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Old 08-22-2019, 09:06 AM   #29
HouseStark
 
Drives: 2018 Camaro SS 1LE
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whocares05050 View Post
It wont matter how much money you spend or what products you purchase if you do not properly wash your cars. Swirls are only formed from either poor washing methods or dirty microfiver pads / rags.

I use a 2 bucket method, microfiber large wash mitt, foam canon, pre-soak, and in addition to using wash soap in bucket I also spray the foam cannon in front of my mitt. I never wash in circles, never apply any pressure over the natural weight on the wash mitt, and I am sure to ALWAYS use edgeless microfibers and follow proper washing and drying methods when cleaning them.

It also helps that I live a couple miles from auto geek and stop by all the time.

Get back to the basics and watch a ton of videos on youtube.

After 1 yr of ownership and 5 washes a month, I have zero swirls in my paint....

I do all of those methods and use all of those products all by Adam's. Wash and apply product as described by Adams. Now my car is black which maybe that's why it's so apparent to me but yeah idk
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Old 08-22-2019, 09:14 AM   #30
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Ok, let's change gears here. Clearly there is no one time fix all solution for swirls and water spots regardless of ceramic coating or anything else. Car will need to be buffed periodically every year or other year. Educate me on buffers and compounds.

Off the top of my head Rupes buffer and sealant, wax, buffer applied compounds?
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Old 08-22-2019, 09:26 AM   #31
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If you enjoy the "exercise", why not?

I like Glen's words of wisdom. I used to participate in the detailing rat race, until I realized most of these "new" products are promoted heavily and are really more of the same.

Now I wash every two weeks, use some turtle wax or megs hybrid ceramic wax, and done. Cars look good 80% of the time, and I'm OK with that.
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Old 08-22-2019, 09:28 AM   #32
Silveradoss573
 
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Originally Posted by Smokin19 View Post
Man, all I use is Maquires Tech 2.0 wax and have NO swirls, with an absolute great shine. I have clear bra on the entire front, don't know if that makes a difference. You guys are killing me with all these layers of products you use.

Same here, just reading what all people do on a regular basis has me worn out. All my details and cleaning products are all from the local parts stores.

OP instead of using a towel or microfiber cloth to dry the car, maybe consider using a synthetic chamois if you haven't? I've also found for myself that microfiber cloths have a very limited lifetime before they become just another rag. Yes washing them help some but once dirt particles get in the fibers, they are they're pretty much there to stay. Also make sure after washing the microfiber cloths (if you do wash them) that you only run them through the dryer at a low setting. I currently have 2 big bags of brand new microfiber cloths and I go through them really fast when applying detail spray and even faster with polish or wax. I've tried washing even slightly used cloths but they never feel the same afterwards.
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Old 08-22-2019, 09:31 AM   #33
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Find a good detailer and pay a pro to polish /paint-correct your car once a year. Worth the money to some, especially considering all the tools you won't need to buy, store and use correctly.

For drying the car, I bought a 30$ leaf blower recently. Works good if you have TW seal & shine or megs HCW or similar products on the car. I used drying towels that were great, but too much work compared to a blower. Now I use the towel to finish up.
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Old 08-22-2019, 09:45 AM   #34
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A lot of good info in this thread. My camaro is black also and after purchasing it pre-owned, it already had tons of swirls from autowashes or something. I decided to go the DIY route following instructional videos on YouTube. As KirkH said, it is very satisfying doing it yourself and seeing the results, even if it is a 60% improvement.


AmmoNYC on YouTube is fantastic to learn about black paint, among others like dallas paint correction.


This is one of the best videos for black paint. You might have already come across AMMONYC, but just in case, here is the video.


https://youtube.com/watch?v=MQ_0M81_grU


I also have spent over $200 in products in less than a year. Now i have calmed down,. After learning from different videos and the forum.
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Old 08-22-2019, 10:44 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by HouseStark View Post
I guess I'm confused. Yeah it has to be me applying the swirls but at the same time how else am I suppose to clean my car? I use the absolute best/softest towels Adam's offers for each application. There's a towel for drying, applying the sealant, applying the wax like what else is there to do.

Also if you still have to worry about water spotting and swirls then why spend all the money for Ceramic Coating. What is the benefit then and what is it's purpose.....seriously asking.
Almost 100% it's your microfiber towels. I've found they are VERY difficult to clean even with Chem Bros Microfiber wash. I've been getting better results recently from presoaking them w/ the wash in a bucket of hot water then laundering using hot water, and even then the cloth needs to be moistened with either water or the product you're using.

