[Gunkk]

Originally Posted by HCI2000SS

Thanks for the replies! To sum it up, it sounds like disabling the AFM could only help extend the life of the torque converter correct? I understand there is really no way to comparitevly measure this, but it does sound like it produces somewhat excessive wear on the torque converter at some level

I would not use the word "excessive" as I've yet to see a report of one failing under normal use and we do have some pretty high mileage members, but any amount of AFM use will cause some non-zero wear. If you're concerned about it long term, then yes the Range AFM disabler will work to stop AFM from engaging V4 mode. Also putting the transmission into manual/paddle-mode (if equipped) will disable AFM.

https://www.amazon.com/stores/node/1...eb_12683845011

[Bumbleboy92]

Originally Posted by Gunkk

I would not use the word "excessive" as I've yet to see a report of one failing under normal use and we do have some pretty high mileage members, but any amount of AFM use will cause some non-zero wear. If you're concerned about it long term, then yes the Range AFM disabler will work to stop AFM from engaging V4 mode. Also putting the transmission into manual/paddle-mode (if equipped) will disable AFM.

https://www.amazon.com/stores/node/1...eb_12683845011

I've seen a guy on one of the FaceBook groups at 150k miles and he's had the shudder I think twice, I'm at 75k miles and I only experienced it at around 67k I'd say

[HCI2000SS]

Originally Posted by Gunkk

I would not use the word "excessive" as I've yet to see a report of one failing under normal use and we do have some pretty high mileage members, but any amount of AFM use will cause some non-zero wear. If you're concerned about it long term, then yes the Range AFM disabler will work to stop AFM from engaging V4 mode. Also putting the transmission into manual/paddle-mode (if equipped) will disable AFM.

https://www.amazon.com/stores/node/1...eb_12683845011

Yep I've heard the manual mode stops the AFM, but I just don't care to do the majority of my driving that way to be honest. So in your opinion very little of this is related to engine harmonics or something else maybe? Just the torque converter more or less?

[DIYguy]

Doesn't that mix the new Mobil 1 synthetic with the old GM non-synthetic?

Yes, of course it does.
That's why I said it is not as good as an actual flush.
However I was able to replace the great majority of the fluid, which is much better than doing nothing.
I found very small amounts of debris on the pan magnets by the way, so it was running "healthy".

I did the same thing recently on our Cruze and was able to replace about half the fluid.
In another couple weeks I will do it again so the net effect will be to replace around 75% of the original fluid.

There was another motivation for adding a Range to my car.
There definitely can be ill effects to the engine itself from the AFM due to the way it works.
So for that reason alone I will continue to run one.

[VQ35DE]

I understand that the LT1 engine has AFM on the Camaro auto and NOT on the M6. It also has it on the Corvette (C7) auto BUT does it on the Corvette M7 ?
I am not sure.

Thanks.

[craigss50]

Originally Posted by DIYguy

Yes, of course it does.
That's why I said it is not as good as an actual flush.
However I was able to replace the great majority of the fluid, which is much better than doing nothing.
I found very small amounts of debris on the pan magnets by the way, so it was running "healthy".

I did the same thing recently on our Cruze and was able to replace about half the fluid.
In another couple weeks I will do it again so the net effect will be to replace around 75% of the original fluid.

There was another motivation for adding a Range to my car.
There definitely can be ill effects to the engine itself from the AFM due to the way it works.
So for that reason alone I will continue to run one.

So I guess the two fluids are compatible. Which is really the question I was trying to convey. Obviously they are since you have done it to your other vehicle.

[HCI2000SS]

Now here is another question concerning the range device....Over the long term (I'm talking years, not just months) is there any negative effects? Obviously GM has spent some time and considerable money on designing and implementing AFM, so I wonder if it possibly messes with something over the long haul. Might be tough to find an answer to this one I'm thinking

[caSStro18]

Originally Posted by HCI2000SS

Now here is another question concerning the range device....Over the long term (I'm talking years, not just months) is there any negative effects? Obviously GM has spent some time and considerable money on designing and implementing AFM, so I wonder if it possibly messes with something over the long haul. Might be tough to find an answer to this one I'm thinking

On longer trips I take my Range device out and let the AFM system work. Around town, when the V4 mode would do little good, I think running in only V8 mode is better on the tranny. I am one of the ones who can hear and feel the switching between the two modes. But, like you said, proving advantages and disadvantages over the long term might not be easy.

