Homepage Garage Wiki Register Social Groups Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
#Camaro6
Go Back   CAMARO6 > Engine | Drivetrain | Powertrain Technical Discussions > Forced Induction Discussions


BeckyD @ James Martin Chevy


Post Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-17-2022, 06:25 PM   #15
JP374
 
Drives: 21 Lt1
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: 48047
Posts: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjperformance View Post
Not clear on the pulley size to psi ratio. Im 99% sure i have the 4.13 inch. At least thats what the parts list says. And i am getting 9.5 psi at 6800 rpm. Pretty sure i checked the actual part too. So not sure what the 3.9 = 7 psi and 4.13 = 5 psi is about. Ive always gotten 6 to 7 psi with the 4.13 inch prior to trans tune and 8 to 9.5 after.
Ok. Im going off of what the PC tech told me. When I ordered the kit I told them I wanted 7psi at 6500 rpm. When I got the kit it had a 3.9 pulley on the head unit. I talked to PC tech about my concerns running on e85 etc and they said IF I wanted to drop to 5 psi Id have to use the 4.13 pulley or 4 for 6 psi, PC tech also told me Id be ok with my setup on e85 with LT4 components and to expect around 630-640 whp.. Just what I was told. My current fbo tune has my shifts at 7k, Rick however said we would trim them back with the PC tune thou.
JP374 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2022, 09:28 PM   #16
KingLT1


 
KingLT1's Avatar
 
Drives: 2016 1SS NFG A8
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: 46804
Posts: 5,319
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP374 View Post
Thx King!

Looks like I have been overthinking this.

Im gonna stick with the 7psi setup and see how it plays out. Im sure at 600 whp it will be a whole new animal! The pump content by me is 74-80% so sounds like Ill be good. I daily drive the car in the summer thats part of the reason I was trying to keep it simple with full e85. I do know I dont want to run any meth inj etc.

Im in Mi so if I can get my kit installed soon then I can monitor the data while its still cold out and that should help the tuner to be able to get the fuel/timing data dialed in better.

I have the DSX aux kit will that help with anything vs the jms booster?

Thanks
DSX will be fine.
__________________
2016 NGM 1SS A8
Options-2SS Leather/NPP
Perf. mods-Whipple 2.9/Fuel System/Flex Fuel/103mm TB/Rotofab Big Gulp/Cat Deletes/Corsa NPP
KingLT1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2022, 09:29 PM   #17
JP374
 
Drives: 21 Lt1
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: 48047
Posts: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingLT1 View Post
DSX will be fine.
Perfect! Thx Kinglt1
JP374 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 06:23 AM   #18
wnta1ss

 
Drives: 2017 Camaro 1SS
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: NH
Posts: 1,568
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjperformance View Post
Not clear on the pulley size to psi ratio. Im 99% sure i have the 4.13 inch. At least thats what the parts list says. And i am getting 9.5 psi at 6800 rpm. Pretty sure i checked the actual part too. So not sure what the 3.9 = 7 psi and 4.13 = 5 psi is about. Ive always gotten 6 to 7 psi with the 4.13 inch prior to trans tune and 8 to 9.5 after.
Wow, if he has that much smaller a pulley than you, IMO he will run out of fuel quicker than you are.
wnta1ss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 08:00 AM   #19
JP374
 
Drives: 21 Lt1
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: 48047
Posts: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnta1ss View Post
Wow, if he has that much smaller a pulley than you, IMO he will run out of fuel quicker than you are.
Yes, I would think so too.

I called PC tech again yesterday and was asking about the difference in pulleys etc, it appears that by my serial # mine is setup for 7 psi @ 7k rpm not the 7psi @ 6500 rpm like I ordered. So @ 6500 rpm they said I will be closer to 5-6 psi. Im just gonna listen to my tuner and go from there. He says its gonna be close but will be able to run e60-70 NP at all. As for rwhp we shall see, Im thinking it would do close to 600 whp on either 93 or e60 ish.

I was trying to avoid blending but like King and a few others have said theres not much benefit after the e60 point. Looking fwd to see where it ends up and to feel the power difference with the P1-X 😎
JP374 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 09:18 AM   #20
KingLT1


 
KingLT1's Avatar
 
Drives: 2016 1SS NFG A8
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: 46804
Posts: 5,319
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP374 View Post
Yes, I would think so too.

I called PC tech again yesterday and was asking about the difference in pulleys etc, it appears that by my serial # mine is setup for 7 psi @ 7k rpm not the 7psi @ 6500 rpm like I ordered. So @ 6500 rpm they said I will be closer to 5-6 psi. Im just gonna listen to my tuner and go from there. He says its gonna be close but will be able to run e60-70 NP at all. As for rwhp we shall see, Im thinking it would do close to 600 whp on either 93 or e60 ish.

