[Umbriel]

Originally Posted by oldman

I ran almost a year with 32% lobe, 4" pulley P1 at 8 PSI, cam, heads, headers, LT1 injectors, LT1 pump. I asked Pray if I could start mixing some E85... he said "I don't know why you are NOT already out of fuel!" I think the 32% lobe (now 36% to 388%) makes a HUGE difference on the high side.

I don't know if the LT4 pump can take the bigger 36% to 38?% lobe, but if it can, I would think that is the cheaper route (lobe, LT4 pump, LT4 injectors) and it will let the engine breath. (650 AFM custom cam, 500 pump, 500 injectors) say $1900 all in, you do the labor, $2200 for a AFM delete cam and kit.

vs
Lingenfelter pump, LT4 injectors ($2000) easy labor

vs
LT4 pump, FIC injectors ($4000) easy labor

He would still need the low side, from my understanding that is the side that runs out first.

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[oldman]

Originally Posted by Umbriel

He would still need the low side, from my understanding that is the side that runs out first.

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Any combination of HS above still needs a lowside. I went DSX, hear good things about Skidmarks, just think the DSX was worth the extra. But as stated he wants the cheapest.

A complicated many point injection (water / etch / E85) through the LT4 blower top is going to be expensive too and since he would be completely dependent on the LT1 fuel system, any bad distribution or running out of fluid etc is going to be bad. The HS solution above to my mind is the only 100% stock dependability solutions. I was on the fence a long time before I just went with beefed DI system. It was the 100% stock dependability that tipped it to me.

I am interested in what people are doing with the lid injection, it would be nice to see a vendor show the A/F from all 8 header tubes... It does look like quality though:
https://weaponxmotorsports.com/produ...nt=37646535761


This thread was:32% lobe, LT4 HPFP, LT4 injectors on E85
https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=531285

[laynlo15]

A Magnuson Heartbeat.

[Umbriel]

Originally Posted by oldman

Any combination of HS above still needs a lowside. I went DSX, hear good things about Skidmarks, just think the DSX was worth the extra. But as stated he wants the cheapest.

A complicated many point injection (water / etch / E85) through the LT4 blower top is going to be expensive too and since he would be completely dependent on the LT1 fuel system, any bad distribution or running out of fluid etc is going to be bad. The HS solution above to my mind is the only 100% stock dependability solutions. I was on the fence a long time before I just went with beefed DI system. It was the 100% stock dependability that tipped it to me.

I am interested in what people are doing with the lid injection, it would be nice to see a vendor show the A/F from all 8 header tubes... It does look like quality though:
https://weaponxmotorsports.com/produ...nt=37646535761


This thread was:32% lobe, LT4 HPFP, LT4 injectors on E85
https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=531285

I'm going to read through that thread you posted. I'm pretty sure I'll be doing LT4 injectors and pump with the SMG low side and 32% lobe and hope I can't get 700 out of it on straight E85.

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[oldman]

Originally Posted by Umbriel

I'm going to read through that thread you posted. I'm pretty sure I'll be doing LT4 injectors and pump with the SMG low side and 32% lobe and hope I can't get 700 out of it on straight E85.

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I don't know if it works on the LT4 pump, but I would like for the 38% cam lobe.

[Drsagacity]

Originally Posted by Umbriel

I'm going to read through that thread you posted. I'm pretty sure I'll be doing LT4 injectors and pump with the SMG low side and 32% lobe and hope I can't get 700 out of it on straight E85.

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Ha! 700whp is a piece of cake. https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showt...street+brawler

You don’t even need e85 to make it happen. 700whp is easily achieved with blower + cam...if you want e85 you will be able to achieve 700whp on about 8psi or if you want to use 93 octane, run 10psi.

I am kind of with OP. For me, with stock internals I would prefer to be in the 600-650whp range.

[KingLT1]

Based on testing with my car...To run full e85(E80 max at the pumps) with a stock cam and no meth you will need LT4 injectors, ZL1 in-tank, and the LPE DI pump. That will handle about 8-9psi...with your current mods, you should hit that power goal easy.


That being said I don't know why you are so opposed to mixing down to around E60. Then you "might" get away with the LT4 DI pump...aside from that you can get pretty much all the timing and cooling benefits as E80(At the power and boost levels being discussed). It's not hard to mix at all...when I go to the pump, I pump 7.5 gallons of E85 and 2.5 gallons of E20. That puts me around E68 every time. I don't need to mix but full pump E85(actually E78) gains me nothing over E68 so I figured why not take the load off the fuel system.