Maybe someone here can explain how to keep them like-new, but ime it's simply impossible.

Try finding or buying some scrap black plastic, ideally black plexiglass. This stuff will scratch no matter what cloth you use, it's amazing... but it will give you an idea of how bad used microfiber cloths can get and you can test and see how bad you're scratching your paint. I think you'll be surprised how abrasive used cloths can get!


Also, ceramic is worth it because the products are super-easy to apply, or very long lasting if the application is more like a regular wax. The Carpro Hydro2foam is super easy to apply with almost no extra wiping on the car required, and it hoses off. It repels dirt so the car stays much cleaner and when you do wash it most of the dirt rinses right off, so there is much less dirt stuck to the car. And it looks amazing, so glossy and slick-feeling.

While you get a sense of accomplishment from the work and rubbing required for older wax based products, my body doesn't really like it and the ceramic sealers are better.
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Old 08-22-2019, 02:43 PM   #36
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Here ya go. Here's a deal at McKees37 that would be perfect.

https://www.mckees37.com/7424-6.html
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Old 08-22-2019, 09:41 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HouseStark View Post
I do all of those methods and use all of those products all by Adam's. Wash and apply product as described by Adams. Now my car is black which maybe that's why it's so apparent to me but yeah idk
Rule #1 in car care is The Museum Rule: The less you touch a thing, the longer it lasts. The more you touch the paint, the more defects you will put in the paint.


Black paint is ridiculous for showing every tiny little defect that you would never see on white, yellow, silver, or red unless you looked real hard... or owned the car

My first car was black. Never again without paint protection.

The ONLY way to keep a black car swirl free is self-healing PPF. The PPF is the thing that keeps you from touching the car. You touch the film, you wash the film, you dry the film and you put defects and swirls in the film. Then the film self heals and the swirls disappear.

My Z isn’t black but my heat extractor (and the rest of the trim) is painted mosaic black metallic. It was corrected (polished) right after purchase and Suntek Ultra self healing film applied. Two years later there are no swirls. Zero. It’s still perfect. No need to polish it, ever.

Adding a durable hydrophobic to the film just makes cleaning the car easier. Got caught in the rain last week. Got out the blower when I arrived home and got all the water off, didn’t even need to rinse with the hose. No towel needed or used. Completely dry from the blower and no water spots on the car the next day.

You can go buy all kinds of fancy polishes and waxes and this and thats, but the more you touch and wipe and wipe and wipe, the more defects you’re going to get.

If you can find a solution that allows you to keep the car clean without having to touch the car (much) and never puts defects into the paint, it will look perfect for years.

My solution works for me and The Mistress continually amazes people at shows who think I just bought the car. Nope... she’s 25 months old and gets washed maybe once every six to eight weeks. These shots are old but trust me she still looks just the same.

https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showp...&postcount=301


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Old 08-23-2019, 09:58 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by DaveC113 View Post
I just tried Carpro Hydro2foam: diluted 10:1, spray on just-washed car, wipe, hose-off, dry. Done. I can't see the need for anything else.

For paint correction, I pay a shop for a simple polish. Don't see the need to try to flatten the orange peel.

PPF is necessary in some places as well imo.
Hydro2foam is great stuff. I use that on my wifes DD once a month and it looks as good as a ceramic coating I used to apply. I also give it a quick spray down with Duragloss after every other wash and her car beads and repels water like crazy.
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Old 08-23-2019, 03:35 PM   #39
HouseStark
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mano_camaro View Post
A lot of good info in this thread. My camaro is black also and after purchasing it pre-owned, it already had tons of swirls from autowashes or something. I decided to go the DIY route following instructional videos on YouTube. As KirkH said, it is very satisfying doing it yourself and seeing the results, even if it is a 60% improvement.


AmmoNYC on YouTube is fantastic to learn about black paint, among others like dallas paint correction.


This is one of the best videos for black paint. You might have already come across AMMONYC, but just in case, here is the video.


https://youtube.com/watch?v=MQ_0M81_grU


I also have spent over $200 in products in less than a year. Now i have calmed down,. After learning from different videos and the forum.
That is so funny your referenced NYC because as I was reading the first part of your post I was going to recommend the same to you. His videos are great and his products from what I hear are too. I was going to get his stuff but it’s pricey and not always available.

