[apexit53]

As much as i wish i could have bought a new 1Le i cant complain with being nationaly competitive. The 1LE can be competitive locally sure, but you go to nationals an you will get curb-stomped pretty bad. I think the highest 1LE this year was 10th?? not bad, i dont mid an underdog fight myself, in fact im in one(damn M3) but i know my car can win. The turbo camaro is in a similar situation with some cars that will probably be moving to DS next year. Persoanlly I think the camaro is the one to buy in DS as much as id like a type R.

[Chris V]

Originally Posted by JRL1LE

From Chris V on this form:

" A great CAMC car would be a 1LE on 305s with camber, DSC, and Diff Cal, in my opinion. "

DCS Controller $1,300, E Diff Cal $350, Camber Plates $525

Yup, and it's a killer track and street car. Need to budget for 19s to run the 305s though.

Originally Posted by MatthewAMEL

The last two years the Camaros that won CAM-C have had at least $10k in mods. That assigns no value to all the work the team did in Paddock/Grid in tuning the PTM.



Just the DSSV kit that the SS 1LE and the T4 1LE ran is $6.5k (parts only).
(dampers, ZL1 1LE suspension swap, kit to eliminate codes from deleted MRC). Don't forget the E85, tune, FlexFuel kit, intake and exhaust.



AS is MUCH cheaper than building a Nationally competitive CAM-C 6th Gen.


ChrisV posted this over on the thread about the T4 1LE winning Nats.
"The setup is ZL1 1LE wheels, 305 stones, dssv’s, a tune, ethanol, intake and exhaust." <-$10k

I think you can build a CAM-C winning 4 cylinder for the price of a stock 1LE. DSSVs are the parts bin option for the GM guys, but you could run MCS for less money, and have more adjustability to dial in the car. $30k car + $10k parts budget (spin your own wrenches of course) vs. a $40k car. I'd rather own the SS 1LE, but if I were building from scratch to just autocross, a 4 cylinder Camaro in CAMC makes a lot of sense.

[Cito]

Its not necessarily comparing apples to apples because the courses change with weather, rubber buildup, etc., but the dry (If FS was dry) times on the west course at nationals are amazingly similar for the AS, DS, and FS camaros. Listed the fastest times and the mean (average) times. Obviously, there are a lot of potential pitfalls with reviewing statistics like this, but I think it is of some interest to review.



AS SS 1LE

Shumaker 62.660
Tabor 66.577 (+1)
Fast time = 62.660

Mean= 64.6185



DS 2.0t (in final overall order)

Scroggs 62.478
Vajdak 63.874
Britton 62.497
Baker 63.606
Henry 64.262
Finch 62.304
Caplan 63.538
Salisbury 65.020
Wetzel 68.815
Baker 66.250
Luther 68.399
Staples 68.602
Fast time = 62.304

Mean= 64.970



FS
Leeder 62.611
Wong 62.321
Mitchell 63.241
Palmblad 63.924
Colantuono 64.341
Renson 64.219
Bakken 63.434
Poole 64.405
Burke 64.676
Lamontagne 64.820
Fast time = 62.321

Mean= 63.799

[apexit53]

Originally Posted by Cito

Its not necessarily comparing apples to apples because the courses change with weather, rubber buildup, etc., but the dry (If FS was dry) times on the west course at nationals are amazingly similar for the AS, DS, and FS camaros. Listed the fastest times and the mean (average) times. Obviously, there are a lot of potential pitfalls with reviewing statistics like this, but I think it is of some interest to review.



AS SS 1LE

Shumaker 62.660
Tabor 66.577 (+1)
Fast time = 62.660

Mean= 64.6185



DS 2.0t (in final overall order)

Scroggs 62.478
Vajdak 63.874
Britton 62.497
Baker 63.606
Henry 64.262
Finch 62.304
Caplan 63.538
Salisbury 65.020
Wetzel 68.815
Baker 66.250
Luther 68.399
Staples 68.602
Fast time = 62.304

Mean= 64.970



FS
Leeder 62.611
Wong 62.321
Mitchell 63.241
Palmblad 63.924
Colantuono 64.341
Renson 64.219
Bakken 63.434
Poole 64.405
Burke 64.676
Lamontagne 64.820
Fast time = 62.321

Mean= 63.799

I did have a 62.010 on my last run but a cone or two... dumb cones also lol

FS was dry ish. slight haze but th course was not wet at all. Its not uncommon for DS to rawtime FS as pax wise they should be.