This is straight up from testing on my car and my brothers C7 Z...not from he said she said or my tuner said. I have his Vette on E50 right now with the stock fuel system running 10-11 psi. High side holding fine, low side is dropping a touch but nothing crazy. That is with no BAP and just FSCM tuning.

Here is a good chart for reference far as mixing E85 and it's octane equivalency.

[F419sr1]

Originally Posted by oldman

I ran almost a year with 32% lobe, 4" pulley P1 at 8 PSI, cam, heads, headers, LT1 injectors, LT1 pump. I asked Pray if I could start mixing some E85... he said "I don't know why you are NOT already out of fuel!" I think the 32% lobe (now 36% to 388%) makes a HUGE difference on the high side.

I don't know if the LT4 pump can take the bigger 36% to 38?% lobe, but if it can, I would think that is the cheaper route (lobe, LT4 pump, LT4 injectors) and it will let the engine breath. (650 AFM custom cam, 500 pump, 500 injectors) say $1900 all in, you do the labor, $2200 for a AFM delete cam and kit.

vs
#2 Lingenfelter pump, LT4 injectors ($2000) easy labor

vs
LT4 pump, FIC injectors ($4000) easy labor

gut feeling the cam is going to do more than the next two, the middle one could be a stepping stone to "see" if it works...

High. High volume pump and injectors for my lt4 I was quoted $4500 parts only

[Umbriel]

Originally Posted by Drsagacity

Ha! 700whp is a piece of cake. https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showt...street+brawler



You don’t even need e85 to make it happen. 700whp is easily achieved with blower + cam...if you want e85 you will be able to achieve 700whp on about 8psi or if you want to use 93 octane, run 10psi.



I am kind of with OP. For me, with stock internals I would prefer to be in the 600-650whp range.

I'll read this thread as well but I definitely want to run E85 to help cool and since I'm running no cats.

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[steelheadrob]

I think to get where you want to go with the stock cam fuel lobe your going to have to spray some meth. I am currently running e60 with 11psi boost, full lt4 fueling set up and I starting to see some fall off in lowside, so I am currently installing a JMS BAP and that is with spaying meth. Even with your race weight, I think it will take at least 11psi of boost to get you to the 9s, maybe more. To do that on a stock cam on pump e85 you will need lt4 fueling plus meth.

[KingLT1]

I think he could do 11-12psi without meth but will need the LPE DI pump and will have to keep E content under 70.

@ E78 my High side is around 2600psi, Low side 68-70psi, Injectors 6.4ms @ 8-9psi.

@ E68-70, 2800psi high, 68-70psi low, injectors 5.7ms.

I bet I could run 11 psi on E60.

I agree he won't be able to run 11 psi on full E85 without a cam or meth. However like I said before you don't really need to, E60 is 104octane.

[F419sr1]

Originally Posted by KingLT1

I think he could do 11-12psi without meth but will need the LPE DI pump and will have to keep E content under 70.

@ E78 my High side is around 2600psi, Low side 68-70psi, Injectors 6.4ms @ 8-9psi.

@ E68-70, 2800psi high, 68-70psi low, injectors 5.7ms.

I bet I could run 11 psi on E60.

I agree he won't be able to run 11 psi on full E85 without a cam or meth. However like I said before you don't really need to, E60 is 104octane.

OP says he doesn't want to be mixing. A lot of good information here but drifting away from the goal of not mixing fuels.

[KingLT1]

Originally Posted by F419sr1

OP says he doesn't want to be mixing. A lot of good information here but drifting away from the goal of not mixing fuels.

Please read the discussion carefully.


He wouldn't need to mix at all to hit 650whp. Headers, E85, LT4 injector, LPE DI pump, low side, and 8-9psi would put him there. The mixing part came into the equation if he was going to turn it up further. 11 psi would put him likely around 680-700whp and would likely need mixed. Rob stated this because he thinks that is what it will take for Ultra to hit 9's.

I was just trying to clarify it's not that hard to mix and you don't need to run full E85 to get the benefits of it.

[G2K]

To me the hassle is having to use 2 credit cards every time I fill up since my bank freaks out when I use the card back to back. Having to actually go to twice the transaction is a big PITA for me. Then comes the what if i want to run 5gals for mexico nights vs filling up for everyday driving. I find myself constantly having to check, calculate and see after If i got the mix right if not (which in my case is most of the time) ANOTHER stop to the gas station to bring E% content down.