I think maybe I need to get better at it. Always room for improvement but I think if there’s anything I learned from this thread is that ceramic coating is not the answer......a quality buffer and polish is
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Old 08-23-2019, 03:37 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunkk View Post
Rule #1 in car care is The Museum Rule: The less you touch a thing, the longer it lasts. The more you touch the paint, the more defects you will put in the paint.


Black paint is ridiculous for showing every tiny little defect that you would never see on white, yellow, silver, or red unless you looked real hard... or owned the car

My first car was black. Never again without paint protection.

The ONLY way to keep a black car swirl free is self-healing PPF. The PPF is the thing that keeps you from touching the car. You touch the film, you wash the film, you dry the film and you put defects and swirls in the film. Then the film self heals and the swirls disappear.

My Z isn’t black but my heat extractor (and the rest of the trim) is painted mosaic black metallic. It was corrected (polished) right after purchase and Suntek Ultra self healing film applied. Two years later there are no swirls. Zero. It’s still perfect. No need to polish it, ever.

Adding a durable hydrophobic to the film just makes cleaning the car easier. Got caught in the rain last week. Got out the blower when I arrived home and got all the water off, didn’t even need to rinse with the hose. No towel needed or used. Completely dry from the blower and no water spots on the car the next day.

You can go buy all kinds of fancy polishes and waxes and this and thats, but the more you touch and wipe and wipe and wipe, the more defects you’re going to get.

If you can find a solution that allows you to keep the car clean without having to touch the car (much) and never puts defects into the paint, it will look perfect for years.

My solution works for me and The Mistress continually amazes people at shows who think I just bought the car. Nope... she’s 25 months old and gets washed maybe once every six to eight weeks. These shots are old but trust me she still looks just the same.

https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showp...&postcount=301


It does look amazing. So PPF is basically the same thing as Xpel? If you don’t mind me asking how much did that all cost you including the Gtechniq stuff?

For reference I was quoted 800 for single stage paint correction and 5400 for Xpel on the whole car.
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Old 08-23-2019, 05:12 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HouseStark View Post
It does look amazing. So PPF is basically the same thing as Xpel? If you don’t mind me asking how much did that all cost you including the Gtechniq stuff?

For reference I was quoted 800 for single stage paint correction and 5400 for Xpel on the whole car.
Xpel, like Suntek and 3M, is a brand of Paint protection film (PPF). Each brand has multiple grades. $6k for the whole car isn’t bad as long as it’s Xpel Ultimate self healing film and isn’t their stock patterns. Patterns need to be oversized and wrapped so you don’t have visible seams.

Mine was $5k but wasn’t whole car PPF (was full front, mirrors, windshield surround, mirrors, rockers, rear lowers with all edges tucked and wrapped and emblems removed), and included that price was a full car paint correction (easy for him since it was new), Gtechniq ceramic coat and two coats of Gtechniq EXO.

If I were to do it again, I’d do the ceramic only on the grille and wheels, and spend my $ instead to film the whole car. EXO for everything of course. The stuff is magic and lasts a LONG time.

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Old 08-23-2019, 06:01 PM   #42
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What happends if you spent $5000+ on coatings, then someone hits you and they total out your car. I bet their insurance company (if they even have insurance) won't pay for your new car to get it. I just got my front repainted and the grill replaced, I though a long time about how I just have to get PPF, but I don't trust that it will actually protect it. I have to drive on the highway everyday, all of the hours and manual effort i've spent with waxing, polishing, claying, and compounding I havent noticed any benefits besides the car looking good until it rains. Its so frustrating how many times I've waxed and bought in to the "protection" and "water beading" effects. I've noticed absolutely no protection from anything.

If you drive on the highway your car is runied
If you drive in the rain your car is runined
If you (or are forced to) drive on a road that is milled your car is ruined

It just makes you want to give up when you realize just how fragile your car is. I think the better strategy is to try and cover up and mask the defects and micro scratches, it is just way too much effort and money to try to remove them.

I think my strategy now that I have $3000 plus of work will be to stay far away from any other cars especially on the highway, I think this will be way more effective problem is it may be the hardest thing to do haha

Last edited by cmitchell17; 08-23-2019 at 06:33 PM.
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