04-01-2016, 12:26 AM | #113 |
Here's the killer. I worked at a Dodge dealership until recently and I'm tired of seeing posts arguing price points. Realistically, of all the hellcat owners...how many paid anywhere near MSRP?! Limited numbers for both MY 15 and 16 have driven prices through the roof. We sold a hellcat challenger for $78k. I know lest than 10% of hellcat owners got them at or near MSRP. The ZL1 wasn't nearly as difficult to purchase. I hate seeing arguments that start with the hellcat is only $60k and you get all that performance...it's a bunch of smoke masking the flames of regret. The TRUTH is the hellcat costs on average somewhere around $70k because that's what people are paying. I bout my 2012 ZL1 #1158 at MSRP on May 24, 2012...fresh off the press. So I imagine the 17 ZL1 will find itself in my garage in the same fashion. So, back to my point...for the money there is no comparison between the Hellcat and the ZL1.
|
|
04-01-2016, 02:15 AM | #114 |
Drives: 14 Silverado LTZ Z71, 16 Camaro SS Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Jackson, Michigan
Posts: 4,407
|
Stock rubber zl1 all day.
On DR will be a drivers race. As for some who say a stock hellcat runs with a zo6 they are on crack. The cat would have hidden mods or the zo6 is a manual with bad driving. The hp to weight isn't even close. The zo6 has gone mid to low 10s 100% stock on stock tires. Truly stock hellcats can hit high tens with DR. It's honestly a closer race to the c6 zo6 looking at times over the years and trap speeds. Obviously it takes a gifted driver but bottom 11s and actually a 10.9 has been run with a stock c6 zo6. Traps into the 120s. Anyone who honestly thinks a hellcat runs neck and neck with a zo6 all things equal is a fool. Of course anything can happen on the street or track with such high hp and traction issues... |
04-01-2016, 06:26 AM | #115 | |
Drives: 2019 GT350 Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: NC
Posts: 3,232
|
Quote:
__________________
2019 GT350 RR
2013 Boss Mustang 2012 SRT Challenger 392 auto 12:40s 112 stock 2012 Ford Mustang 5.0. Brembo, 3:73s 2010 SS, LS3, Cammed, LTs, 12:20s 2004 Redfire Cobra, Pullied & Tuned 1986 GT, Ed Curtis 347ci, 11:20s motor. 10:30s 100-hp shot |
|
04-01-2016, 06:35 AM | #116 | |
Drives: Love the one you're with Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Downtown Charlie Brown
Posts: 11,850
|
Quote:
What I love about these studies are the fact they they don't real what the problems are. If I had my choice, I would be happy to drive a car that is lower on the list with a bullet proof drivetrian or major components that are reliable, but yet has a low rating because the radio or bluetooth suck. Seems like most of the complaints you here about with cars these days is how they can't connect their Iphone or some crap like that instead of a real issue. |
|
04-01-2016, 07:11 AM | #117 | |
Drives: 14 Silverado LTZ Z71, 16 Camaro SS Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Jackson, Michigan
Posts: 4,407
|
Quote:
A 400 lb heavier car with another 150 hp can hit mid to low 10s. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qsnQxxVzbAo 10.4@ 132. 10.3 with DR. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ijdRyRiygoE 10.3@131 stock with tire. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4_-6xmOGu4w 10.4 @ 134 stock and stock tires. Found 3 in a 5 minute YouTube search. They all lying ? It's possible I guess...but I don't see why not given 650hp and 3500lbs. My point was those saying a stock hellcat runs with that is wrong. Btw I said mid to low 10s |
|
04-01-2016, 07:12 AM | #118 | |
HAMMER PILOT
Drives: 13 ZL1#182, 85 CJ7, 16 Silverado Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tucson AZ
Posts: 4,386
|
Quote:
__________________
"DO YOU WANT ME TO PUT THE HAMMER DOWN?"
|
|
04-01-2016, 08:54 AM | #119 |
|
|
04-01-2016, 09:06 AM | #120 |
Drives: 2015 Blue Velvet Metallic ZL1 Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Orlando & Flagler Beach,FL
Posts: 1,453
|
Yes, FCA advertises it at 707hp but the stock auto Hellcats have been dyno'ed anywhere from 600-630 RWHP. So, if one uses a 20% parasitic power loss crank to wheels - crank comes in around 750hp......yeah, I know fuzzy math but there is credence to the fact that these are pushing more than their advertised 707hp.
. |
04-01-2016, 09:08 AM | #121 |
HAMMER PILOT
Drives: 13 ZL1#182, 85 CJ7, 16 Silverado Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tucson AZ
Posts: 4,386
|
So the SAE certification is bogus?
__________________
"DO YOU WANT ME TO PUT THE HAMMER DOWN?"
|
04-01-2016, 09:11 AM | #122 | |
I used to be Dragoneye...
|
Quote:
Otherwise...the same sort of math could suggest that stock Camaro SSs are actually producing 500-515hp. |
|
04-01-2016, 09:13 AM | #123 |
Drives: 2015 Blue Velvet Metallic ZL1 Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Orlando & Flagler Beach,FL
Posts: 1,453
|
|
04-01-2016, 09:13 AM | #124 | |
|
Quote:
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk
__________________
Current: '17 2SS Hyper Blue, A8, MRC, NPP
Past: '99 SS Camaro A4, '73 Camaro 383 A3 "Voices in your head are not considered insider information." 3800 Status - 6/16/16 (Built!) 6000 status - 6/29/16 (Delivered!) |
|
04-01-2016, 09:15 AM | #125 |
Drives: 2017 SS 1LE, 2017 Volt, 2013 Pilot Join Date: May 2014
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4,274
|
20% loss is way to high, today we see more like 10% ????
if we split the difference in the range posted above, to 615Rwhp, drive loss = 13%, which seems very probable. 20% loss ...NO WAY. Camaro is seeing about 11% loss.
__________________
2017 SS 1LE | HBM | Vortech V3-Si supercharger (620RWHP and 575ft lbs) | PDR | Black Bowties | Illuminated Front Black Bowtie | Illuminated Door Sills | Smoked Tails | vented seats mod
|
04-01-2016, 09:16 AM | #126 |
|
And you need to stop using chassis dyno numbers as the holy grail. What happens if you use 10 or 12%? Much closer to what is advertised right?
__________________
Current: '17 2SS Hyper Blue, A8, MRC, NPP
Past: '99 SS Camaro A4, '73 Camaro 383 A3 "Voices in your head are not considered insider information." 3800 Status - 6/16/16 (Built!) 6000 status - 6/29/16 (Delivered!) |
|
|
Post Reply
|
Thread Tools | |
|
|