[Cito]

I knew you, Mike Leeder, had that fast raw time. I almost included it, but then thought maybe I should include it for all of the drivers if there was a faster raw versus final time. With laziness in mind, I took the route of not including raw times. Median times would have been nice too.

[apexit53]

Originally Posted by Cito

I knew you, Mike Leeder, had that fast raw time. I almost included it, but then thought maybe I should include it for all of the drivers if there was a faster raw versus final time. With laziness in mind, I took the route of not including raw times. Median times would have been nice too.

Hah no worries. finding that info and putting it in was awesome and hard enough!

[EWard]

Thanks Cito for compiling the list! Lost out on a promotion at work that I thought was in the bag (hard feelings about that). I don't want a new car to affect my lifestyle, so going to have to bite the bullet and get a 4t. Can get a certified 2017 base grey Lt with 17k miles for 19k local. Looks like this is my future, thanks for all of the insight.

[Chris V]

You can probably do about that on a new one. That’s too much for a car with 17k miles.

[trophy hunter]

I think that is a great, logical decision. As stated before, it is very competitive in the stock class and I also think that you'll have a lot of fun with it. On your comment about the car you were looking at, though, I would suggest doing more research.

Originally Posted by Chris V

You can probably do about that on a new one. That’s too much for a car with 17k miles.

I agree..... if you're looking into the 4T, look around - they're trying to unload old inventory since the 2019's are out and you can find brand new 2018's with a manual for $19K.
You might have to drive a little out of your way but the upside is no prior owner
…….keep in mind, I live in Texas and the expression "a little out of your way" can mean a 3-4 hour drive.

[apexit53]

Yeah you should be able to find some new 4t pretty cheap!

What trim level are you looking for? I would suggest the LS if you can! According to a few gm engineers I've talked to the LS has stiffer shocks from th factory then an LT.

Main reason is the LT has 20" wheels so I believe it needs softer shocks for ride comfort. Where as the LS has 18"?? I think. Larger tire better compliance through that.

Just an idea.

[EWard]

Thanks for the encouragement guys, I will work harder on a new car deal. Will put out some 19k offers and see what I get. Would be nice to get a few a autocross events in before the season is over in November.

[EWard]

Mike what cars to you anticipate moving to DS?

The Civic R is tough and local GS nationals driver is moving to the R, have a lot to learn and that will be a good barometer on lap times.

[apexit53]

Originally Posted by EWard

Mike what cars to you anticipate moving to DS?

The Civic R is tough and local GS nationals driver is moving to the R, have a lot to learn and that will be a good barometer on lap times.

It sucks loosing but never shy away from a class because of a fast driver. If you want to be the best you have to race the best! it can only make you faster! Just dont get discouraged!

So DS moves according to fastrack was

focus RS 2016-2017(2018 has a rear diff added and will stay in BS)
subaru sti
mitsu evo

The camaro turbo 1LE might be in DS also, its up for a vote right now so who knows.

I think there was something else as well.

[race2win]

Hey guys, it's been a while since I've visited the site, but I plan to be more involved with this community in the coming year.

Like Mike mentioned, there is a proposal to move the AWD cars currently classed in BS to DS...16-17 Focus RS, all Evos and STI's, Audi TTs, etc. The Mazda RX8 and Nissan 350Z are also proposed to move from CS>DS, although the RX8 is unlikely to happen.

I believe the SAC has decided on the proposal, but it won't be published until the Nov Fastrack which will come out in Oct.

The 1LE 2.0T should also be classed at the same time, when SAC members asked me I suggested DS because I don't really think it will be significantly better than the base car. It will likely be ~75-100 lbs heavier, and the staggered wheel sizes do more to hurt balance than help IMO.

To the OP, while the saying "there's no substitute for cubic inches" is certainly true, I have truly enjoyed owning my 2.0T. I don't daily drive it, but easily could as it's super livable, gets good MPG, and is quicker than almost every Camaro built before 2002 The best part is how it handles though, it truly is better than the sum of it's parts!

I will update the DS thread soon, plans are to test shocks and a front bar this winter