. With the heads I have been porting lately I have noticed some guide ware and one head was trashed. We had to put guides in it. However, the real issue of the pedestal mount has not been solved. I hope Jesel did their homework and got the wipe pattern correct on these. Yellow Terra didn't and provided shims. I am sure there is a U-shaped shim but it wasn't mentioned in the quick read. Regardless of tip, there will be side load if we can't set rocker height and wipe pattern.
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Old 12-10-2017, 11:40 AM   #6
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According to the article they are lighter than stock

The 1.9 ratio adds a bit of lift over a stock 1.8.

Interested...

Thoughts ? Ls3 guys have added rockers and got power...10 hp? Would the 1.9 be safe ? Would the 1.9 be useless/ bad idea with a small cam?

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Old 12-10-2017, 01:47 PM   #7
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I though LS3 heads had room for higher lift flow, but the LT1 kind of stalls, even though GM gave the LS3 and LT1 the same cam specs I think?

Why do yall think there has been so little support for the LT1 for aftermarket? I guess people don't see much of an advantage moving from the LS3, especially given fueling capacity issues with DI.
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Old 12-10-2017, 07:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmitchell17 View Post
I though LS3 heads had room for higher lift flow, but the LT1 kind of stalls, even though GM gave the LS3 and LT1 the same cam specs I think?

Why do yall think there has been so little support for the LT1 for aftermarket? I guess people don't see much of an advantage moving from the LS3, especially given fueling capacity issues with DI.
If I remember tomorrow I will post up my flow number from my LS3 heads vs. my LT1 heads On my bench. Do to the valve size, the LS3 is better down low but does not flow as much up high. But it is much easier to get the LS3 head to flow up to .700" lift than the LT1. The LT1 has a much worse short turn that you have to get right along with the with the angles and margins on the seat. I would be willing to bet the C/D of the LT1 head is better. Now the exhaust of the LT1 sucks and there isn't a whole lot you can to about it. I am getting mine really good but they don't flow like my LS3 exhaust ports.
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Old 12-10-2017, 10:06 PM   #9
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Pray do you have any thoughts for adding the 1.9 for a quick and easy way to add hp on a bolt on car like mine ? Would I need springs ?

What about in the future if I get your stage 1 heads/cam? Would it work with those ?
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Old 12-11-2017, 04:31 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULTRAZLS1 View Post
Pray do you have any thoughts for adding the 1.9 for a quick and easy way to add hp on a bolt on car like mine ? Would I need springs ?

What about in the future if I get your stage 1 heads/cam? Would it work with those ?
I don't really know man. That is a lot of rocker. If they fit just fine and there are no geometry issues then I guess it would work. As long as you can keep the roller tip in the center of the stem with a .060" wipe pattern it should work. I would have to check the install height of the stock spring but I think it is around 1.900". The stock seat/seal height would have to be measured as well to see where the retainer ends up with the extra lift. You would get a couple degrees of duration and what, .030" lift approximately. I would have to do the math.

I wouldn't do it with one of my cams though. They are designed around the 1.8's. If you are running them when you get a cam, let me know and I will adjust accordingly.
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Old 12-11-2017, 04:54 AM   #11
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My LS3 vs. LT1 head flow. LS3 has 2.165" intake valve and a 275cc runner. The LT1 head has a 2.125" intake valve and a 313cc runner. The exhaust valves are the same 1.59". These numbers are off of my bench. Each head flows about 20cfm more on a 28" bench by .600" lift. They ended up being closer than I thought.

.........LS3 int......LT1 int.......LS3 exh......LT1 exh
.300.......228...........220............185....... ....189
.400.......280...........280............235....... ....238
.500.......318...........330............264....... ....260
.600.......349...........360............274....... ....270
.650.......351...........366............277....... ....270
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Old 12-11-2017, 09:00 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULTRAZLS1 View Post
Pray do you have any thoughts for adding the 1.9 for a quick and easy way to add hp on a bolt on car like mine ? Would I need springs ?

What about in the future if I get your stage 1 heads/cam? Would it work with those ?
I am pretty sure you will need a .600 lift spring if the LT1 springs are similar to the LS3. You will have about 1400.00 wrapped up in this. So price vs gains is about what a MSD intake would be except gains would be across the entire curve. The nice thing is these are fully adjustable, so getting the correct geometry and wipe pattern should not be a issue.

Far as adding a cam, I have SLP 1.85's with a cam in my LS6. The SLP rockers were based on the stock design and the cam was designed for the higher ratio rockers. I have not had any issues with them. I only went this route because I already had the rockers on prior to going heads/cam. I would think you should be fine if the cam is spec'd around the rockers...plus you will have full adjustability.

Imho, I would probably just stick with stock trunion upgraded rockers if you go with cam and full travel lefter. Or go with these Jesel 1.8's if you run a reduced travel lifter. 1.9 is getting up there, but the W-body crowd ran modified stock 1.9 ratio rockers on the supercharged 3800 cars with no issues.
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Last edited by KingLT1; 12-11-2017 at 09:25 AM.
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:27 AM   #13
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Thanks for the replies.... decisions decisions
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Old 12-11-2017, 12:01 PM   #14
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I hope these aren't the one that they priced to me for 3600 bucks... hopefully they are like 1300 or so
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