[Gunkk]

Originally Posted by HCI2000SS

Yep I've heard the manual mode stops the AFM, but I just don't care to do the majority of my driving that way to be honest. So in your opinion very little of this is related to engine harmonics or something else maybe? Just the torque converter more or less?

IMO, the torque transients definitely come from the engine. The purpose of the slipping clutches is to minimize the NVH felt in the cabin.

FWIW, the C8 also implemented similar slipping wet clutches in the Tremec DCT for the same reason for its AFM... so we shall see how well it holds up in the new DCT.

[HCI2000SS]

Originally Posted by Gunkk

IMO, the torque transients definitely come from the engine. The purpose of the slipping clutches is to minimize the NVH felt in the cabin.

FWIW, the C8 also implemented similar slipping wet clutches in the Tremec DCT for the same reason for its AFM... so we shall see how well it holds up in the new DCT.

Gotcha. If I can find one of these range devices at a good price I'm gonna try it I think. Sounds like the pros far outweigh the cons. Thanks for all your feedback on the subject

[HCI2000SS]

Originally Posted by caSStro18

On longer trips I take my Range device out and let the AFM system work. Around town, when the V4 mode would do little good, I think running in only V8 mode is better on the tranny. I am one of the ones who can hear and feel the switching between the two modes. But, like you said, proving advantages and disadvantages over the long term might not be easy.

I definitely feel mine, but really can't hear it to be honest. For me I just want to leave it plugged in at all times. Otherwise it's not worth it to me.

[KingLT1]

TCC slip tables are the culprit. They are there smooth the transition to and from V4. The combination of wrong fluid and TCC programming are the culprit. Long as you don't feel shudder then no damage is being done. So the range shouldn't cause any problems long-term. It's the excessive shuddering that eventually compromises the converter clutches to the point that anything other then replacing the converter is a band-aid.

[DIYguy]

So I guess the two fluids are compatible.

Yes they are compatible.

Of course the more of the original fluid you can replace, the better.
But even with an actual flush, there may some residual fluid left in the converter that just won't come out until you drive it around and then do it at least one more time.
That is the theory behind replacing all I could in the Cruze, driving it for a few hundred miles so that the old and new fluids mix thoroughly, then doing it again.
This two-step process has been described on other forums such as Cruzetalk.

FWIW, for the newer (blue label) fluid apparently they did something to reduce its tendency to absorb moisture, if that is any clue.
Which makes me wonder if the atmospheric vent tube at the top of the transmission case could be fitted with a dessicant container or at least a much longer hose.
The idea would be to try and prevent moisture from getting in to begin with as the case "breathes" due to temperature changes.
It's a thought anyway........

I forgot to mention earlier that on my car at least there was no mode, no setting, no combination, where it would not go into V4 mode.
Only the Range has prevented it from happening.
The Range or the Diablo (a similar device) are definitely a bit pricey but when compared to the potential cost of damage to the engine or transmission, they are positively cheap at the price.
There are loads of testimonials for them for other vehicles (mainly trucks) that share these engines and transmissions too, so it it not just Camaros.

I have had no issues whatsoever with mine.
No codes, no weird behavior, nothing.
It has been connected as my car sat in the garage as long as 10-12 days while I was out of town and it started right up.
So the battery drain concerns that were reported for earlier versions of it appear to be resolved now.

To KingLT1's point, yes once the damage is done it is too late.
Better to prevent (or dramatically postpone) it from happening in the first place for as long as possible.
And don't forget that the AFM works at least in part by collapsing lifters for the affected cylinders which may or may not pump back up again when needed (think $$$$$$$$ to repair).

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by VQ35DE

I understand that the LT1 engine has AFM on the Camaro auto and NOT on the M6. It also has it on the Corvette (C7) auto BUT does it on the Corvette M7 ?
I am not sure.

Thanks.

AFM primarily exists in Camaro and Corvette to avoid the GG Tax with the automatics. My Chevy SS (sedan) had the LS3 and no AFM. I believe the GG Tax was $1,500.

In others, V6 and L4s it's simply there for FE. The new 2.0 and 2.7L Turbo L4s have a sliding cam mechanism for full, mid and no power. V6s will slip into a 3 cylinder mode. the 3.6L in my LaCrosse does that seamlessly.

Of course now that GM will have 3 cylinder turbos in the upcoming Trailblazer and Encore GX...……...not sure how many cylinders you can drop. LOL