I was trying to avoid blending but like King and a few others have said theres not much benefit after the e60 point. Looking fwd to see where it ends up and to feel the power difference with the P1-X 😎
My friends P1-x car makes 9.5 psi on a 3.9 pulley at 6600rpm. It has LT4 fuel system and cat delete on 93 octane.
__________________
2016 NGM 1SS A8
Options-2SS Leather/NPP
Perf. mods-Whipple 2.9/Fuel System/Flex Fuel/103mm TB/Rotofab Big Gulp/Cat Deletes/Corsa NPP
KingLT1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 09:24 AM   #21
JP374
 
Drives: 21 Lt1
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: 48047
Posts: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingLT1 View Post
My friends P1-x car makes 9.5 psi on a 3.9 pulley at 6600rpm. It has LT4 fuel system and cat delete on 93 octane.
Oh boy! Good to know. I dont understand how all these can be setup different? Does it have to do with the head unit itself? If PC tech is saying 7psi @ 7k Id like to value that as 100% true info. Now Idk if I should just buy a 4.13 pulley or not. PC says Im not gonna see 7psi until 7k rpm.ugh!!!!
JP374 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 11:05 AM   #22
cjperformance
 
cjperformance's Avatar
 
Drives: 2017 Camaro SS 50th Anniversary
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Missouri
Posts: 352
They may be taking into account any bolt ons you may have installed.

I would think that, for example, a freer-flowing exhaust is going to lower intake manifold psi for a given pulley.

So with my stock cats installed and 4.13 pulley, it makes 9.5 psi at 6800. Maybe if I changed the intake manifold, and installed long tubes, i'd get lower intake psi with that pulley. The system might "back up" in the intake.

Kinda like sticking your hand over the end of your leaf blower. It's going to build more psi due to the restriction?
__________________
2017 50th Anniversary Edition | P1X Stage 2
DSX Aux Low Side, Flex Fuel, Baro Breakout, 3-bar MAP | LT4 High Side
CircleD 3K Stall | QA1 CF Driveshaft
Front - Racestar Recluse 95 20x10 22 offset NT 555 G2 285/30-20
Rear - Racestar Recluse 95 20x11 41 offset NT05 305/30-20
Best 11.53@123 Prior to Trans Tune & Stall Converter
cjperformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 11:11 AM   #23
cjperformance
 
cjperformance's Avatar
 
Drives: 2017 Camaro SS 50th Anniversary
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Missouri
Posts: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP374 View Post
Hey guys, I just received my P1X kit setup for 7psi (3.9" pulley) and am looking for some insight as to being able to run full pump e85 (75% locally). I have the lt4 stuff along with a DSX aux pump. I have been told my setup will be good to around 640 wheel with the 7psi pulley before running out of fuel? I've also been told I might want to consider a 4.13" pulley to go with 5psi to be able to run full e85? I'm not so much about chasing the numbers as I am to being able to run e85. PC techs have told me I will be fine with my 7psi setup on e85. I am sure there are plenty of guys on here with results. I haven't installed the PC on the car yet just trying to make sure I have everything sorted out. The current mods I have now are Flex fuel, MSD IM, 103 tb,2" ARH system. I also have the baro breakout harness too.

Thanks guys!!
Just realized you have an MSD intake. I heard from someone wise, that if that's a 2-piece intake manifold... you may want to ensure you are being conservative with the boost.
__________________
2017 50th Anniversary Edition | P1X Stage 2
DSX Aux Low Side, Flex Fuel, Baro Breakout, 3-bar MAP | LT4 High Side
CircleD 3K Stall | QA1 CF Driveshaft
Front - Racestar Recluse 95 20x10 22 offset NT 555 G2 285/30-20
Rear - Racestar Recluse 95 20x11 41 offset NT05 305/30-20
Best 11.53@123 Prior to Trans Tune & Stall Converter
cjperformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 11:37 AM   #24
JP374
 
Drives: 21 Lt1
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: 48047
Posts: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjperformance View Post
Just realized you have an MSD intake. I heard from someone wise, that if that's a 2-piece intake manifold... you may want to ensure you are being conservative with the boost.
Yes Msd IM, 103 tb, 2 ARH LTs, high flow cats, x pipe, no afm valves. At the levels Im @ I should fine. If I step up the boost one day then Ill get a different intake at that time. I dont want to spend the $ to tune it twice if I need to swap pulley out for the bigger 4.13 one etc.

CJ how do you like the car with the PC? Quite a difference Id imagine?
JP374 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 12:02 PM   #25
JANNETTYRACING

 
JANNETTYRACING's Avatar
 
Drives: BLUE CAMARO ZL1 1LE M6
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ON THE DYNO WATERBURY CT.
Posts: 15,414
Lets break it down to What you need to make power.

Air and fuel.

Air you can expect about 10 Hp per 1 lb. of Air, for example 50 lbs of air per minute makes 500 HP

So Keep in mind if you try and run low boost you will never make any real power.

Fuel, Fuel quantity is based on 2 things Type of fuel, and Air flow.

With a given amount of air on gasoline, you need 1 lb. of fuel for every 12 lbs. of air at Full power.

On Ethanol the Amount will vary based on Ethanol content so about 1 lb of fuel for every 7 lbs of air for example

The more ethanol the more fuel you will need on that Same Amount of Air.

Can you make more power on Ethanol fuel vs gasoline?

Absolutely but the gains are only about 10% from pump to E85

So I don't agree with trying to run lower boost just so you can run more Ethanol.

Set the boost level at what it will tolerate on pump gas tuned well.

Then blend Ethanol until you get to about 90% of your fuel system capacity, You have to leave room.

You will see good gains up to about E-60 then they will taper off toward E85.
__________________
www.jannettyracing.com
Celebrating 35 years Performance parts, Installation, Fabrication, Dyno tuning, Remote custom tuning, and alignments. 203-753-7223 Waterbury CT. 06705
email tedj@jannettyracing.com

Last edited by JANNETTYRACING; 01-19-2022 at 02:49 PM.
JANNETTYRACING is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 12:34 PM   #26
JP374
 
Drives: 21 Lt1
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: 48047
Posts: 64
Very good info Ted. I guess I will leave the setup the way it is and once tuned on 93 we should have a better idea. Worst case I swap pulley and get it re tuned on 93, then start adding e85.

Any idea of the fuel system limits on 93 with LT4 fuel stuff with dsx aux?

Thanks
JP374 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 01:44 PM   #27
JANNETTYRACING

 
JANNETTYRACING's Avatar
 
Drives: BLUE CAMARO ZL1 1LE M6
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ON THE DYNO WATERBURY CT.
Posts: 15,414
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP374 View Post
Very good info Ted. I guess I will leave the setup the way it is and once tuned on 93 we should have a better idea. Worst case I swap pulley and get it re tuned on 93, then start adding e85.

Any idea of the fuel system limits on 93 with LT4 fuel stuff with dsx aux?

Thanks
670 on E60 on stock cam lobe

About 750 on E60 on 32% lobe
__________________
www.jannettyracing.com
Celebrating 35 years Performance parts, Installation, Fabrication, Dyno tuning, Remote custom tuning, and alignments. 203-753-7223 Waterbury CT. 06705
email tedj@jannettyracing.com
JANNETTYRACING is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2022, 02:15 PM   #28
KingLT1


 
KingLT1's Avatar
 
Drives: 2016 1SS NFG A8
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: 46804
Posts: 5,319
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP374 View Post
Oh boy! Good to know. I dont understand how all these can be setup different? Does it have to do with the head unit itself? If PC tech is saying 7psi @ 7k Id like to value that as 100% true info. Now Idk if I should just buy a 4.13 pulley or not. PC says Im not gonna see 7psi until 7k rpm.ugh!!!!
Probably difference in exhaust and intake manifold. but I would just use the smaller pulley and lower the shift rpm. My friend's car only made like 7psi @ 6100rpm and 3psi at 4500 rpm. So a larger pulley is just going to take longer to make boost and reduce power under the curve.

Here is a couple vids.

1st vid is a Heads Cam converter 4th gen on a 180shot, the P1x 6th gen, and My Whipple 6th gen. I gave the hit to both cars.

Second run is 4th gen vs my 6th gen hitting at the same time.

Both 6th gens are similar boost. I make like a half pound more peak but quite a bit more under the curve. I am on E40 he is on 93. All 3 cars tuned by me. 4th gen trans doesn't like the Nitrous through the shift. Just posting this for comparison on how much difference giving up the hit makes.

Either way I suggest doing what it takes to continue running E or a blend of because 93 and boost is leaving a lot on the table.

https://youtu.be/tG1dVSYPTiQ

https://youtu.be/FOG6LeYwju4
__________________
2016 NGM 1SS A8
Options-2SS Leather/NPP
Perf. mods-Whipple 2.9/Fuel System/Flex Fuel/103mm TB/Rotofab Big Gulp/Cat Deletes/Corsa NPP
KingLT1 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Post Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.